Jarvis Jones is a turtle

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  • hawaiiansteel
    Legend
    • May 2008
    • 35649

    #46
    Originally posted by Chadman
    Fair enough. Do you hold Damontre Moore in the same regard?
    didn't Moore only put up 12 bench presses at the Combine?

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    • Chadman
      Legend
      • May 2008
      • 6537

      #47
      Originally posted by hawaiiansteel
      didn't Moore only put up 12 bench presses at the Combine?
      Yeah, and 19 at his Pro Day.

      watching the tape on both, Moore looks to have more moves-more ability to attack inside at the least- than Jones, and Jones had the added advantage of playing on a stacked Defense, while Moore was pretty much the Lone Ranger on D at Texas A&M.

      So the question still sits- why Jones but not Moore?
      The people that are trying to make the world worse never take a day off, why should I?

      Light up the darkness.

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      • JUST-PLAIN-NASTY
        Hall of Famer
        • May 2008
        • 3937

        #48
        I think Jones and Moore may both be on the board at #17. I think Jones and Moore may both be on the board at #18.

        The Steelers should show lots of interest in both so someone comes & gets them.

        Neither will see the field for the Steelers in 2013 as a full time starter. I thought Jones was more explosive in his movements than Moore but Jones does struggle against the run and disengageing. I think both will have to better their playing strength before they will compete on a high level. Besides his medical & his age, the one thing Jones has working against him is his position flexability. Jones's best trait is his ability to rush the passer so you project him to 3-4 OLB because he doesn't appear to have much room for growth and appears undersized to play 4-3 DE. If you move him to WIL to keep him clean you take him away from what he can do best. Moore is 20 years old right now and will be 21 at season start. He has room to grow on his frame which is at 250 right now. Teams could view Moore fitting in both but Jones could be a "right fit" player which may cause him to slide.

        Don't want either at #17.

        Comment

        • SteelerOfDeVille
          Legend
          • May 2008
          • 9069

          #49
          Originally posted by Chadman
          Must admit- his gametape & workout tape don't seem to be similar at all.
          Question for the pro-Jones people- does the same argument pro-Jones hold true for Damontre Moore, who looks good on tape but really bad in workouts?
          I haven't been excited about Moore's tape... he got a lot of Gildong-type sacks in the youtube vids i've seen. that's the difference... motor... i'm always a pro-motor guy..
          2013 MNF Executive Champion!

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          • phillyesq
            Legend
            • May 2008
            • 7568

            #50
            Originally posted by SteelerOfDeVille
            I haven't been excited about Moore's tape... he got a lot of Gildong-type sacks in the youtube vids i've seen. that's the difference... motor... i'm always a pro-motor guy..
            I haven't watched his tape, but I know that Wexell was very unimpressed with his tape as well. From what I've read on Moore, I don't want him at 17, and I'm not sure that I'd want him in the second, either.

            Comment

            • SteelerOfDeVille
              Legend
              • May 2008
              • 9069

              #51
              Originally posted by phillyesq
              I haven't watched his tape, but I know that Wexell was very unimpressed with his tape as well. From what I've read on Moore, I don't want him at 17, and I'm not sure that I'd want him in the second, either.
              did a quick youtube search on him... came away thinking, "no freaking way this is the guy... these are HIGHLIGHTS and it's the best they got? 'Zo Jackson all over again!" Seemed to get a high number of coverage sacks.
              2013 MNF Executive Champion!

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              • papillon
                Legend
                • Mar 2008
                • 11340

                #52
                Based on all the information that I am reading here and how unimpressive this draft is after the top 10-12 picks and the many Steeler needs I'm hoping they can formulate some type of trade back scenario and get an extra pick in the 2ns or 3rd round. No one seems to be impressed with any players other than the ones that are certain to be drafted in the top 10 picks or so.

                Pappy
                sigpic

                The 2025 Pittsburgh Steeler draft

                1.21 - Derrick Harmon, DT, Oregon - Nick Emmanwori, S, S. Carolina
                3.83 - Kaleb Johnson, RB, Iowa - DJ Giddens, RB, Kans St
                3.123 - Will Howard, QB, OSU
                4.156 - JJ Pegues, DT, Ole Miss
                5.185 - Clay Webb, OG, Jack St
                7.229 - Tyrion Ingram-Dawkins, DT, Georgia

                "Football is a physical game, well, it used to be anyways" - Mel Blount

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                • Oviedo
                  Legend
                  • May 2008
                  • 23824

                  #53
                  Too much risk taking an OLB "who has to be converted and developed" for LeBeau's defense at #17. None of these guys are sure things so if you have to develop them get them later.

                  Go with the sure thing in TE Tyler Eifert.
                  "My team, may they always be right, but right or wrong...MY TEAM!"

