the guys in stripes......

[Starlifter]

I'll apologize from the start because I don't want this to be a post or thread about politics - but if I don't vent about the officiating in the NFL and the hypocrisy I just won't be able to sleep tonight.

I don't care what side of labor you fall on. support unions, don't support unions - that's not the point of the thread. What is happening however with the officials is disgusting. They call it PRO football because it's not for amateurs. It's easy to crap on the refs, but they are professionals as well and an integral part of the game. The guys they have now are amateurs. They are NOT professionals. They call them replacements. I've heard some union guys refer to them as a four letter word. After watching first hand their performance today, I'm going with the latter. What angers me most is the NFL is consciously putting an INFERIOR product on the field. We're not talking about hundreds of players and tens of millions of dollars. How many refs are there in the union? around 125? I'm not suggesting caving in, but locking them out??? keep the talks going but preserve the integrity of the season.

which brings me to the players. specifically the NFLPA. I seem to recall very recently NFL players walking to the middle of the field and holding up a finger to show Roger Goodell they were unified against him. good for them. It worked out well and they all got paid. It does seem hypocritical the silence from the players regarding the officials. the NFLPA is no fan of Goodell. If they stood with the refs instead of watching from the sidelines - I'm pretty sure there might be some movement. The NFL is all about the money. This lockout hasn't cost them a nickel. Until it does, we're stuck with the crap we saw today.

Today was horrible. not just for our game but listening Sirius afterwards it sounds like it was an epidemic. It's not enough to say the refs suck but at least they suck for both teams. That's a crap excuse. often times a season comes down to one game, one play. We were 12-4 last year and a wildcard. think that made a difference? think one game won't make a difference this year?

anyway, end of rant.

thank god we won.

[fordfixer]

[url]http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/Replacement-officials-mistakes-NFL-starts-to-suffer-091612[/url]


NFL Suffering With Replacements

by Mike Pereira


UPDATED SEP 17, 2012 12:17 AM ET

I'm officially over it.





I know it just began, but it's time for it to end and you all know what I'm talking about. I don't really care what the issues are or which side has the more legitimate argument, the NFL needs the real referees back on the field.


There were a lot of upsets in Weak 2 — yes, I spelled weak correctly — from the results of games to results of the calls made on the field. NFL players are the best in the business. The real NFL referees are the best in the business, too. The two sides need to get together — now.


There are so many little things that took place Sunday that they are all starting to add up to big things.


From not penalizing a coach for challenging a play that couldn't be challenged (Washington-St. Louis) to allowing the clock to run after an incomplete pass (Cleveland-Cincinnati) to calling a chop block that wasn't a chop block (Dallas-Seattle) to calling an incomplete pass that should have been ruled intentional grounding (Oakland-Miami).


Unfortunately, this list goes on and on …



I'm not saying the replacement refs aren't trying their best, because they are. A look at the average penalties called during Week 2 won't differ much from Week 1, but much of the confusion that reigned supreme came from the replacements just not knowing the rules the way the regular officials do.


You can't expect replacements to know the intricacies of the NFL rule book in two weeks on the job. It takes years. But it doesn't take long — two weeks — to see this is not working.


Let's look at three plays in particular that kind of sum up the day:


WASHINGTON AT ST. LOUIS
Situation: St. Louis had the ball, second-and-1 at the Washington 1-yard line with 9:09 left in the second quarter. Washington led 14-3.


Rams running back Steven Jackson rushed for no gain. He fumbled on the play and it was recovered by the Redskins. St. Louis challenged the fumble ruling and the play was reversed.



This should never have happened. A coach is not allowed to challenge a play when a turnover is ruled on the field. It's an automatic 15-yard penalty. Also, depending on when the challenge flag came from St. Louis coach Jeff Fisher, the play likely shouldn't have been reviewed anyway. If Fisher threw the challenge flag before the replay official initiated the review, then a review is not allowable by rule. If the review is initiated first, before the challenge flag is thrown, it's still a 15-yard penalty, but you can review the play.


DALLAS AT SEATTLE.
Situation: Seattle had the ball, second-and-6 at the Dallas 22-yard line with 6:03 left in the second quarter. Seattle led 10-7.


Seahawks running back Marshawn Lynch rushed for one yard. A penalty was called on Seattle's J.R. Sweezy and Max Unger for a chop block against Marcus Spears.


