If a fan died in Pittsburgh, what would seem fair????

[flippy]

[url="http://deadspin.com/5323997/and-here-are-the-three-men-that-beat-the-22+year+old-to-death-in-a-parking-lot-during-the-phillies-game"]http://deadspin.com/5323997/and-here-ar ... llies-game[/url]

Given the recent death in the Philly parking lot, I got to wondering about holding sporting teams accountable.

What seems fair?

1. Make the Phillies sell their team to another city and don't let them have a baseball team for 25+ years since they have killer fans.....

2. Make the Phillies forfeit participation in the playoffs since their fans killed a guy....

3. Trade these Philly fans for some good people kidnapped by terrorist groups and allow terrorists to do whatever they please with these guys.....

In addition to being ashamed to be a human, stories like these make me want to stop watching sports or doing anything competitive for that matter......

It's sick.

Philly is a cess pool.

I feel bad for anyone who lives there.

[papillon]

Re: If a fan died in Pittsburgh, what would seem fair????

http://deadspin.com/5323997/and-here-are-the-three-men-that-beat-the-22+year+old-to-death-in-a-parking-lot-during-the-phillies-game

Given the recent death in the Philly parking lot, I got to wondering about holding sporting teams accountable.

What seems fair?

1. Make the Phillies sell their team to another city and don't let them have a baseball team for 25+ years since they have killer fans.....

2. Make the Phillies forfeit participation in the playoffs since their fans killed a guy....

3. Trade these Philly fans for some good people kidnapped by terrorist groups and allow terrorists to do whatever they please with these guys.....

In addition to being ashamed to be a human, stories like these make me want to stop watching sports or doing anything competitive for that matter......

It's sick.

Philly is a cess pool.

I feel bad for anyone who lives there.

Hold the Phillies accountable? What the did they have to do with this tragedy? I say we hold the three guys that beat him to death accountable, but, hey, I'm weird that way in expecting the perpetrators to pay.

On the other hand, it happened in Pennsylvania, so, maybe we can force the Nuttigs to sell the Pirates, because, these three Troglodytes killed a guy.

Pappy

[flippy]

Re: If a fan died in Pittsburgh, what would seem fair????

It happened in the Phillies parking lot.

They were Philly fans.

So many of these stories lead back to Philly.

But I'd gladly blame the Pirates and send make them sell the team....especially since Freddy got traded....geeeeeez...

[MicroBioSteel]

Re: If a fan died in Pittsburgh, what would seem fair????

This Dave Sale was one of us....a Steelers fan from Johnstown.

This was FWD to me from the head of the Philly Steelers Club:

Hello,

As many of you have probably heard by now, Philadelphia' s ugly side came out once again last weekend and a bunch of jagoffs beat a guy to death at the Phillies game. What I didn't know until today was this guy and his family are Steelers fans, and watch games with the Blue Bell Steelers Club in the 'burbs. From what I understand his dad ran a charity auction at halftime of every game and they are decent folks.

I received the following email and they requested it be distributed in case anyone is interested in helping. Please contact Larry if you have any other questions... .

"I'm just sending out info about the recent tragedy at the Phillies game Saturday Night. If you haven't followed the news, our own Brigade member and original keeper of the halftime raffle is Dave Sale. His son, Davey, was brutally murdered in the parking lot by 3 f ing animals. There is a website out there for anybody interested in donating to the Davey Sale fund.

The viewing is Saturday, August 1st 2:30 to 5 at Calvary Baptist Church in Souderton with a service immediately following. His body will then be transported to Johnstown where he will be laid to rest. Any questions, feel free to call my cell number listed below."

[url="http://www.davesale"]http://www.davesale[/url] .bbnow.org/

Larry Bollens
Sr Program Analyst
Department of Medicine
Drexel University College of Medicine
267 294 9682
lbollens@drexelmed. edu

----------------------------------------------------------------
Before everyone goes after the Philly fan base and make generalizations.... I actually have no problem with the antics of 99% of their fans. There are however 1% of their fans that cause 99% of the problems. I actually had an incident with Philly fans at this same bar attached to Citizens Bank Park. Basically I had a drunk 6 foot 260-280 lb guy challenge me to a one on one drill in the middle of the bar. He actually got down in a 3 point stance. Basically I just ignored the guy. I'm 6'3 200 so I was a little light in the pance plus he was looking for a reason to fight since I was wearing a Crosby jersey during a Phillys rain delay. He ran into me two times (not at full speed...just trying to incite) then security cam over and kicked him out. Anyhow I got the last laugh since the Pens bounced the Flyers from the playoffs that day.

