Ben, MR and Duck

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  • SteelerMaine83
    Starter
    • Feb 2013
    • 826

    Ben, MR and Duck

    With 6 games left in the season, some thoughts on our QB situation, now and in the future.

    Ben-I kind of feel like Bens elbow was never good this year. He almost seemed to short-arm a number of passes and didn’t have the accuracy. I know he generallyt is a little slow getting to speed in the early season almost every year, but he just didn’t seem right to me. That said, if he has a good recovery, he will be our starter in 2020.

    MR-needs to show something this week and the rest of the year. If we win the next few and are in the playoff hunt, Id keep him in there. If he falters and our playoff chances fizzle, I’d let Duck play the last 2-3 games. Mason seems to lack confidence, timing, accuracy and velocity. He’s incredibly frustrating, and doesn’t seem to have an ounce of ”it” factor (like Wilson, Rogers, Brees, etc). If he throws 25 he passes a game, 10 are of the ”excuse me/pardon me ” type (like he’s trying to throw and catch the ball at the same time), 5 are prayers (20 yards or more), 5 are check downs, and 5 are grip and rip (I.e. confident). I just doubt he’ll ever get to the point where he will grip and rip over 50% of the time. I appreciate his caution, but can’t see him being more than a capable if unspectacular #2. His ceiling is no more than Neil O’Donnell , if that high. Wish it were different.

    Duck-I’d sign him up to be our #3 for the next 10 years today, if I could. I’d feel perfectly fine if injuries forced him to be #2 a few times a year. Smart, confident, accurate. Lacks size and arm-strength.

    Future-Ben is next years starter unless the injury is career ending. Mason is a capable #2, but I don’t think he’s Bens heir apparent. And as I said, I’d keep Duck around forever as my #3 and occasional #2.

    So, with our first pick in 2020 a #2, I don‘t see us getting Bens replacement next year. I also think, based on years of tracking actual 1st round QB picks, that getting a franchise QB who also has “it” is rare.

    It may be awhile (just wait to see how long it takes the Pats after Brady’s gone). Only succession of QBs with ”it” that I can personally recall in the NFL is Montana-Young. Think about that...
  • The Man of Steel
    Pro Bowler
    • Dec 2009
    • 2236

    #2
    With hindsight being 20/20 we could have easily drafted Lamar Jackson. Now LJ and his team are going to own the AFC North for the next 5-6 years.
    Obviously the standard is the standard.

    Comment

    • pittpete
      Legend
      • Aug 2008
      • 6825

      #3
      Not defending Rudolphs play but who has stepped up on offense to help him out?
      Holton cant catch
      JuJu has dropped quite a few passes
      McDonald gets no separation
      We have a non existant running game
      sigpic

      Comment

      • Starlifter
        Legend
        • May 2008
        • 5078

        #4
        Originally posted by The Man of Steel
        With hindsight being 20/20 we could have easily drafted Lamar Jackson. Now LJ and his team are going to own the AFC North for the next 5-6 years.
        it's possible. but i saw a stat comparing LJ to the best running QB's of all time - none of them every won anything of significance. His ability to pass accurately (which seems promising) is his future in my opinion. A couple of years running like this and if that's all he has - i'm not sold on his long-term viability.
        2014 MNF EXEC CHAMPION!!!

        Comment

        • papillon
          Legend
          • Mar 2008
          • 11340

          #5
          Originally posted by SteelerMaine83
          With 6 games left in the season, some thoughts on our QB situation, now and in the future.

          Ben-I kind of feel like Bens elbow was never good this year. He almost seemed to short-arm a number of passes and didn’t have the accuracy. I know he generallyt is a little slow getting to speed in the early season almost every year, but he just didn’t seem right to me. That said, if he has a good recovery, he will be our starter in 2020.

          MR-needs to show something this week and the rest of the year. If we win the next few and are in the playoff hunt, Id keep him in there. If he falters and our playoff chances fizzle, I’d let Duck play the last 2-3 games. Mason seems to lack confidence, timing, accuracy and velocity. He’s incredibly frustrating, and doesn’t seem to have an ounce of ”it” factor (like Wilson, Rogers, Brees, etc). If he throws 25 he passes a game, 10 are of the ”excuse me/pardon me ” type (like he’s trying to throw and catch the ball at the same time), 5 are prayers (20 yards or more), 5 are check downs, and 5 are grip and rip (I.e. confident). I just doubt he’ll ever get to the point where he will grip and rip over 50% of the time. I appreciate his caution, but can’t see him being more than a capable if unspectacular #2. His ceiling is no more than Neil O’Donnell , if that high. Wish it were different.

          Duck-I’d sign him up to be our #3 for the next 10 years today, if I could. I’d feel perfectly fine if injuries forced him to be #2 a few times a year. Smart, confident, accurate. Lacks size and arm-strength.

          Future-Ben is next years starter unless the injury is career ending. Mason is a capable #2, but I don’t think he’s Bens heir apparent. And as I said, I’d keep Duck around forever as my #3 and occasional #2.

          So, with our first pick in 2020 a #2, I don‘t see us getting Bens replacement next year. I also think, based on years of tracking actual 1st round QB picks, that getting a franchise QB who also has “it” is rare.

          It may be awhile (just wait to see how long it takes the Pats after Brady’s gone). Only succession of QBs with ”it” that I can personally recall in the NFL is Montana-Young. Think about that...
          If MR struggles tomorrow in the 1st half and the Steelers are losing, I hope they put Duck in for the 2nd half to try and win the game. I wouldn't wait at this point if they still have aspirations of being in the playoffs.

