quarterback ranking thread No. 23,235,265,000 . . .

[proudpittsburgher]

. . . entitled "beating a dead horse"

Sorry, but had to vent

Was listening to ESPN radio, and apparently Trent Dilfer came out qwith his quarterback rankings. He grouped them together into "classes". I didn't have my cell phone with me to call in, or the stats in front of me, so I am gettng my therapy here. I get tired of these talking heads spouting off with little to no knowlege and a total disreguard of facts. Anyway, here are the classes.

Elite
Tom Brady and Peyton Manning

Superstar
Drew Brees and Phillip Rivers

on the come
Ben and some others

Like many, I didn't have a problem with the first two, and really don't have a problem with Brees over Ben, although a very strong case could be made for ben in this reguard, but on to my beef . . .

this is ongoing beef, but in the discussion afterwards from the host of the show, when they mention Ben's 2 super bowls, they always immediate question his first one, saying how badly he performed in the first one. NO ONE EVER mentions the three games leading up to the Super bowl that year, when it can be argued Ben carried the offensive load on his back. Even including his awful super bowl stats into my argument, and they naturally bring it down signifigantly, he had a 62 percent completion percentage, averaged 200 yards passing in those games (which is remarkable since he barely threw a pass in the second half against Indy) and had a combined quarterback rating of 101.7 . In that year which people don't want to give him credit for winning s super bowl, he outperformed guess who in pretty much every one of his playoff performances . . . Peyton Manning. Call me a homer all you want, but just about everyone comes up for excuses as to why Ben isn't among the elite quarterbacks in the game, and I am starting to get sick of all of them.

[Northern_Blitz]

Re: quarterback ranking thread No. 23,235,265,000 . . .

. . . entitled "beating a dead horse"

Sorry, but had to vent

Was listening to ESPN radio, and apparently Trent Dilfer came out qwith his quarterback rankings. He grouped them together into "classes". I didn't have my cell phone with me to call in, or the stats in front of me, so I am gettng my therapy here. I get tired of these talking heads spouting off with little to no knowlege and a total disreguard of facts. Anyway, here are the classes.

Elite
Tom Brady and Peyton Manning

Superstar
Drew Brees and Phillip Rivers

on the come
Ben and some others

Like many, I didn't have a problem with the first two, and really don't have a problem with Brees over Ben, although a very strong case could be made for ben in this reguard, but on to my beef . . .

this is ongoing beef, but in the discussion afterwards from the host of the show, when they mention Ben's 2 super bowls, they always immediate question his first one, saying how badly he performed in the first one. NO ONE EVER mentions the three games leading up to the Super bowl that year, when it can be argued Ben carried the offensive load on his back. Even including his awful super bowl stats into my argument, and they naturally bring it down signifigantly, he had a 62 percent completion percentage, averaged 200 yards passing in those games (which is remarkable since he barely threw a pass in the second half against Indy) and had a combined quarterback rating of 101.7 . In that year which people don't want to give him credit for winning s super bowl, he outperformed guess who in pretty much every one of his playoff performances . . . Peyton Manning. Call me a homer all you want, but just about everyone comes up for excuses as to why Ben isn't among the elite quarterbacks in the game, and I am starting to get sick of all of them.

Ben is not a Fantasy Football QB, so he will never get the recognition of guys like Rivers, or Palmer, who put up big numbers but don't win anything.

It was similar for Brady at first. He didn't really get recognition until the 3rd superbowl (they had a good D, and a smart coach, Brady was a system guy) and the gaudy numbers he put up they year they lost to the Giants.

I'd rather my team had the hardware than the tag of best QB.

[Oviedo]

Re: quarterback ranking thread No. 23,235,265,000 . . .

. . . entitled "beating a dead horse"

Sorry, but had to vent

Was listening to ESPN radio, and apparently Trent Dilfer came out qwith his quarterback rankings. He grouped them together into "classes". I didn't have my cell phone with me to call in, or the stats in front of me, so I am gettng my therapy here. I get tired of these talking heads spouting off with little to no knowlege and a total disreguard of facts. Anyway, here are the classes.

Elite
Tom Brady and Peyton Manning

Superstar
Drew Brees and Phillip Rivers

on the come
Ben and some others

Like many, I didn't have a problem with the first two, and really don't have a problem with Brees over Ben, although a very strong case could be made for ben in this reguard, but on to my beef . . .

this is ongoing beef, but in the discussion afterwards from the host of the show, when they mention Ben's 2 super bowls, they always immediate question his first one, saying how badly he performed in the first one. NO ONE EVER mentions the three games leading up to the Super bowl that year, when it can be argued Ben carried the offensive load on his back. Even including his awful super bowl stats into my argument, and they naturally bring it down signifigantly, he had a 62 percent completion percentage, averaged 200 yards passing in those games (which is remarkable since he barely threw a pass in the second half against Indy) and had a combined quarterback rating of 101.7 . In that year which people don't want to give him credit for winning s super bowl, he outperformed guess who in pretty much every one of his playoff performances . . . Peyton Manning. Call me a homer all you want, but just about everyone comes up for excuses as to why Ben isn't among the elite quarterbacks in the game, and I am starting to get sick of all of them.

