Good read Cowher V's Tomlin

[feltdizz]

Sorry but totally disagree. We take Def Tackles who usually made their money in college attacking through a one gap. We then "convert" them to "occupy blockers" to keep the LBs clean. We also take DEs who have good pass rushing credentials and "convert" them to OLB and add pass coverage responsibilities.

LeBeau's defense does not take them from college and put them in familiar positions.

...and thr reason WRs look good is because they aren't asked to be anything but a WR. We draft OL and ask them to learn all of the positions on the OL and play musical chairs and wonder why our OL stinks.

[steelz09]

Was half the league playing the 3-4 looking for players that we usually had first dibs on when Gildon and Porter were developed? I would not count Emmons or Haggans as success stories.

The competition to find the undersized DEs to play 3-4 OLB is much greater than in the 90s.

Your right. The 3-4 defense is a proven failure....lol.

There are plenty of teams in the NFL that run a 3-4 and don't need to spend 1st rounders on their NT, DE and LBers....Maybe we just can't develop any of these guys like we used to. That "development" of lack thereof seems to be a common problem in that Tomlin-era. I'm sure Colbert suddenly forgot how to draft when Tomlin got hired.

[steelz09]

...and thr reason WRs look good is because they aren't asked to be anything but a WR. We draft OL and ask them to learn all of the positions on the OL and play musical chairs and wonder why our OL stinks.

Your right about the o-line. I hate how Tomlin makes some of these guys learn all of these o-line positions when they haven't excelled at their primary position first.

[Slapstick]

You can't be this obtuse. Cowher lost players to FAs. Not because he lost Noll's players.

I'm not the one being obtuse here...

Tomlin had more players, Cowher had fewer, it doesn't matter...

If it's just coincidence that Tomlin his heading into a trough at about the same time Cowher did during his Steelers tenure, then so be it...

I just don't believe that...

[NorthCoast]

Sorry but totally disagree. We take Def Tackles who usually made their money in college attacking through a one gap. We then "convert" them to "occupy blockers" to keep the LBs clean. We also take DEs who have good pass rushing credentials and "convert" them to OLB and add pass coverage responsibilities.

LeBeau's defense does not take them from college and put them in familiar positions.

Really need to start a new tune Oviedo. JJ was drafted and is playing the exact position he learned in college. Of course, you will argue he is being asked to do more things than rush the passer. Guess what, any player drafted is asked to do more in the pros than college. A pro team can only field 53 players and don't have the luxury of specialists at every position. Look how many people ripped DeMarcus Ware for being 'one dimensional' and not a complete player.

[Shawn]

Did I just read the word obtuse on a Steelers message board? This place is true class.

[NJ-STEELER]

Eerily similar to losing in the afccg to harbaugh. Or letting a very young Tom Brady come in for an injured Drew Bledsoe to beat you at home. Cowher had a number of issues. The afc championship game was his nightmare. Regardless of talent.

.................



$$

[Keyplay1]

[URL]http://www.behindthesteelcurtain.com/2013/10/7/4808418/steelers-head-coach-mike-tomlin-history-hot-seat-bill-cowher[/URL]

Nice try Defeo, but sorry not buying it. What is missing is the sense of progress and growth Cowher brought in from day 1. Don't know why this goes unnoticed when BC is discussed.

The only similarity between the two is it was time for a coaching change and it was made. That's it.

VADER has spelled it out exactly the way it was in early Cowher.

So any comparisons of two totally different set of circumstances is absurd. Each coach has to be rated on exactly what has occurred during his tenure. With Cowher IMO it was steady continuous change in every phase of the game hopefully to achieve excellence. Now there does not seem to be this sense of progress. Although that is not a given yet.

It is possible that this current roster is actually stronger and loaded with more first rate players than the team Cowher inherited.[despite the loss of over a half dozen all pros the past few years] However, that is on paper. Maybe that is the problem. This team could very well be "paper champs" and that usually does not get it. Let's see if Tomlin can get this team off the paper and on the field.

About the only thing in the article that was a fact is Defeo said: "Hey, the Steelers are 2-9 in their last 11 games, dating back to Week 10 of 2012. They've been behind by two scores or more in 11 of their last 15 games."

This does not sound like progress. Let's see if Tomlin can turn this around.

[papillon]

Did I just read the word obtuse on a Steelers message board? This place is true class.

No to mention the fact that this board has been rhadamanthine in its assessment of Colbert and the coaching staff. Just sayin...

Pappy

[Keyplay1]

No to mention the fact that this board has been rhadamanthine in its assessment of Colbert and the coaching staff. Just sayin...

Pappy

At the risk of being ob- ob-2's something or other[does that have something to do with geomety]

Anyway, I did not think that rhad thing was a real word. I thought you just made it up. It's real all right, but I got a hunch it wont catch on.

How is that spelled anyhow? Is it E-I-E-I-O

[Ghost]

No to mention the fact that this board has been rhadamanthine in its assessment of Colbert and the coaching staff. Just sayin...

Pappy

Better rhadamanthine than mercurial.

[Slapstick]

Nice try Defeo, but sorry not buying it. What is missing is the sense of progress and growth Cowher brought in from day 1. Don't know why this goes unnoticed when BC is discussed.

The only similarity between the two is it was time for a coaching change and it was made. That's it.

VADER has spelled it out exactly the way it was in early Cowher.


So any comparisons of two totally different set of circumstances is absurd. Each coach has to be rated on exactly what has occurred during his tenure. With Cowher IMO it was steady continuous change in every phase of the game hopefully to achieve excellence. Now there does not seem to be this sense of progress. Although that is not a given yet.

It is possible that this current roster is actually stronger and loaded with more first rate players than the team Cowher inherited.[despite the loss of over a half dozen all pros the past few years] However, that is on paper. Maybe that is the problem. This team could very well be "paper champs" and that usually does not get it. Let's see if Tomlin can get this team off the paper and on the field.

About the only thing in the article that was a fact is Defeo said: "Hey, the Steelers are 2-9 in their last 11 games, dating back to Week 10 of 2012. They've been behind by two scores or more in 11 of their last 15 games."

This does not sound like progress. Let's see if Tomlin can turn this around.

What kind of excellence did Cowher achieve in 1998, 1999 and 2000?

[phillyesq]

Was half the league playing the 3-4 looking for players that we usually had first dibs on when Gildon and Porter were developed? I would not count Emmons or Haggans as success stories.

The competition to find the undersized DEs to play 3-4 OLB is much greater than in the 90s.

For 5th and 7th round picks, Haggans and Emmons are absolutely success stories.

Sure, there are more teams that play a 3-4 now (apparently, half the league has missed the flaws that you see), but the Steelers have still flat out missed on evaluations. Taking Davis over Cliff Avril (a guy the Steelers had in for a pre-draft visit) was a particularly glaring example.

Of cour

[phillyesq]

Sorry but totally disagree. We take Def Tackles who usually made their money in college attacking through a one gap. We then "convert" them to "occupy blockers" to keep the LBs clean. We also take DEs who have good pass rushing credentials and "convert" them to OLB and add pass coverage responsibilities.

LeBeau's defense does not take them from college and put them in familiar positions.

You've railed for years against the DL "occupying blockers." However, without the DL keeping your boy Timmons clean, what has he done this year? Nothing.

I love how the guy who has a statement of self importance deriding fantasy football as his signature cannot recognize anything done by the defensive line outside of a sack.

[Shawn]

No to mention the fact that this board has been rhadamanthine in its assessment of Colbert and the coaching staff. Just sayin...

Pappy

*pulls out dictionary* ok...ok I believe I can agree with that.