                  Comment

                  • SteelerOfDeVille
                    Legend
                    • May 2008
                    • 9069

                    #54
                    Originally posted by Oviedo
                    Too much risk taking an OLB "who has to be converted and developed" for LeBeau's defense at #17. None of these guys are sure things so if you have to develop them get them later.

                    Go with the sure thing in TE Tyler Eifert.
                    Jones is a pre-combine top 5 pick by many... If he's there at 17, you just take him and move on... no converting - he's already a linebacker. No sense in taking a backup TE...
                    2013 MNF Executive Champion!

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                    • Sugar
                      Hall of Famer
                      • Oct 2008
                      • 3700

                      #55
                      Originally posted by SteelerOfDeVille
                      Jones is a pre-combine top 5 pick by many... If he's there at 17, you just take him and move on... no converting - he's already a linebacker. No sense in taking a backup TE...
                      A backup TE wasn't suggested. Eifert was and he would start day one with Heath on the sidelines. I don't think Spaeth would beat him out in camp.

                      Comment

                      • hawaiiansteel
                        Legend
                        • May 2008
                        • 35649

                        #56
                        Originally posted by SteelerOfDeVille
                        Jones is a pre-combine top 5 pick by many... If he's there at 17, you just take him and move on... no converting - he's already a linebacker.
                        I agree.

                        what Jarvis Jones does best is rush the passer, something the Steelers defense is predicated upon.

                        Comment

                        • Chadman
                          Legend
                          • May 2008
                          • 6537

                          #57
                          Originally posted by SteelerOfDeVille
                          did a quick youtube search on him... came away thinking, "no freaking way this is the guy... these are HIGHLIGHTS and it's the best they got? 'Zo Jackson all over again!" Seemed to get a high number of coverage sacks.
                          Ok, Chadman understands what you are saying from the highlights clips on youtube. But there are a few things to consider about the difference between Jones & Moore:

                          Jones was on a stacked defense, with several prospects predicted to be top 3 round picks, while there are 0 prospects outside of Moore from Texas A&M. Moore was the lone star player on the Aggies defense, which one would assume means he'd face consistantly tougher blocking on an individual basis than Jones.

                          Moore's sacks came mostly against top-tier teams, with sacks against strong O-Lines like Alabama, LSU & Mississippi St.

                          The variety of moves Moore uses is far more diverse than most of the other top pass rushers who predominantly use outside speed rushing. Only Mingo is close, statistically, to Moore for QB sacks from moves going inside the Tackles.

                          Moore is 20 years old. 20. The Steelers value these young players highly.

                          Check out this article- interesting reading:

                          [URL]http://secondroundstats.com/2013/02/27/pass-rushers-pt1/[/URL]
                          The people that are trying to make the world worse never take a day off, why should I?

                          Light up the darkness.

                          Comment

                          • SteelerOfDeVille
                            Legend
                            • May 2008
                            • 9069

                            #58
                            Originally posted by Sugar
                            A backup TE wasn't suggested. Eifert was and he would start day one with Heath on the sidelines. I don't think Spaeth would beat him out in camp.
                            so, heath is the most subpar of the 22 starters?
                            2013 MNF Executive Champion!

                            Comment

                            • SteelerOfDeVille
                              Legend
                              • May 2008
                              • 9069

                              #59
                              Originally posted by Chadman
                              Ok, Chadman understands what you are saying from the highlights clips on youtube. But there are a few things to consider about the difference between Jones & Moore:

                              Jones was on a stacked defense, with several prospects predicted to be top 3 round picks, while there are 0 prospects outside of Moore from Texas A&M. Moore was the lone star player on the Aggies defense, which one would assume means he'd face consistantly tougher blocking on an individual basis than Jones.

                              Moore's sacks came mostly against top-tier teams, with sacks against strong O-Lines like Alabama, LSU & Mississippi St.

                              The variety of moves Moore uses is far more diverse than most of the other top pass rushers who predominantly use outside speed rushing. Only Mingo is close, statistically, to Moore for QB sacks from moves going inside the Tackles.

                              Moore is 20 years old. 20. The Steelers value these young players highly.

                              Check out this article- interesting reading:

                              [URL]http://secondroundstats.com/2013/02/27/pass-rushers-pt1/[/URL]
                              Nice article, interesting breakdown... By those stats, Okafor sounds like the best of the best... what's more fascinating, is i'm pretty sure he was also a 4.9 guy...
                              2013 MNF Executive Champion!

                              Comment

                              • Sugar
                                Hall of Famer
                                • Oct 2008
                                • 3700

                                #60
                                Originally posted by SteelerOfDeVille
                                so, heath is the most subpar of the 22 starters?
                                He is when he's in the training room rehabbing a gimpy leg. Unless he's not as good as advertised or Spaeth has dramatically improved, Eifert starts game #1.

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