Flores added to coaching staff

[Buzz]

Disappointed to here Flores will be coaching OLBs and Jerry O will have the ILBs. imo, it's the ILBs that need a lot more help than the OLBs and Jerry O has been coaching them the last several years with little to show for it.

I think it's a good bet that Flores will have more input than merely coaching OLBs
I'm hoping he can be kind of an assistant DC, allowing Tomlin to pull back from running the D and concentrate on being the HC

[SteelBucks]

I think it's a good bet that Flores will have more input than merely coaching OLBs
I'm hoping he can be kind of an assistant DC, allowing Tomlin to pull back from running the D and concentrate on being the HC

That’s my thinking as well. No way does Flores limit himself to the OLBs. His role will be far greater.

[Northern_Blitz]

That’s my thinking as well. No way does Flores limit himself to the OLBs. His role will be far greater.

I know lots has been made of this, and I think it won't be an issue. But I hope his influence doesn't carry over into changing Minkah's role (I don't think it will).

And hopefully we don't need Minkah to make nearly as many tackles as he did this year (ever again).

[steeler_fan_in_t.o.]

Disappointed to here Flores will be coaching OLBs and Jerry O will have the ILBs. imo, it's the ILBs that need a lot more help than the OLBs and Jerry O has been coaching them the last several years with little to show for it.

Somehow I think his impact will be well beyond just the OLBs. You don't hire a guy with his baggage, give him the title "Senior Defensive Assistant and Linebackers coach" and then say "your job is to babysit our biggest superstar".

I think the reason he got that title was because "Devin Bush personal coach" just didn't sound right.

[NorthCoast]

Former Steeler DB coach Ray Horton has joined Flores lawsuit according to some sources. Can't believe the authors of the Rooney rule were discriminating him but who knows?

[flippy]

Former Steeler DB coach Ray Horton has joined Flores lawsuit according to some sources. Can't believe the authors of the Rooney rule were discriminating him but who knows?

I do wonder what joining the lawsuit really accomplishes?

I'm all in favor of helping the diversity cause, but the reality is anyone that doesn't get a job is going to feel it's unfair on some level. Why would they apply/interview if they didn't believe they had a chance?

This type of interview probably happens a lot. Many bosses end up hiring their friends, family, former employees, etc. And I would say even in these bogus interviews, there's still an opportunity to make a connection and make an impression that you may be able to catapult into something else. We can all keep moving forward and turn negatives into positives and I think that can accomplish more than a lawsuit.

Maybe the lawsuit matters for some issues, but if you lump issues together, it seems to take away from the cause a little.

If I think about all the black coaches, the guy I think I'd want in the suit would be Marvin Lewis. He's got so much experience as a coach both as a position, DC, and HC. He's had varying levels of success in different roles, but clearly the guy knows football and seems like a person the league would benefit from having around in some fashion. He's got his plusses and minuses like everyone else, but why is he an assistant college coach and still around the game but not involved in the NFL? There has to be something more to his story.

Maybe I'm wrong, but Ray Horton seems to water down the suit a little. I can see why he'd be frustrated by the instance/situation, but I think that's something that happens beyond diversity and is the type of thing that could impact anyone regardless of race.

[feltdizz]

I do wonder what joining the lawsuit really accomplishes?

I'm all in favor of helping the diversity cause, but the reality is anyone that doesn't get a job is going to feel it's unfair on some level. Why would they apply/interview if they didn't believe they had a chance?

This type of interview probably happens a lot. Many bosses end up hiring their friends, family, former employees, etc. And I would say even in these bogus interviews, there's still an opportunity to make a connection and make an impression that you may be able to catapult into something else. We can all keep moving forward and turn negatives into positives and I think that can accomplish more than a lawsuit.

Maybe the lawsuit matters for some issues, but if you lump issues together, it seems to take away from the cause a little.

If I think about all the black coaches, the guy I think I'd want in the suit would be Marvin Lewis. He's got so much experience as a coach both as a position, DC, and HC. He's had varying levels of success in different roles, but clearly the guy knows football and seems like a person the league would benefit from having around in some fashion. He's got his plusses and minuses like everyone else, but why is he an assistant college coach and still around the game but not involved in the NFL? There has to be something more to his story.