This was not a chop block. The play would have been a foul in college and it was called by a former college official. However, in the NFL, it is legal to chop block a defender on the back side of a run if the two offensive lineman that chop are lined up next to each other at the snap. Sweezy was the right guard and Unger is the center. That's why it was a legal block and the foul shouldn't have been called.


CLEVELAND AT CINCINNATI.
Situation: Cincinnati had the ball, first-and-20 at the Bengals' 47-yard line with 3:25 left in the second quarter. Cincinnati led 17-10.


Cincinnati quarterback Andy Dalton attempted a short pass to A.J. Green that was incomplete. The clock continued to run when it shouldn't have.


The officials are responsible for monitoring the clock. The timer, who is located in the press box, should have stopped the clock but didn't. Officials are always told to keep their eyes on the clock and to correct it when necessary. It was necessary here. Twenty-nine seconds ran off the clock with 3:25 left to go in the second quarter. Cleveland had the ball at the end of the half and who knows what might have happened if the Browns had another 29 seconds to try and kick a field goal or even score a possible touchdown.


End this now. Please

[SDSteel1]

The only reason why it seems like the "replacement refs" suck more than the other refs is because the media is talking about how bad they suck. Otherwise there is no drop off, the refs have blown games year after year, and blow calls game after game but no one has ever held them accountable...especially the media. Now announcers and players are being verbal about the new guys. The refs are exactly the same. They are crappy, they make numerous mistakes, the over officiate, they are just plain bad, just like last year and the year before that. The only thing that has changed is now the announcers are calling them out.

[SDSteel1]

[url]http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/Replacement-officials-mistakes-NFL-starts-to-suffer-091612[/url]


NFL Suffering With Replacements

by Mike Pereira


UPDATED SEP 17, 2012 12:17 AM ET

I'm officially over it.





I know it just began, but it's time for it to end and you all know what I'm talking about. I don't really care what the issues are or which side has the more legitimate argument, the NFL needs the real referees back on the field.


There were a lot of upsets in Weak 2 — yes, I spelled weak correctly — from the results of games to results of the calls made on the field. NFL players are the best in the business. The real NFL referees are the best in the business, too. The two sides need to get together — now.


There are so many little things that took place Sunday that they are all starting to add up to big things.


From not penalizing a coach for challenging a play that couldn't be challenged (Washington-St. Louis) to allowing the clock to run after an incomplete pass (Cleveland-Cincinnati) to calling a chop block that wasn't a chop block (Dallas-Seattle) to calling an incomplete pass that should have been ruled intentional grounding (Oakland-Miami).


Unfortunately, this list goes on and on …



I'm not saying the replacement refs aren't trying their best, because they are. A look at the average penalties called during Week 2 won't differ much from Week 1, but much of the confusion that reigned supreme came from the replacements just not knowing the rules the way the regular officials do.


You can't expect replacements to know the intricacies of the NFL rule book in two weeks on the job. It takes years. But it doesn't take long — two weeks — to see this is not working.


Let's look at three plays in particular that kind of sum up the day:


WASHINGTON AT ST. LOUIS
Situation: St. Louis had the ball, second-and-1 at the Washington 1-yard line with 9:09 left in the second quarter. Washington led 14-3.


Rams running back Steven Jackson rushed for no gain. He fumbled on the play and it was recovered by the Redskins. St. Louis challenged the fumble ruling and the play was reversed.



This should never have happened. A coach is not allowed to challenge a play when a turnover is ruled on the field. It's an automatic 15-yard penalty. Also, depending on when the challenge flag came from St. Louis coach Jeff Fisher, the play likely shouldn't have been reviewed anyway. If Fisher threw the challenge flag before the replay official initiated the review, then a review is not allowable by rule. If the review is initiated first, before the challenge flag is thrown, it's still a 15-yard penalty, but you can review the play.


DALLAS AT SEATTLE.
Situation: Seattle had the ball, second-and-6 at the Dallas 22-yard line with 6:03 left in the second quarter. Seattle led 10-7.


Seahawks running back Marshawn Lynch rushed for one yard. A penalty was called on Seattle's J.R. Sweezy and Max Unger for a chop block against Marcus Spears.


This was not a chop block. The play would have been a foul in college and it was called by a former college official. However, in the NFL, it is legal to chop block a defender on the back side of a run if the two offensive lineman that chop are lined up next to each other at the snap. Sweezy was the right guard and Unger is the center. That's why it was a legal block and the foul shouldn't have been called.


CLEVELAND AT CINCINNATI.
Situation: Cincinnati had the ball, first-and-20 at the Bengals' 47-yard line with 3:25 left in the second quarter. Cincinnati led 17-10.


