Think about this for a moment...

[FreePassCra$h]

Trust needs to be established and it has been.

Ben wasn't some rookie, that was his 9th season in the league as a three time AFC Champion and the owner of two rings. If I was Ben and I was forbidden to audible by a guy who never played a down of football? I probably would have retired on the spot.

Do you think Ben now has the same desire and competitive spirit of 28 yo Ben?

Nope.

All they have to do to get that back? Fire Haley, promote Fichtner, and hire Batch as the QB coach.

This offense sucks. It's too easy to defend.

[Shawn]

I would have gladly given them Gronk if we could have had Bryant, Bell, and Green....

Yeah no kidding.

[Captain Lemming]

Give Ben Brady's system and the commitment from the FO that Brady has.

Saddle Brady with Todd Haley and his tricks, and LeBeau and Butler.

What happens?

Ben "saddled" with Lebeau resulted in 2 Super Bowl wins and 3 appearances Crash.
He is the most consistent factor in EVERY post 70s Steeler Super Bowl appearance INCLUDING pre-Ben.
Ben is awesome Crash, but he has not sniffed a Super Bowl with anything less than a dominant LEBEAU LED defense.

As Lebeau goes, so go the Steelers. We can only hope one day to match what he did for the defense.

Ben needs to be forever thankful for Dick Lebeau.

[NorthCoast]

Ben "saddled" with Lebeau resulted in 2 Super Bowl wins and 3 appearances Crash.
He is the most consistent factor in EVERY post 70s Steeler Super Bowl appearance INCLUDING pre-Ben.
Ben is awesome Crash, but he has not sniffed a Super Bowl with anything less than a dominant LEBEAU LED defense.

As Lebeau goes, so go the Steelers. We can only hope one day to match what he did for the defense.

Ben needs to be forever thankful for Dick Lebeau.

Agreed Captain. The only time the Steelers have played in a SB in the last 35 yrs is when the defense has been ranked top 2. Which then begs the question why spend any more draft picks on offense when the way to get to the end game is defense?

[FreePassCra$h]

Ben "saddled" with Lebeau resulted in 2 Super Bowl wins and 3 appearances Crash.
He is the most consistent factor in EVERY post 70s Steeler Super Bowl appearance INCLUDING pre-Ben.
Ben is awesome Crash, but he has not sniffed a Super Bowl with anything less than a dominant LEBEAU LED defense.

As Lebeau goes, so go the Steelers. We can only hope one day to match what he did for the defense.

Ben needs to be forever thankful for Dick Lebeau.

Actually it's the opposite, they blew 4th quarter leads three times in Ben's first six games of 2005. Ben saved them twice. He only does it once? No playoffs.

The Steelers defense sucked ass in Cincy in the first half, had the offense not scored two TD's in their first four possessions to keep it close? They lose.

They were one Vanderject shank away from OT, and giving up 18 points in that 4th quarter after Cowher tried to turtle.

The 4th quarter of XLIII speaks for itself. As does the bad defense they were in 1995 also.

If not for Ben? Dick LeBeau's claim to fame would have been the biggest choke job in SB history, AFTER giving Joe Montana a legendary drive almost 20 years earlier.

[FreePassCra$h]

Agreed Captain. The only time the Steelers have played in a SB in the last 35 yrs is when the defense has been ranked top 2. Which then begs the question why spend any more draft picks on offense when the way to get to the end game is defense?

Because the whole mantra for the offense is to keep the defense OFF the field.

Why spend on defense when it's the offense who protects them?

Ben made Dick LeBeau a legend and a lot of defensive players rich. Their "ranking" on defense means squat.

[feltdizz]

Nah... the defense protect the offense A LOT during our SB runs. We had 10 or so quarters where we didn't score a TD.

Ben even admitted he was embarrassed because the O was slacking while the D was keeping us in ballgames.

2009 was parhetic and out D definitely had issues as we got older but our O squandered a ton of opportunities in the RZ with BA.

[Real Deal Steel]

Nah... the defense protect the offense A LOT during our SB runs. We had 10 or so quarters where we didn't score a TD.

Ben even admitted he was embarrassed because the O was slacking while the D was keeping us in ballgames.

