Tomlin

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  • Northern_Blitz
    Legend
    • Dec 2008
    • 23985

    Originally posted by whatever
    The OL should have been addressed last year and qb should be this year.
    Why do you think we should address QB this year? I just don't see how we can do that effectively.

    That QB won't play this year because Ben will start (and I think it's unlikely we sit him unless he's absolutely terrible).

    So that wastes at least 1 of the 4 rookie contract years.

    Then next year we've piled up more dead money than we had this year with Ben (and we may pile up more still if we want to add another UFA).

    So we'd have the 2nd year of the rookie contract with one hand tied behind our backs with the cap.

    Plus, our pick this year won't be high enough to draft one of the top 3 QBs, maybe not not of the top 5. That feels like another Mason Rudolph level talent. Doesn't seem like a great idea to me.

    And trading up would require lots of draft capital and leave open a bunch of other needs (like LT and C).

    Franchise QBs don't fall from the sky. You don't get one just because you want one (ask a fan of the Bills or Browns). You usually have to (1) be bad enough to draft high and (2) lucky enough that the guy you draft pans out (because QBs are notoriously hard to scout).

    So it's easy to say "we should address QB this year", but doing it in practice in a way that sets us up for future success seems like a really low probability outcome IMO.

    I think brining Ben back means we'll be in a similar situation next year. Trapped in the "Bills zone" where we're not good enough to be truly competitive and not bad enough to draft a QB with a good chance of being above average to elite. Then if we reach for a QB next season (which I'm afraid we'll do), we'll get the equivalent of Tyrod Taylor.

    Comment

    • NorthCoast
      Legend
      • Sep 2008
      • 26224

      Originally posted by whatever
      The OL should have been addressed last year and qb should be this year.
      The OL wasn't a disaster going into last season. Just needed to replace Foster and look for future starters in the draft. There was some questions about whether AV would be playing his final season but even that didn't come to pass. They nabbed Dotson. Could have argued drafting a center or LT as well. But at their first pick I didn't see anyone worth it. Plus the general feeling was Roethlisberger could make the line look OK with some quick passing. Just didn't realize how badly the run game would drop as part of that strategy. And just to give you a heads up, I don't think everything will get addressed this season either. But I'm excited for the stage being set for the post-Roethlisberger era.

      Comment

      • Northern_Blitz
        Legend
        • Dec 2008
        • 23985

        Originally posted by NorthCoast
        The OL wasn't a disaster going into last season. Just needed to replace Foster and look for future starters in the draft. There was some questions about whether AV would be playing his final season but even that didn't come to pass. They nabbed Dotson. Could have argued drafting a center or LT as well. But at their first pick I didn't see anyone worth it. Plus the general feeling was Roethlisberger could make the line look OK with some quick passing. Just didn't realize how badly the run game would drop as part of that strategy. And just to give you a heads up, I don't think everything will get addressed this season either. But I'm excited for the stage being set for the post-Roethlisberger era.
        And we don't seem to have missed with the 1st or 2nd or 3rd pick (which was an OL in Dotson).

        And our 4th - 6th picks all got into games too.

        Not bad at all considering we didn't have a 1st round pick and the off season was not as involved as usual.

        Comment

        • feltdizz
          Legend
          • May 2008
          • 27222

          v
          Originally posted by hawaiiansteel
          yeah, I'm sure you were totally okay with Bill Cowher when he went 7-9 and 6-10 in '98 and '99 and then went 6-10 again in 2003.

          and you never questioned his philosophy of trying to win a Super Bowl without a franchise QB.

          because you're not the kind of guy who questions head coaches when they go 10+ years without winning a Super Bowl.

          got it.
          but Cowher built those teams with his bare hands!!

          See, these guys make sure they cover all the bases. Its okay to not win a SB for 14 years IF you have built your team from scratch.

          Tomlin was supposed to win 6 or 7 with Ben because...

          Ben is Lord!!!
          Steelers 27
          Rats 16

          Comment

          • BURGH86STEEL
            Legend
            • May 2008
            • 6908

            Originally posted by whatever
            HasnÂ’t the running game been an issue for years?
            So the hand he was dealt was his own doing.
            The OC he picked?
            The declining OL which has been ignored.
            The Steelers dealt their own hand as an organization. Tomlin chose the OC because he had a good working relationship with Ben. It made sense. Good working relationships are important. I suspect that's one reason why Canada was hired.

            I thought the Steelers had some success running the ball early in the 2020 season. I think several things happened that derailed the run game. The worst part of the run game was they couldn't line up and gain a yard.

            In an ideal world the Steelers would be able to transition seamlessly from the starters they pay top dollar to have future starters waiting in the wings. We all know that's not a realistic expectation with the draft, free agency, and salary capp.

            Comment

            • BURGH86STEEL
              Legend
              • May 2008
              • 6908

              Originally posted by feltdizz
              but Cowher built those teams with his bare hands!!

              See, these guys make sure they cover all the bases. Its okay to not win a SB for 14 years IF you have built your team from scratch.

              Tomlin was supposed to win 6 or 7 with Ben because...