          Pappy
          sigpic

          The 2025 Pittsburgh Steeler draft

          1.21 - Derrick Harmon, DT, Oregon - Nick Emmanwori, S, S. Carolina
          3.83 - Kaleb Johnson, RB, Iowa - DJ Giddens, RB, Kans St
          3.123 - Will Howard, QB, OSU
          4.156 - JJ Pegues, DT, Ole Miss
          5.185 - Clay Webb, OG, Jack St
          7.229 - Tyrion Ingram-Dawkins, DT, Georgia

          "Football is a physical game, well, it used to be anyways" - Mel Blount

          Comment

          • Northern_Blitz
            Legend
            • Dec 2008
            • 24373

            #6
            Originally posted by pittpete
            Not defending Rudolphs play but who has stepped up on offense to help him out?
            Holton cant catch
            JuJu has dropped quite a few passes
            McDonald gets no separation
            We have a non existant running game
            I think Juju has 2 drops.

            Comment

            • Disco1981
              Pro Bowler
              • Apr 2017
              • 1635

              #7
              Originally posted by papillon
              If MR struggles tomorrow in the 1st half and the Steelers are losing, I hope they put Duck in for the 2nd half to try and win the game. I wouldn't wait at this point if they still have aspirations of being in the playoffs.

              Pappy
              IF this happens...I would see NO reason not to!

              Comment

              • Ernie
                Legend
                • Aug 2013
                • 8470

                #8
                Originally posted by pittpete
                Not defending Rudolphs play but who has stepped up on offense to help him out?
                Holton cant catch
                JuJu has dropped quite a few passes
                McDonald gets no separation
                We have a non existant running game
                The answer is nobody. MR could be a decent QB with a solid supporting cast. Its unfortunate that his first (and lasting) impression is coming with such a talent depleted unit

                Comment

                • Oviedo
                  Legend
                  • May 2008
                  • 23824

                  #9
                  Originally posted by pittpete
                  Not defending Rudolphs play but who has stepped up on offense to help him out?
                  Holton cant catch
                  JuJu has dropped quite a few passes
                  McDonald gets no separation
                  We have a non existant running game
                  This is true. MR has had little to no help while trying to learn on the job. If we had healthy RBs the story might be different. I have to say, I am disappointed with the WRs this season. Their performance deserves as much if not more scrutiny than MR

                  I still think MR will be a solid NFL starter along the lines of a Derek Carr. He can win games but won't be able to do it on his own.
                  "My team, may they always be right, but right or wrong...MY TEAM!"

                  Comment

                  • SteelerMaine83
                    Starter
                    • Feb 2013
                    • 826

                    #10
                    Originally posted by Oviedo
                    This is true. MR has had little to no help while trying to learn on the job. If we had healthy RBs the story might be different. I have to say, I am disappointed with the WRs this season. Their performance deserves as much if not more scrutiny than MR

                    I still think MR will be a solid NFL starter along the lines of a Derek Carr. He can win games but won't be able to do it on his own.
                    I totally agree that injuries and the level of play of his supporting cast have been a great detriment to his development and play, but I also don’t like a number of things I see in him on a consistent basis, such as inability to read what’s going on and the ability to put it in a tight window like NFL QBs have to, as well as his lack of pocket presence.

                    Does Derek Carr = Neil O’Donnell?!

                    Comment

                    • Oh wow
                      Hall of Famer
                      • Mar 2019
                      • 2753

                      #11
                      Originally posted by Oviedo
                      This is true. MR has had little to no help while trying to learn on the job. If we had healthy RBs the story might be different. I have to say, I am disappointed with the WRs this season. Their performance deserves as much if not more scrutiny than MR

                      I still think MR will be a solid NFL starter along the lines of a Derek Carr. He can win games but won't be able to do it on his own.
                      Derek Carr?

                      No, I don’t think MR is going to be that good.

                      Comment

                      • Northern_Blitz
                        Legend
                        • Dec 2008
                        • 24373

                        #12
                        Originally posted by Oviedo
                        This is true. MR has had little to no help while trying to learn on the job. If we had healthy RBs the story might be different. I have to say, I am disappointed with the WRs this season. Their performance deserves as much if not more scrutiny than MR

                        I still think MR will be a solid NFL starter along the lines of a Derek Carr. He can win games but won't be able to do it on his own.
                        I hope you're right, but I don't really think there's much evidence.

                        Maybe it's the WRs. But when it looks like it's all the receivers, it may be the QB.

                        Comment

                        • SteelerMaine83
                          Starter
                          • Feb 2013
                          • 826

                          #13
                          Originally posted by Northern_Blitz
                          I hope you're right, but I don't really think there's much evidence.

                          Maybe it's the WRs. But when it looks like it's all the receivers, it may be the QB.
                          Yeah, agreed. He’s had a lot of opportunities to throw the ball into spots an NFL QB needs to be able to throw and complete passes. He’s slow to read, react, and his physical skills aren’t able to compensate (take a look at the spots where Mahomes throws the ball). MR needs to be really good at the mental aspects of the game because his physical skills are only average, at best.

                          Comment

                          • flippy
                            Legend
                            • Dec 2008
                            • 17088

                            #14
                            I'd start Duck now.
                            sigpic

                            Comment

                            • SteelerMaine83
                              Starter
                              • Feb 2013
                              • 826

                              #15
                              Originally posted by flippy
                              I'd start Duck now.
                              Tempted, Flippy.

                              But...I’ll give MR a shot to prove himself the next two weeks. First, against a division rival and the worst team in the league, then against the Stains, which will test his ability to deal with adrenaline and distractions. If he can’t show something in these two games, his career will be meh at best.

                              However, if he sucks the tailpipe today and we are in danger of losing, Duck should be going in...

                              Comment

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