The Too Early 2018 QB talk

[Shawn]

would be interested to hear ktrains and shawns thoughts on josh allen and where he might land

i know he didnt have a great year, but looks to have all of the tools

I had to pull up tape and stats on this kid. I had never seen him play. The guy is big, athletic and has a cannon for an arm. Not sure I've seen that combo in awhile. I would call him a pure RAW talent who will get drafted much higher than he should. The guy is erratic, makes alot of poor decisions, and faltered against better Ds. He is a developmental project who I have a late second round grade on. I bet he slips into the first because some team will fall in love with that tremendous arm talent, athleticism and size combo. IMO, he needs 2-3 seasons of grooming before he should sniff a field. I wouldn't touch him in the first. If he is sitting there in the second...I would consider him.

[RuthlessBurgher]

Undergrad QB's Josh Rosen and Sam Darnold both officially declared for the draft today.

[steelerkeylargo]

Yeah yeah...way too early Shawn, lets focus on winning a SB first. Ok, with that out of the way, I wanted to discuss QBs, as I think if a quality NFL falls to the Steelers they draft one in the first round. The three realistic QBs who could fall to the Steelers...

1) Lamar Jackson- I truly love this kid. I think he is a dynamic playmaker who has unfairly shouldered most of the UL O. He is an amazing athlete, huge arm and reminds me of Michael Vick. The Steelers fall over themselves to the podium to draft him if he falls the Steelers.

2) Baker Mayfield-Overrated passer with an average arm, poor footwork and a bad attitude. Reminds me of a lesser athletic version of Manziel with all the baggage. IMO, he is a third round prosect who has some upside if he can mature. I would stay away.

3) Drew Lock-I think this guy has serious upside. Big arm, pocket presence and has the tools to make all the throws. He is raw, needs to imrove on accuracy. Reminds me a bit of Jay Cutler. If he falls to the second, I say take the chance.

Thoughts

Shawn I could not disagree more on Mayfield. He is hands down the best QB in this class. I have watched every snap he's taken at OU..Elite arm talent with incredible accuracy. Not to mention the personality that his teammates will walk through hell for. He has had some questionable antics but at the end of the day he is the anti Landry Jones. You want this kid wearing Black and Gold. Having said that, the point is moot. He will be a top 10 draft choice. I'll bet the farm on that.

[Shoe]

Cousins also has 25% of the talent around him that Ben has

He would thrive with us

Agreed. He would be a top 10 QB, which is all you can really hope for of any QB you would draft anyway.

Now, as far as those guys mentioned, I would not take Mayfield. History says that:
1) he is impulsive, probably one of the worst traits of a QB. Its why I never liked Jameis, Johnny, etc. Add to that a massive sense of entitlement, and you have quite the potential problem when you suddenly give the guy $30m or whatever first round picks get these days.

2) puffy bodied guys. Or really any yoked, chiseled bodies. It doesn't translate. But think of QBs, and name one in history who had that buff guy, puffy armed physique. You can't name one.

As for Lamar Jackson, I also pass on him for no other reason than that he is too athletic. How that translates is that they never have to really plant that foot, throw to a spot, and use high-level NFL QB skills where anticipation is required. The reason? They know, in the back of their mind, that they can always tuck and run.

For the rest of them, Rosen is the best to me. (Haven't seen Allen, so I can't add him.) Darnold also fits the mold of a bigger Mayfield. Mayfield is a Bubby Brister or Billy Joe Tolliver, who just slings the ball and looks the part, but doesn't protect the ball well. They look good when they're good though.

[Shawn]

Shawn I could not disagree more on Mayfield. He is hands down the best QB in this class. I have watched every snap he's taken at OU..Elite arm talent with incredible accuracy. Not to mention the personality that his teammates will walk through hell for. He has had some questionable antics but at the end of the day he is the anti Landry Jones. You want this kid wearing Black and Gold. Having said that, the point is moot. He will be a top 10 draft choice. I'll bet the farm on that.

In a QB starved league you may very well be right. But let me ask you this question. Do you believe he is athletic as a Russel Wilson? Because I don’t. And for a guy that short to find passing lanes he will have to move. I think his arm talent and athleticism is above average but neither are elite. And a guy his size will not comfortably sit behind a 6 foot 5 OL and pick a part a D from the pocket. Usually I agree with you on most picks. But I don’t think Mayfields game translates against bigger faster NFL players. Guess time will tell. And all that is ignoring some of immaturity issues. I say pass.

[Shawn]

Let me say this about Jackson. Many are making assumptions about him without looking at his film. This guy can pass. He got better in 2017 at going through progressions. I love the guys quick whip release. The guy can pass. His improv skills would be a nightmare for opposing Ds. His ability to shift within the pocket are some of the best I’ve seen. He can effortlessly hit a 30 yard post without even stepping into the ball. The guy is a freak. My only knocks on him would be that he has bouncy footwork and need to step into his throws giving him greater accuracy. He isn’t consistently accurate but I believe it’s all footwork based. A good QB coach could easily turn him into an elite QB1.

[Oviedo]

Shawn I could not disagree more on Mayfield. He is hands down the best QB in this class. I have watched every snap he's taken at OU..Elite arm talent with incredible accuracy. Not to mention the personality that his teammates will walk through hell for. He has had some questionable antics but at the end of the day he is the anti Landry Jones. You want this kid wearing Black and Gold. Having said that, the point is moot. He will be a top 10 draft choice. I'll bet the farm on that.

IMO Mayfield would be a good fit for the Steelers. A blue collar guy who has a chip on his shoulder and will do anything to win. Got to like that.

As far as comparisons to Manziel they are totally off base. Manziel was a rich brat who was raised with a silver spoon in his mouth and was never held accountable for anything.