              Ben is Lord!!!
              I think the Steelers got their money's worth out of Ben. Multiple winning seasons, several playoff appearances, 3 Super bowl appearances. Outside of Brady and Manning I don't believe there's been a QB that's played in as many Superbowls in this era. It's one reason why they gave him a chance to come back.

              I think NE's success has skewed some fan's views. NE success will probably never be match again.

              Comment

              • hawaiiansteel
                Legend
                • May 2008
                • 35314

                Originally posted by Steel Maniac
                please stop making up stuff about what I said. I predicted he'd be on the hot seat last year, and he is. And I'm predicting THIS will be his last year.
                guess we can add this to the very long list of incorrect predictions you have made.

                Comment

                • feltdizz
                  Legend
                  • May 2008
                  • 27222

                  Originally posted by hawaiiansteel
                  guess we can add this to the very long list of incorrect predictions you have made.
                  Its always next year..

                  I’m sure that worked with the ladies back in the day.. lol.

                  “next year baby!!!”
                  Steelers 27
                  Rats 16

                  Comment

                  • Steel Maniac
                    Banned
                    • Apr 2017
                    • 19472

                    Originally posted by hawaiiansteel
                    guess we can add this to the very long list of incorrect predictions you have made.
                    You should charge me rent because I live in your head! I’m right waaaaaaaay more than I’ve been wrong.

                    So he’s still here? It’s not a thing to celebrate because it means we’ll never be winning anything.

                    I also said 4 years ago , “ The Steelers will never win a chip again with Tomlin as head coach”. How’s that looking?

                    Comment

                    • NorthCoast
                      Legend
                      • Sep 2008
                      • 26224

                      Originally posted by feltdizz
                      Its always next year..

                      I’m sure that worked with the ladies back in the day.. lol.

                      “next year baby!!!”
                      Like the sign on Joe's Crabshack... 50% of all Crab Legs...tomorrow!

                      Comment

                      • Steel Maniac
                        Banned
                        • Apr 2017
                        • 19472

                        Originally posted by feltdizz
                        Its always next year..

                        I’m sure that worked with the ladies back in the day.. lol.

                        “next year baby!!!”
                        You should talk ! After how all your Leveon Bell predictions blew up in your face!!

                        Comment

                        • hawaiiansteel
                          Legend
                          • May 2008
                          • 35314

                          Originally posted by Steel Maniac
                          Whatever views any of us have , we will find out who’s right and who’s wrong over the next 3 years.
                          way to go out on a limb there, you love to play the field and then claim you were right.

                          including this year and the 3 Tomlin was extended, at the minimum 28 out of 32 (0.875%) of NFL teams won't win the Super Bowl.

                          Comment

                          • Steel Maniac
                            Banned
                            • Apr 2017
                            • 19472

                            Originally posted by hawaiiansteel
                            way to go out on a limb there, you love to play the field and then claim you were right.

                            including this year and the 3 Tomlin was extended, at the minimum 28 out of 32 (0.875%) of NFL teams won't win the Super Bowl.
                            We had stacked team’s 4 years ago. We were always predicted to be one of the teams in the conference championship game. So stop insulting people’s intelligence. Everybody here knows how good we were 4-5 years ago with Ben, AB and Bell.

                            Comment

                            • hawaiiansteel
                              Legend
                              • May 2008
                              • 35314

                              Originally posted by Steel Maniac
                              *** They havn't won anything since Shula because they waited too long to fire him.
                              do you realize how ridiculous this statement sounds? I have to laugh every time I see your sig.

                              it's been 26 years since Don Shula retired, and they haven't sniffed even being in a Super Bowl.

                              you should have used an example of where a team fired their HC and you know, actually won a Super Bowl afterwards.

                              Comment

                              • NJ-STEELER
                                Legend
                                • May 2008
                                • 12563

                                Originally posted by Northern_Blitz
                                This is the truth IMO.

                                Tomlin will look good if they find a QB who's at least average and we can put a great team around him with all the extra cap space that a rookie QB contract provides.

                                He will look bad if the QB we get is below to well below average because you basically can't win in the NFL with guys like that.

                                Given that Tomlin has coached teams that pretty consistently competitive while paying a QB a market level deal most of his career, I think we'll be OK if we can find an OK guy.

                                That's why I really wanted this to be our sacrificial tank year. I don't think we'll compete anyway. And I am very worried that we finish with something like the 18th - 20th pick and we try to skip the bad year next year by reaching for a QB that's not good or giving up way to much to trade up. Then we're stuck with a sub-par QB for 4 years and we waste TJ and Minkah's primes.
                                wouldn't the owner/gm of the team ask the coach for his opinion on whether to bring ben back?
                                especially someone with so many years as coach.
                                he's the one that has to coach him / develop a game plan for the team.
                                do you think he objected to it but was overridden on the decision?

                                was this not a perfect time to cut him if he thought ben was done?
                                - high cap hit
                                cut ben and can try to keep bud and have most of the starters come back

                                - 1st round grade QB with the team now for 3 years.
                                some have said he played much better then ben in week 17. if he isn't ready now, will he ever be

                                Comment

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