Le'Veon Bell

[feltdizz]

One other point regarding Bells whopping contract that would’ve “handcuffed” our team. Such a ridiculous claim but anyway...

Let’s look at Bettis’ last contract in Pittsburgh. Bettis had a 6yr/36 mill contract. 6 mill per year. The salary cap in 2001 was 67.4 mill

Bells contract was 5yr/70 mill. 14.5 mill per year. The NFL cap in 2018 was 177.2 mill

Bettis was 8.9% of our salary cap
Bell was 8.1% of our salary cap

Given the increases in the salary cap Bell wasn’t asking for a ridiculous a mount of money. He was asking for a market correction and he was correct. Bell isn’t the reason we would’ve been in cap hell. Ben would’ve been the reason. Until we see a SB appearance with Ben making $35 mill per you have to point the finger at the true reason for handcuffing our cap.

[Northern_Blitz]

your really think Bell falls off a cliff with another year of AB, JuJu, Ben, Washington, Haden, Pouncey, DeCastro and Tomlin and company in the FO vs why he has in the Jets?

C’mon. You don’t believe that. Now granted, Bell hasn’t looked as good as expected in NY BUT they are truly trash. I didn’t expect them to be this bad in the trenches. Remember tho, they still beat us last year.

Yes. I think he was falling off the cliff in his last year with us (and said as much at the time)

That's why I didn't like the contract we offered.

I don't think he'd look quite as bad as he does on the Jets 2 years ago because other good players could hide his decline a bit. But Conner was very good 2 years ago too.

Do you think our O would have been appreciably better with Bell last year with Ben out? I think peak Bell would have helped Mason a lot. But not current Bell (or last year's version).

[feltdizz]

Yes. I think he was falling off the cliff in his last year with us (and said as much at the time)

That's why I didn't like the contract we offered.

I don't think he'd look quite as bad as he does on the Jets 2 years ago because other good players could hide his decline a bit. But Conner was very good 2 years ago too.

Do you think our O would have been appreciably better with Bell last year with Ben out? I think peak Bell would have helped Mason a lot. But not current Bell (or last year's version).

If Bell doesn’t take a year off I don’t think we see him fall off. Of course since he is now on the Jets everyone can say that would’ve been his trajectory here but that’s crazy talk.

We knew how to use Bell in our offense and I can’t see how our 12 win season turns into .500 in one offseason because of a slight decline in ypc. He was still a beast in the passing game.

[NorthCoast]

If Bell doesn’t take a year off I don’t think we see him fall off. Of course since he is now on the Jets everyone can say that would’ve been his trajectory here but that’s crazy talk.

We knew how to use Bell in our offense and I can’t see how our 12 win season turns into .500 in one offseason because of a slight decline in ypc. He was still a beast in the passing game.

I'll give you credit dizz. Your conviction and consistent defense of Bell and his contract is remarkable.

[Captain Lemming]

i'll give you credit dizz. Your conviction and consistent defense of bell and his contract is remarkable.

AKA.........

[Captain Lemming]

No my friend, that’s YOUR logic. I’m just showing you how silly it sounds.

I want to field a team that makes the playoffs, which gives us a chance to win a SB.

YOU keep celebrating losing Bell like we have seen positive results from his departure. We have yet to see more success without Bell. At least wait until we actually make an AFCCG or SB before claiming victory.

I’m certain that if Bell signed that contract we would’ve fielded a more competitive team these past 2 years. Acting like we didn’t have more success with him than without him is silly.

We lost Bell AND Shazier Dizz.
Our scoring went up modestly/ Our defense TANKED majorly.

Dizz, the part of the team that Bell has no impact on got worse.
We were impacted to a FAR GREATER extent by the loss of Shazier as the DEFENSE got worse.
We saw it in the playoff that year.

You keep saying our unit was better without him while ignoring ball security, TOP, when points where scored, necessity of points based on leads vs trailing in the 4th quarter. You would have to be a fool to prefer the 2018 offense to 2017 because of one stat.

By one stat you mean SCORING?

Yes, I literally judge an offense based on scoring above all else.

Dizz, when points are scored, necessity, leads, etc are ALL impacted by defense too.

We had two turnovers and we lose to the Jags because of Ben despite 42 points?
We had 2 turnovers YESTERDAY and won. What if those turnovers were in the first quarter?

If we score FORTY TWO we still win...it ain’t close.

If you score more than they do you win...PERIOD.

Unless you get multiple pick sixes, (defense scoring) 42 points in a loss is on the defense.

[feltdizz]

We lost Bell AND Shazier Dizz.
Our scoring went up modestly/ Our defense TANKED majorly.

Dizz, the part of the team that Bell has no impact on got worse.
We were impacted to a FAR GREATER extent by the loss of Shazier as the DEFENSE got worse.
We saw it in the playoff that year.



By one stat you mean SCORING?

Yes, I literally judge an offense based on scoring above all else.

Dizz, when points are scored, necessity, leads, etc are ALL impacted by defense too.

We had two turnovers and we lose to the Jags because of Ben despite 42 points?
We had 2 turnovers YESTERDAY and won. What if those turnovers were in the first quarter?

If we score FORTY TWO we still win...it ain’t close.

If you score more than they do you win...PERIOD.

Unless you get multiple pick sixes, (defense scoring) 42 points in a loss is on the defense.

Denver isn’t the Jags. Stop it.