Ben is not a Fantasy Football QB, so he will never get the recognition of guys like Rivers, or Palmer, who put up big numbers but don't win anything.

It was similar for Brady at first. He didn't really get recognition until the 3rd superbowl (they had a good D, and a smart coach, Brady was a system guy) and the gaudy numbers he put up they year they lost to the Giants.

I'd rather my team had the hardware than the tag of best QB.

These guys equate being a "stats accumulator" to being a quality NFL QB. That is why I hate Fantasy Football. It has so totally distorted the perception of the game and players.

I'll take Ben over everyone in a heartbeat except for Brady and Peyton and then I'd take Ben if it is our OL doing the blocking because the other two wouldn't survive the season.

[Chachi]

Re: quarterback ranking thread No. 23,235,265,000 . . .






While it can be said that the team carried Ben through the Superbowl, it can also be said Ben carried the team to the Superbowl.

[Captain Lemming]

Re: quarterback ranking thread No. 23,235,265,000 . . .

I'll take Ben over everyone in a heartbeat except for Brady and Peyton and then I'd take Ben if it is our OL doing the blocking because the other two wouldn't survive the season.

I take Ben over the notorious choker Peyton any day.

[proudpittsburgher]

Re: quarterback ranking thread No. 23,235,265,000 . . .

While it can be said that the team carried Ben through the Superbowl, it can also be said Ben carried the team to the Superbowl.

And that's my only beef, as evidenced by the stats I gave in the original post. People convieniently forget about Manning's postseason disasters as evidence against him, and it is damning evidence, but continuously bring up Ben's only egg in his playoff career and forget about the masterful performances which led him to the super bowl. It's like they go out of their way to stack the deck against Ben in these comparisons. How can you not see the elephant in the room which is Peyton Manning's playoff, and big-game for that matter, failures??? I would think it is a big part of what makes a quarterback elite, no?

[Lebsteel]

Re: quarterback ranking thread No. 23,235,265,000 . . .

I heard that on the radio yesterday and was irate when Ben was beneath Phillip Rivers. I was going to call, but then figured it was a waste of my time. The thing that got me was that Dilfer supposedly did not use any stats when making his rankings. If you are not using stats, then Ben HAS to be right there with Brady as the top two QBs in the league. Period.

[Chachi]

Re: quarterback ranking thread No. 23,235,265,000 . . .

And that's my only beef, as evidenced by the stats I gave in the original post. People convieniently forget about Manning's postseason disasters as evidence against him...

Other than the year Peyton won his ring, has there been a post season appearance by Peyton that wasn't considered a personal meltdown on his part? I mean, was there a post season loss that was more of a team loss than Peyton going something along the lines of 10-30 150yds, 3 INTS?

[Starlifter]

Re: quarterback ranking thread No. 23,235,265,000 . . .

the idea that trent dilfer understands the qualities of a great QB is laughable. How pathetic must you be to QB a team to a superbowl victory and then get let go. He doesn't understand the value of winning, he just licks the nutsacks of QB's who put up numbers he could only dream of (or at least multiply his stats by 4). all in all it's just reason #23,235,265,000....not to listen/watch or read anything produced by ESPN.

[Captain Lemming]

Re: quarterback ranking thread No. 23,235,265,000 . . .

What do you mean "other" than the year he won the SB.

Peyton was horrible as usual.
That playoffs he had 7 ints and only 3 TDs.
A 70 QB rating
Over 30 points below his regular season rating of 101 that year.
CHOCKER STILL

Bens playoff rating during his two SB runs?
101, and 91 both substantial improvements over his regular season ratings for the year, and one of the most clutch drives in SB history, requiring him to throw not one but TWO perfect throws to a small receiver in the back of the endzone to seal the win.

Never once in a decade and a half has Peyton since college has Peytons game not gone south in the post season. Not once.

Ben has had only 4 playoff runs, and two of those were FAR better than any postseason Peyton has ever had.

Other than the year Peyton won his ring, has there been a post season appearance by Peyton that wasn't considered a personal meltdown on his part? I mean, was there a post season loss that was more of a team loss than Peyton going something along the lines of 10-30 150yds, 3 INTS?

[skyhawk]

Re: quarterback ranking thread No. 23,235,265,000 . . .

Morons.

Ben is why the Steelers have won 2 of the last 4 SB's. All we Steeler fans knew it from the first time he stepped onto the field that he was a dawn of a new era.

Put this guy on Cowher's teams of the 90's and we all would be talking Steeler dynasty now and not Cowboy dynasty.

I cannot think of one player (I am a little biased) that has had more influence on his team's rise to victories and Super Bowls than Ben Roethlisberger. Sure, Denver had Elway, but he was only winning late in his career. Montana was a part of one of the best 22 players ever to play, and that includes his offensive line. Perhaps Ben is not any better than they, but I still say Ben play more of a factor in turning things around than either of those two hall of famers.

Screw ESPN. PAY ATTENTION!!