2009 was parhetic and out D definitely had issues as we got older but our O squandered a ton of opportunities in the RZ with BA.

This is what I also remember

[FreePassCra$h]

Nah... the defense protect the offense A LOT during our SB runs. We had 10 or so quarters where we didn't score a TD.

Ben even admitted he was embarrassed because the O was slacking while the D was keeping us in ballgames.

2009 was parhetic and out D definitely had issues as we got older but our O squandered a ton of opportunities in the RZ with BA.

20 blown fourth quarter leads from 2007-week five 2012. 2nd in the NFL. That was just the losses. Doesn't count when they'd blow a lead and the offense saved them.

Of course Ben took the blame. Always does. Unlike the millionaire's club on defense.

[feltdizz]

20 blown fourth quarter leads from 2007-week five 2012. 2nd in the NFL. That was just the losses. Doesn't count when they'd blow a lead and the offense saved them.

Of course Ben took the blame. Always does. Unlike the millionaire's club on defense.

Ben rarely took the blame. It was always BA who took the blame and some of it was warranted. I think you have to prove these were 20 "blown" leads. Were these all 80 yard drives? How many were on short fields due to turnovers?

I'm not suggesting the D didn't have issues but I'm talking about our SB runs. Our D was always top 5 when we made those appearances.

As far as the D taking blame. We released Casey Hampton, Woodley, Haggans, Farrior, Ike, Troy... and I'm pretty sure all of them wanted to keep playing. We also got rid of DL.

[FreePassCra$h]

Ben rarely took the blame.

Have you ever heard Ben speak after a game? Took the heat, deflects the praise. Always has.

Were these all 80 yard drives?

Most of them, yes. A lot of them, were blowing leads right after we took it. And that's just in the 4th quarter. "Give back points" has been an issue with this defense for the entire Ben Era. That's why they rarely blew teams out.

How many were on short fields due to turnovers?

Not as many as you think. Christ Paul Zeise of the PG asked me how many of the blown 4th quarter leads in 2009 were the result of a Ben INT?

Ben didn't throw one pick, in the 4th quarter, that entire season.

As far as the D taking blame. We released Casey Hampton, Woodley, Haggans, Farrior, Ike, Troy... and I'm pretty sure all of them wanted to keep playing. We also got rid of DL.

You're talking about guys who were at the END of their careers.

I'M saying, the problems they had on defense, were always there, during the PRIME of their careers.

Blown 4th quarter leads and give back points.

Happened all the time. Regardless of in their prime, or past it.

[feltdizz]

Dude, you keep bringing up 2009 when I already said 2009 the D was trash. It was disgusting.

Can we we talk about 2008 and 2005? Those defenses were pretty damn impressive whether you want to admit it or not.

[FreePassCra$h]

Dude, you keep bringing up 2009 when I already said 2009 the D was trash. It was disgusting.

Can we we talk about 2008 and 2005? Those defenses were pretty damn impressive whether you want to admit it or not.

2005 they blew three 4th quarter leads in Ben's first six games. Ben saved them twice. Everyone talks about Ben's picks when Cincy won the division, and they ignore the THREE TIMES the offense scored, only to see the defense go right back on the field and give the points right back. Season on the line in week 17? The defense gave up points twice, after the Steelers scored themselves.

2008? Jacksonville, SD I, Ravens I, Super Bowl, I did not count Colts when Ben threw a late pick. But then again, Ike let a pick go through his hands for a Wayne TD (14 point swing), and Troy dropped a sure fire pick 6. They make those two plays the game is not even close.

Offense can't keep them off the field all day. At some point they have to go on the field and make a play.

Blown leads and give back points. Always been this way. But all people cared about is the defense's "rank" without putting it in context. Now, they do the same thing to defend certified Football Genius Todd Haley and his bull**** offense.

And I said THIS.....before Todd Haley ever coached a game here:

"Haley is Dick LeBeau's worst nightmare. Because now, if his 4th quarter scheme continues to blow? He'll be the one getting the heat because they won't dare bash the Yinzer"

-Crash 6/28/2012

And that's exactly what happened.

And another poster said this:

"It real easy to say the defense carried us to SB's but that wasnt the case"

-feltdizz 6/28/2016

Why the sudden change?