[Oviedo]

Let me say this about Jackson. Many are making assumptions about him without looking at his film. This guy can pass. He got better in 2017 at going through progressions. I love the guys quick whip release. The guy can pass. His improv skills would be a nightmare for opposing Ds. His ability to shift within the pocket are some of the best I’ve seen. He can effortlessly hit a 30 yard post without even stepping into the ball. The guy is a freak. My only knocks on him would be that he has bouncy footwork and need to step into his throws giving him greater accuracy. He isn’t consistently accurate but I believe it’s all footwork based. A good QB coach could easily turn him into an elite QB1.

IMO Jackson would do himself a big favor staying at UofL for another year. With the QB talent in this class he would be no better than the 4th or 5th QB taken. Another year in school he could come back as a Top 5 or 10 pick.

[Shawn]

IMO Jackson would do himself a big favor staying at UofL for another year. With the QB talent in this class he would be no better than the 4th or 5th QB taken. Another year in school he could come back as a Top 5 or 10 pick.

You may be right. But, it's a good thing for the Steelers. I doubt he falls to us but if he does I believe they would be fools not to draft him.

[feltdizz]

IMO Jackson would do himself a big favor staying at UofL for another year. With the QB talent in this class he would be no better than the 4th or 5th QB taken. Another year in school he could come back as a Top 5 or 10 pick.

no way.. all he can do is get injured IMO. He isn't going to get any better than he is right now. He had a pretty good year and most people didn't appreciate it because they are so used to seeing him video game his way to impressive stats.

Financially it sucks for him because he will be the 4th or 5th QB taken but it might be the best thing for his career to go no and get drafted by a team with some real weapons in a later round.

[Starlifter]

Question for all the draft gurus. I freely admit I don’t follow college football closely and since Colbert never takes my calls I tend to let him just do his job and second guess afterwards. But maybe someone can answer this.

Assuming Ben doesn’t retire. We know Landry is likely not the next franchise qb. Yet the Steelers took josh dobbs last year. With those three still on the books - do the Steelers take another qb in the draft? Do they write off dobbs after no playing time. From the position we’ll be drafting from - there won’t be any top tier guys available. Will what IS on the boards be good enough for them to move on from Landry and dobbs?

So maybe they don’t take a qb at all this year? that’s my question.

[Docosc]

QB is such a random lottery kind of thing, esp now with the way the college game has moved so far away from the pro game and trying to project someone's development into a pro QB. Ryan Leaf and Jamarcus Russel should be enough to insert a dose of reality into this discussion even before you get into the raft of Browns round 1 QB disasters. With the fact that we really have no feel for the evolution of Dobbs, and Jones really did not look horrible Sunday (for him that really is pretty high praise) I think we have to trust that the organization has a feel for whether Dobbs or Jones can take the reins at least in the short term. The truth is you don't replace a franchise QB picking 32. Indy did it by sucking badly. Yes there are Wilson and Brady to throw out as later round hits, but that is so rare you can not count on it. Just have to sit back and see how it plays out. I guess what I am saying is that I trust the organization. I did through the Decade of Despair (1980's) and still do now.

[papillon]

no way.. all he can do is get injured IMO. He isn't going to get any better than he is right now. He had a pretty good year and most people didn't appreciate it because they are so used to seeing him video game his way to impressive stats.

Financially it sucks for him because he will be the 4th or 5th QB taken but it might be the best thing for his career to go no and get drafted by a team with some real weapons in a later round.

If he isn't going to get any better than he is right now, why would the Steelers draft him? If he's hit his ceiling, let some other team take him to be a permanent backup, the Steelers, I think, will be looking for the QB to replace Ben.

Pappy

[papillon]

Question for all the draft gurus. I freely admit I don’t follow college football closely and since Colbert never takes my calls I tend to let him just do his job and second guess afterwards. But maybe someone can answer this.

Assuming Ben doesn’t retire. We know Landry is likely not the next franchise qb. Yet the Steelers took josh dobbs last year. With those three still on the books - do the Steelers take another qb in the draft? Do they write off dobbs after no playing time. From the position we’ll be drafting from - there won’t be any top tier guys available. Will what IS on the boards be good enough for them to move on from Landry and dobbs?

So maybe they don’t take a qb at all this year? that’s my question.

I think if they believe the right guy is there and they can get him, they will, then either Jones or Dobbs becomes expendable, otherwise, I think they'll stay put and make the team better overall. If Ben calls it a career, that's an entirely different dynamic, not sure what they do there. Garroppolo? (This will probably be bidding war with the 49ers) Jones for a year or two and try to draft a QB? Manning? Could the Steelers get a couple good years from him while the team is built to win? other?

Pappy

[feltdizz]

Question for all the draft gurus. I freely admit I don’t follow college football closely and since Colbert never takes my calls I tend to let him just do his job and second guess afterwards. But maybe someone can answer this.

Assuming Ben doesn’t retire. We know Landry is likely not the next franchise qb. Yet the Steelers took josh dobbs last year. With those three still on the books - do the Steelers take another qb in the draft? Do they write off dobbs after no playing time. From the position we’ll be drafting from - there won’t be any top tier guys available. Will what IS on the boards be good enough for them to move on from Landry and dobbs?

So maybe they don’t take a qb at all this year? that’s my question.

I think we take a QB in the first if our guy is still available. It’s a deep QB draft. Probably the deepest since Ben’s draft. I wouldn’t be mad if we took a chance on one of these guys late in the first.

However, I wouldn’t be surprised if we didn’t take a QB early if Ben plays next year. I really think we have something in Dobbs. Wouldn’t be surprised if we let Dobbs and Landry play a year or 3 with the weapons we have.