We lost to the Jags twice that season and Ben had 6 Turnovers in those 2 games.

and that last TD was in garbage time. No matter how you swing it Ben had 2 costly turnovers early in the game and we also had 3 more turnovers on downs.

[Northern_Blitz]

Denver isn’t the Jags. Stop it.

We lost to the Jags twice that season and Ben had 6 Turnovers in those 2 games.

and that last TD was in garbage time. No matter how you swing it Ben had 2 costly turnovers early in the game and we also had 3 more turnovers on downs.

I wonder what the Jags D looks like that season in series where the game was within one score (or even 10 points).

My guess is that in those situations they got turnovers (often defensive scores or setting their O up on very short fields) on a very high percentage of series where the game was close.

[feltdizz]

I wonder what the Jags D looks like that season in series where the game was within one score (or even 10 points).

My guess is that in those situations they got turnovers (often defensive scores or setting their O up on very short fields) on a very high percentage of series where the game was close.

not sure.. but I believe after our first game they led the league with 15 takeaways.

I was also wrong. Ben had 7 turnovers in 2 games vs the Jags that year with 3 being returned for TD’s.

[SteelerOfDeVille]

One other point regarding Bells whopping contract that would’ve “handcuffed” our team. Such a ridiculous claim but anyway...

Let’s look at Bettis’ last contract in Pittsburgh. Bettis had a 6yr/36 mill contract. 6 mill per year. The salary cap in 2001 was 67.4 mill

Bells contract was 5yr/70 mill. 14.5 mill per year. The NFL cap in 2018 was 177.2 mill

Bettis was 8.9% of our salary cap
Bell was 8.1% of our salary cap

Given the increases in the salary cap Bell wasn’t asking for a ridiculous a mount of money. He was asking for a market correction and he was correct. Bell isn’t the reason we would’ve been in cap hell. Ben would’ve been the reason. Until we see a SB appearance with Ben making $35 mill per you have to point the finger at the true reason for handcuffing our cap.

I didn't want Bell at what he was asking... but, as someone "on the other side", this is the mic drop...

[Captain Lemming]

I didn't want Bell at what he was asking... but, as someone "on the other side", this is the mic drop...

Really?
Again my point is missed.

The issue is not what percent of a teams cap is a running back. By that standard Bell or Gurley or any other elite backs contract is not outrageous.

My point is that due to many factors...easy to replace, injury prone, short peak.....most importantly, HAS NOT WORKED AS A STRATEGY FOR A CHAMPIONSHIP in 20 years, elite money spent on THAT position comes back to bite you most times in today's NFL.

Say we signed Bell to what he wanted, who declined from 4.9 to 4.0 per carry WITH US. He had a ton of CARRIES which is why most did not see it. He remains an effective receiver.

Do you really believe Dizzs garbage that his only problem is he is a Jet when his decline began 3 seasons ago?

The Bettis argument just distracts from the REAL debate.

Only way it is a mic drop for you is if your opinion was actually swayed by his argument.

Do YOU regret not signing that injured shell of his former self?

[Captain Lemming]

Bell is not struggling because he signed with a bad team.......

Stupid moves like signing Bell to a deal they can't escape is why the Jets are a bad team.

If you want I can dig up where I sad WHILE HE WAS A STEELER that a stupid team would sign him.

And it came true.

[Steel Maniac]

Bell is not struggling because he signed with a bad team.......

Stupid moves like signing Bell to a deal they can't escape is why the Jets are a bad team.

If you want I can dig up where I sad WHILE HE WAS A STEELER that a stupid team would sign him.

And it came true.

You did. Everything you said would happen , did happen in regards to Leveon Bell. It amazes me that Adam Gase still is employed. He should be fired immediately. He's one of the worse coaches I've seen over a period of 50 plus years of watching football.

[SteelerOfDeVille]

Really?
Again my point is missed.

The issue is not what percent of a teams cap is a running back. By that standard Bell or Gurley or any other elite backs contract is not outrageous.

My point is that due to many factors...easy to replace, injury prone, short peak.....most importantly, HAS NOT WORKED AS A STRATEGY FOR A CHAMPIONSHIP in 20 years, elite money spent on THAT position comes back to bite you most times in today's NFL.

Say we signed Bell to what he wanted, who declined from 4.9 to 4.0 per carry WITH US. He had a ton of CARRIES which is why most did not see it. He remains an effective receiver.

Do you really believe Dizzs garbage that his only problem is he is a Jet when his decline began 3 seasons ago?

The Bettis argument just distracts from the REAL debate.

Only way it is a mic drop for you is if your opinion was actually swayed by his argument.

Do YOU regret not signing that injured shell of his former self?

the weird thing is i was good with what the team offered. i wasn't good with the additional guaranteed money he wanted. in other words, i wanted him to continue to EARN his money.

but, i didn't want him. not at what he wanted guaranteed vs his history for missing games (whether suspension or injury).

having said that dizz's comparison made me realize that even by steelers standards, for an elite back it wasn't ridiculous.

The 4.9 vs 4.0 YPC: iirc, he came in after holding out and struggled early. Once he was in game shape but seemed to be his old self by end of season.

To be clear, he had more rushing yards per game that season than any other season. He had both more rushes and more receptions than any other season during his career. Honestly, i don't even blame him for holding out the next year. Seemed like a situation where the team was going to run all the tread off the tires then let him walk.

[hawaiiansteel]

He's one of the worse coaches I've seen over a period of 50 plus years of watching football.

I have to admit that I was wrong.

I thought for sure you were about 12 years old.