Cincinnati quarterback Andy Dalton attempted a short pass to A.J. Green that was incomplete. The clock continued to run when it shouldn't have.


The officials are responsible for monitoring the clock. The timer, who is located in the press box, should have stopped the clock but didn't. Officials are always told to keep their eyes on the clock and to correct it when necessary. It was necessary here. Twenty-nine seconds ran off the clock with 3:25 left to go in the second quarter. Cleveland had the ball at the end of the half and who knows what might have happened if the Browns had another 29 seconds to try and kick a field goal or even score a possible touchdown.


End this now. Please

Go figure long time ref Mike Pereira wrote this. They couldn't even get a coin flip right when he was missing calls.

[fordfixer]

Side judge pulled from Saints-Panthers game after his Facebook page showed Saints fandomBy Doug Farrar | Shutdown Corner


[url]http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-shutdown-corner/side-judge-pulled-saints-panthers-game-facebook-page-143323464--nfl.html[/url]


Through the current lockout of its game officials, the NFL has been emphatic all along that its replacement officials have passed all appropriate background checks. One would assume that the fill-in crews go through the same checks that the regular, locked-out refs do, but in at least one case, the NFL really dropped the ball. Brian Stropolo, a side judge assigned to work Sunday's game between the New Orleans Saints and Carolina Panthers, was pulled from the crew after it was discovered that his Facebook page shows him to be a hardcore Saints fan.
Ray Anderson, the NFL's executive vice president of football operations, told Stacey Dales of the NFL Network that while there was nothing "essentially improper" about Stropolo's specific allegiance, he was removed from the game as a "safe and appropriate measure" to avoid the appearance of impropriety.


According to ESPN's Chris Mortensen, Stropolo "proudly displays his Saints colors on his Facebook page," and the evidence is pretty clear. There's a waterfront shot in which Stropolo is wearing a Saints hat and windbreaker, and another where he's wearing a Saints hat in a shot with three other people. There's still another shot in which Stropolo is seen tailgating at the Superdome before a preseason game -- fortunately, we suppose, he wasn't working that one.
Mortensen reported that Stropolo actually traveled to the game with the rest of the officiating crew and was on the field for warmups when he was pulled from the game by an NFL representative.
Stropolo, who worked the 2012 season opener between the New York Giants and Dallas Cowboys, interacted with some Saints fans on his page after that first game. "Thanks to everyone for all the support," he wrote. "The crew did a great job tonight. Next stop September 16 at Carolina vs. the Saints."
One of Stropolo's Facebook friends replied, "Hey, now be nice with those yellow flags for our Saints!!"
"That's awesome you get to be an official for a Saints game!" another of Stopolo's Facebook freinds said. "I didn't think they would let you since your (sic) from Louisiana.


This is yet another embarrasment for the league in the ongoing battle with the NFLRA, and one can only imagine what the ramifications might have been had ESPN not notified the NFL of Stropolo's clear and obvious rooting interests. The NFL dodged a major bullet in the fight against the appearance of impropriety in this case, but if this is its actual vetting process, you can bet we'll hear of more shenanigans.
As ESPN's Tom Jackson pointed out on Sunday morning, none of the replacement officials were working Sundays before, and they all love football. So, it would stand to reason that they're all going to be NFL fans to some degree. That Stropolo did not disclose his specific rooting interest was bad enough, but that he made it this public is a clear blight on the NFL's consistent claims that the integrity of the league was above reproach.
"I'm going to look at worst-case scenario, and it's not an isolated incident," Jackson said on ESPN's "Sunday NFL Countdown."
"I think all of this puts in question the integrity of the league. Let's get the regular referees back doing the job they should be doing."
Now, if every blown call (and there will be many this Sunday and Monday) is associated with the possibility that some official is wearing a replica jersey under his stripes ... well, it's one more reason that the sooner this labor impasse is over, the better off everyone will be.
As usual, ESPN's Mike Ditka put it very succinctly: "Commissioner Goodell has his first headache, and this is a big headache. It's time to get the real guys back to work."

[Slapstick]

I look for a settlement soon. "Golden Boy" Bob Kraft is one of the owners holding the hardline against the refs. His team had a TD called back and ended up losing the game. Belicheat mentioned it in his post game presser, "We had a touchdown called back."

I think Billy was sending a message to his boss by saying that...