Maybe I'm wrong, but Ray Horton seems to water down the suit a little. I can see why he'd be frustrated by the instance/situation, but I think that's something that happens beyond diversity and is the type of thing that could impact anyone regardless of race.

Why would it water it down?

Can’t have it both ways (I mean, I guess you can but not really)

“Flores needs more people!!!” then as soon as more people join..

“ooh, that won’t help him!”

[flippy]

Why would it water it down?

Can’t have it both ways (I mean, I guess you can but not really)

“Flores needs more people!!!” then as soon as more people join..

“ooh, that won’t help him!”

While I'm supportive of diversity, I'm not sure I like the lawsuit that much.

Getting paid to lose games for a better draft pick sounds like a serious allegation. Getting pushed out/mistreated for not going along there seems like a legit issue. This is along the lines of Collin K never getting another opportunity which sounds like a real issue.

The bogus interview side of this is what I don't think has a ton of merit and waters down other more important issues.

In every industry, people know who they want to hire in many circumstances. Sometimes the interviews of others are just to learn how other people do stuff. Just look at how many people the Steelers are interviewing for the GM role. Most of those guys have no chance, but the team is probably interviewing such a wide set of guys cause they want to learn what other things the Steelers should be considering/doing.

I suppose the good thing that came out of this lawsuit is it's already got the NFL talking about how to improve diversity. I think some of their ideas are already better hiring more people in lower tier positions to build a foundation of future talent to pick from.

I think they made this a class action thing so wide that anyone can join, but I'd prefer they focused on the more critical issues like the throwing of games which have a lot more merit imho. And that's not even getting into the interim coach that went 3-13 and got replaced. Complaining he didn't get enough time to succeed. How is that even a legit complaint? Most people would probably expect to get fired after a 3-13 season as a brand new HC. Unless you had your rookie QB coming in and you really were building everything from scratch and had a long term plan.

A lot of this stuff gets a little subjective and arguing over subjective stuff doesn't help the bigger cause imho.

[feltdizz]

While I'm supportive of diversity, I'm not sure I like the lawsuit that much.

Getting paid to lose games for a better draft pick sounds like a serious allegation. Getting pushed out/mistreated for not going along there seems like a legit issue. This is along the lines of Collin K never getting another opportunity which sounds like a real issue.

The bogus interview side of this is what I don't think has a ton of merit and waters down other more important issues.

In every industry, people know who they want to hire in many circumstances. Sometimes the interviews of others are just to learn how other people do stuff. Just look at how many people the Steelers are interviewing for the GM role. Most of those guys have no chance, but the team is probably interviewing such a wide set of guys cause they want to learn what other things the Steelers should be considering/doing.

I suppose the good thing that came out of this lawsuit is it's already got the NFL talking about how to improve diversity. I think some of their ideas are already better hiring more people in lower tier positions to build a foundation of future talent to pick from.

I think they made this a class action thing so wide that anyone can join, but I'd prefer they focused on the more critical issues like the throwing of games which have a lot more merit imho. And that's not even getting into the interim coach that went 3-13 and got replaced. Complaining he didn't get enough time to succeed. How is that even a legit complaint? Most people would probably expect to get fired after a 3-13 season as a brand new HC. Unless you had your rookie QB coming in and you really were building everything from scratch and had a long term plan.

A lot of this stuff gets a little subjective and arguing over subjective stuff doesn't help the bigger cause imho.

nah.. I think you are missing the point. While I agree you can’t force owners to hire someone they don’t want to this lawsuit is about the spirit of the rule.

Its one thing to know who you want to hire while conducting sham interviews. TELLING the candidate not to worry because they already got the gig but have to conduct sham interviews is the admission Flores needed. Bill Billicheat mistakingly texting Flores about the Giants job also works in Flores’ favor but I will admit I’m not sure of the Giants timeline.

and yes, firing a HC after 1 season going 3-13 with a gutted roster is a bad look. I think a HC should get 3 years minimum unless the whole locker room is against that guy. I would think your hiring practices are a bit suspect if you hired an absolute failure.

