Jarvis Jones

[steelz09]

Name an LB who can cover the monster TEs of today, let alone WRs. Give me some names. If you come up with five I will be very surprised. And I mean five legitimate names, not bullshyte.

I could name some that are better than Timmons but that wasn't my point. My comment was in response to Ovi's.... about Timmons running with a WR in training camp.

[Shoe]

Guys,
If you are not concerned, then you are ignoring a lot of signs. The only sign that he'll be a good player, is his production in college. He is slow, as evidenced by producing the slowest 40 time in memory for a 1st round LB. So (1), he is slow. He is also, by his own admission, not strong enough (2). And the last thing of course being, he was a non-factor, actually playing in the league in question (the NFL). Remember also, he was supposed to be plug-and-play ready. Even if he ended up not being so, you would certainly expect him to have flashes of success (i.e. a few sacks?)

I'm not writing him off yet, but I am concerned. How can you not be?

[steelz09]

Guys,
If you are not concerned, then you are ignoring a lot of signs. The only sign that he'll be a good player, is his production in college. He is slow, as evidenced by producing the slowest 40 time in memory for a 1st round LB. So (1), he is slow. He is also, by his own admission, not strong enough (2). And the last thing of course being, he was a non-factor, actually playing in the league in question (the NFL). Remember also, he was supposed to be plug-and-play ready. Even if he ended up not being so, you would certainly expect him to have flashes of success (i.e. a few sacks?)

I'm not writing him off yet, but I am concerned. How can you not be?

I'm not at all concerned. I think he is going to be a playermaker for us. He has a knack for being around the ball and natural instincts and thats something you can't teach and something for important than some stupid 40 time in shorts.

Strength is a non-issue.... That is the easiest to fix. Timmons was the same way.

[SteelCrazy]

1. If a LB has to run 40 yards for any reason, something went totally wrong anyways.

2. Like Steelz said, strength can easily be fixed.

3. Plug n play ready in a very complex system like LeBeau's is never going to happen.

I sincerely believe he can produce at this level by hitting the gym and studying the playbook. He's a natural athlete and you can easily see that by watching him play.

[Shoe]

Strength is easily fixed?

If that is the case, why aren't we drafting Aaron Donald, putting him in the weight room, and let him plug the middle (on 1st & 2nd) and rush the passer (on 3rd)? You know the reason why... because it isn't as "easy" as getting a guy on a bench press. Many people get stronger, and lose speed. For Jones, that would be a disaster.

[birtikidis]

wasn't james harrison really slow coming out of college? wasn't he too small? wasn't he too weak? didn't he only have one move? how'd that work out?

[Shoe]

wasn't james harrison really slow coming out of college? wasn't he too small? wasn't he too weak? didn't he only have one move? how'd that work out?

I seriously DOUBT James Harrison was ever considered weak.

[steelz09]

If that is the case, why aren't we drafting Aaron Donald, putting him in the weight room, and let him plug the middle (on 1st & 2nd) and rush the passer (on 3rd)? You know the reason why... because it isn't as "easy" as getting a guy on a bench press. Many people get stronger, and lose speed. For Jones, that would be a disaster.

I don't see why your associating gaining strength and losing speed. I dropped 25 pounds and was stronger than I was when I was heavier. If you bulk up.. then yes, you might get a bit slower but not necessarily. It depends...

I don't see how JJ gaining strength will make him slower. In fact, I think he could add a bit more bulk as well without losing speed. He has the frame to easily carry 10 more pounds of lean muscle. He's taller than most think: 6'2.

[Shawn]

I'm not at all concerned. I think he is going to be a playermaker for us. He has a knack for being around the ball and natural instincts and thats something you can't teach and something for important than some stupid 40 time in shorts.

Strength is a non-issue.... That is the easiest to fix. Timmons was the same way.

I agree...not really worried about him.

[DBR96A]

Troy Polamalu was a non-factor in his rookie season.

[RuthlessBurgher]

I have the same opinion. The sacks I saw in college were "tenacity sacks" where the QB would hold the ball and eventually Jones just kept working to get to him. I can't recall a consistent number of sacks where he just beat OTs on a regular basis because of his pass rush techniques and blew past the OT. Could be wrong but we'll find out over the next season or two.

Not that I intent to compare the two as players or anything, but once upon a time you could have used the same description...the sacks were "tenacity sacks" where the QB would hold the ball and he eventually would just keep working to get to him...to describe someone like J.J. Watt. Just sayin'.

[feltdizz]

people want instant production from JJ....

but most of the same people scream about how it takes a few years to blossom in Lebeau's D.

[Oviedo]

Not that I intent to compare the two as players or anything, but once upon a time you could have used the same description...the sacks were "tenacity sacks" where the QB would hold the ball and he eventually would just keep working to get to him...to describe someone like J.J. Watt. Just sayin'.

Ruthless--I'd have to totally disagree. While JJ Watt is tenacious, from his rookie year he was also explosive and could overpower blocker. Watt blows past blockers. IMO Jones will never be in the same universe as a player...not even close.

[Oviedo]

people want instant production from JJ....

but most of the same people scream about how it takes a few years to blossom in Lebeau's D.

I don't think anyone wants instant stardom. I've never advocated. I really expected more than one sack and I think it is legitimate to simply discuss with what we have seen so far can he be an elite pass rusher in the Kevin Greene mold or will be be a equal or lesser version of Worilds? That just legit discussion. His lack of speed and power are a legit concern.

Everyone acts like after this off season he will be able to compete in the World's Strongest Man competition. His body type is lean. He will likely never have Harrison's power which isn't bad if you have speed. Unfortunately he doesn't seem to have that either.

No one wants him to fail because after burning a 1st Round pick on him it will set this defense back for years and therefore the team we all love suffers.

[feltdizz]

I don't think anyone wants instant stardom. I've never advocated. I really expected more than one sack and I think it is legitimate to simply discuss with what we have seen so far can he be an elite pass rusher in the Kevin Greene mold or will be be a equal or lesser version of Worilds? That just legit discussion. His lack of speed and power are a legit concern.

Everyone acts like after this off season he will be able to compete in the World's Strongest Man competition. His body type is lean. He will likely never have Harrison's power which isn't bad if you have speed. Unfortunately he doesn't seem to have that either.

No one wants him to fail because after burning a 1st Round pick on him it will set this defense back for years and therefore the team we all love suffers.

I think most act like JJ will improve due to having legit reps his rookie year...