[SteelBucks]

The only reason why it seems like the "replacement refs" suck more than the other refs is because the media is talking about how bad they suck. Otherwise there is no drop off, the refs have blown games year after year, and blow calls game after game but no one has ever held them accountable...especially the media. Now announcers and players are being verbal about the new guys. The refs are exactly the same. They are crappy, they make numerous mistakes, the over officiate, they are just plain bad, just like last year and the year before that. The only thing that has changed is now the announcers are calling them out.

Sorry SDSteel1, but I totally disagree. The replacement refs are a farce and this contract situation needs to be worked out soon.

[DukieBoy]

Sorry SDSteel1, but I totally disagree. The replacement refs are a farce and this contract situation needs to be worked out soon.

x2

and ... the league needs to professionalize the regular refs to upgrade their attention to the job and their accountability to quality.

[flippy]

The only problem I have with the scabs is that they're slowing down the flow of the game. They're being too overly cautious to try and get everything right.

The real refs F up all the time. It's part of the game. We have all learned to live with it and complain about the Zebras. It's part of the game.

But trying to be perfect and making the refs a bigger part of the game than the football. That's what's annoying. Just make a call and be done. We'll never need the real refs back.

Fans longing for refs. That's comical in a way.

I thought we hated them all.

[Starlifter]

The only problem I have with the scabs is that they're slowing down the flow of the game. They're being too overly cautious to try and get everything right.

The real refs F up all the time. It's part of the game. We have all learned to live with it and complain about the Zebras. It's part of the game.

But trying to be perfect and making the refs a bigger part of the game than the football. That's what's annoying. Just make a call and be done. We'll never need the real refs back.

Fans longing for refs. That's comical in a way.

I thought we hated them all.

I don't think anyone expects perfection and yes mistakes are part of the game. There is a big difference however between mistakes due to human nature and mistakes due to individuals not knowing the rules.

[flippy]

I don't think anyone expects perfection and yes mistakes are part of the game. There is a big difference however between mistakes due to human nature and mistakes due to individuals not knowing the rules.

I can live with either as long as it's fairly consistent and doesn't slow the flow of the game.

And of course so it has a positive impact on us.

I watched the Philly/Balitmore game and it was one of the feistiest games I've seen outside of the Steelers/Ravens. They were letting guy get away with murder between and after the whistles. And they seemed to lose control of that game. And then somehow they called offensive PI to rob the Ravens in the end. It was a ticky tack call given everything else they let guys get away with throughout the game. But it couldn't have happened to a better team, so that was ok

[SidSmythe]

I could fairly call a Steeler game ... i hate when calls go against us and for us.
Although I'd get a lil' gitty whenever they made a big play

[steeler_fan_in_t.o.]

So far this season the officiating has sucked badly.....which puts these refs on par with the regulars.

The NFL is both the toughest game to officiate and the worst officiated of the four major sports. This dispute MUST be resolved with the league going to full time officials.

[Slapstick]

So far this season the officiating has sucked badly.....which puts these refs on par with the regulars.

The NFL is both the toughest game to officiate and the worst officiated of the four major sports. This dispute MUST be resolved with the league going to full time officials.

I don't think that will happen...

One of the reasons that the Officials can afford to be locked out is because they have day jobs...they won't give that up because it puts them at the mercy of greedy owners...kind of like the players...

[SDSteel1]

x2

and ... the league needs to professionalize the regular refs to upgrade their attention to the job and their accountability to quality.

First of all you aren't going to improve the quality because it's subjective, and by making a deal with the refs you are going to give them more strength which will lead to less accountability like you see in the MLB. The reason why it is taking longer now is because they are under the microscope and they are really trying to get it right, unlike the normal referees who blow call after call and they do it quickly because they aren't scrutinized by the media. How many times does James Harrison get held in a game? How many times does Ben take a late hit, or how many times Tom Brady get a roughing call when he is barely touched? The refs will never be perfect, but to pretend like the guys doing the games last year are any different than the guys this year is a figment of your imagination brought on by the announcers criticism of them. If the real NFL refs want their jobs back they should agree to the NFL's terms and come back to work, because the quality is the same....except these guys are trying harder than normal. The best referee's are the guys who don't throw flags unless a blatant rules infraction occurs, this week you saw more calls because of backlash from the media. Seattle fans are still whining about the refs from our 2005 Superbowl, San Diego fans still hate Ed Hochuli.....officiating is always going to suck, and the more the rules change and the more flags that are thrown the worse it's going to get. At least James Harrison hasn't got a penalty yet...which is has more to do with the new refs than it has to do with the fact that he hasn't stepped on the field yet.