[flippy]

nah.. I think you are missing the point. While I agree you can’t force owners to hire someone they don’t want to this lawsuit is about the spirit of the rule.

Its one thing to know who you want to hire while conducting sham interviews. TELLING the candidate not to worry because they already got the gig but have to conduct sham interviews is the admission Flores needed. Bill Billicheat mistakingly texting Flores about the Giants job also works in Flores’ favor but I will admit I’m not sure of the Giants timeline.

and yes, firing a HC after 1 season going 3-13 with a gutted roster is a bad look. I think a HC should get 3 years minimum unless the whole locker room is against that guy. I would think your hiring practices are a bit suspect if you hired an absolute failure.

I'm with you in the it sucks, but I just see it as a flaw in the system and not something worthy of a class action lawsuit. I don't see how the lawsuit changes this. It really will likely just make teams more cautious about what they say and they'll keep doing what they do.

And then I don't think it's just black coaches that get sham interviews. I think this happens to everyone to some degree and even beyond football.

On the other hand, I think the pay to lose plan in Miami is a much bigger deal that really brings integrity of the league into question. And that comes across as potentially try to bully a minority into doing something wrong which feels a lot worse to me. And you can make the case that lots of different folks in different jobs get put into a situation where they get coerced into doing something in their job that they don't agree with. Maybe that's not a racial thing, but it feels different because there's limited black HCs and you're asking one of the few to do something wrong while they're facing an uphill battle of belonging and breaking thru in the coaching ranks.

If these things were easy to figure out what's right vs wrong, there wouldn't be a need for the lawsuit so there's that too.

But there must be some merit cause the NFL is proactively attempting to address the issue in other areas. Sure it's just PR, but some of it can make an impact and I think they're trying to cover themselves on the backend to give them something positive to point to.

[Chucktownsteeler]

I have to agree with Flippy here. He is spot on.

[feltdizz]

I'm with you in the it sucks, but I just see it as a flaw in the system and not something worthy of a class action lawsuit. I don't see how the lawsuit changes this. It really will likely just make teams more cautious about what they say and they'll keep doing what they do.

And then I don't think it's just black coaches that get sham interviews. I think this happens to everyone to some degree and even beyond football.

On the other hand, I think the pay to lose plan in Miami is a much bigger deal that really brings integrity of the league into question. And that comes across as potentially try to bully a minority into doing something wrong which feels a lot worse to me. And you can make the case that lots of different folks in different jobs get put into a situation where they get coerced into doing something in their job that they don't agree with. Maybe that's not a racial thing, but it feels different because there's limited black HCs and you're asking one of the few to do something wrong while they're facing an uphill battle of belonging and breaking thru in the coaching ranks.

If these things were easy to figure out what's right vs wrong, there wouldn't be a need for the lawsuit so there's that too.

But there must be some merit cause the NFL is proactively attempting to address the issue in other areas. Sure it's just PR, but some of it can make an impact and I think they're trying to cover themselves on the backend to give them something positive to point to.

The pay to lose is easier for people to swallow because it doesn’t involve race.

Not sure what white coaches not getting hired has to do with this lawsuit. No one ever said every white coach gets hired and never gets fired.

[Chucktownsteeler]

My last 2 bosses called me to discuss their job before they were even interviewed. Sham interviews are prevalent in every industry and happen everyday. You'd have to be a Pollyanna to think otherwise.

[steeler_fan_in_t.o.]

Former Steeler DB coach Ray Horton has joined Flores lawsuit according to some sources. Can't believe the authors of the Rooney rule were discriminating him but who knows?

I believe that Horton was one of the minority candidates interviewed for the job that was already Mularkey's, and that is his claim.

[steeler_fan_in_t.o.]

My last 2 bosses called me to discuss their job before they were even interviewed. Sham interviews are prevalent in every industry and happen everyday. You'd have to be a Pollyanna to think otherwise.

And government.

How many jobs go to someone's brother-in-law? How even do you think that interview process was?