Despite this guy I have alot of friends who are Eagles/ Phillys fans and they are just like us. Very passionate....and maybe a bit more inclined to boo their own.

[SanAntonioSteelerFan]

Re: If a fan died in Pittsburgh, what would seem fair????

Missed the news ... why did they do this to this guy?

[rpmpit]

Re: If a fan died in Pittsburgh, what would seem fair????

I don't think its fair to characterize fans of certain cities as good or bad. There are jackasses everywhere. The only road Steeler games I've been to have been vs the Jets and Bengals. And for the most part, the majority of the people are fine. Its the few that make it bad for the many.

Just a shame someone had to die.

[Scarletfire1970]

Re: If a fan died in Pittsburgh, what would seem fair????

Apparently the fight started because one of the guys the victim was with accidently spilled on some girl in the bar according to this:

[url="http://www.delcotimes.com/articles/2009/07/28/news/doc4a6ef1c7772df187251165.txt"]http://www.delcotimes.com/articles/2009 ... 251165.txt[/url]

[papillon]

Re: If a fan died in Pittsburgh, what would seem fair????

It happened in the Phillies parking lot.

They were Philly fans.

So many of these stories lead back to Philly.

But I'd gladly blame the Pirates and send make them sell the team....especially since Freddy got traded....geeeeeez...

Blaming the Phillies for this tragedy is akin to Oprah blaming the fork for being fat.

And now they trade Snell and Wilson...the fans of the Pirates are glutton for punishment; until they stop going to games (probably already have) and the "Nut cases", er, I mean Nuttigs are losing money nothing will change.

The poor taxpayers built them a stadium and they aren't even trying to field a good team and they don't even try to hide that fact. It's tough being a Pirate fan right now.

Pappy

[SteelBucks]

Re: If a fan died in Pittsburgh, what would seem fair????

But I'd gladly blame the Pirates and send make them sell the team....especially since Freddy got traded....geeeeeez...

This is off topic but I absolutely love the Sanchez trade. Tim Alderson is one of the top pitching prospects in baseball. He's only 20 and already in AA.....I expect him to be in Pittsburgh sometime in 2011.

Finally, the Pirates have a real blue chip pitching prospect!

[flippy]

Re: If a fan died in Pittsburgh, what would seem fair????

Re: Why blame the Phillies?

They served these guys beer which likely led to them getting out of hand and getting kicked out of the ball park. Maybe sports franchises shouldn't sell beer/alcohol at games. Beer/alcohol tend to precede most violent acts. Make sporting events safe for families. People take little kids to the game. This is sick. The people that came with these 3 d-bags to the game should be ashamed to be friends with such lowlifes. I heard the guys that killed the kid had rap sheets already, maybe the local prisons are to blame too for letting unreformed animals on the street.

Re: the Sanchez trade

I wanna like it and I want to trust we're re-building the entire franchise. I think we may be on the verge of getting our act together. But I've sincerely believed we were working toward respectable for years.....fool me once, shame on you....fool me twice, or 15 years, shame on me.....let's go bucs!!!!!!!!

[Flasteel]

Re: If a fan died in Pittsburgh, what would seem fair????

Re: Why blame the Phillies?

They served these guys beer which likely led to them getting out of hand and getting kicked out of the ball park. Maybe sports franchises shouldn't sell beer/alcohol at games. Beer/alcohol tend to precede most violent acts. Make sporting events safe for families. People take little kids to the game. This is sick. The people that came with these 3 d-bags to the game should be ashamed to be friends with such lowlifes. I heard the guys that killed the kid had rap sheets already, maybe the local prisons are to blame too for letting unreformed animals on the street.

Re: the Sanchez trade

I wanna like it and I want to trust we're re-building the entire franchise. I think we may be on the verge of getting our act together. But I've sincerely believed we were working toward respectable for years.....fool me once, shame on you....fool me twice, or 15 years, shame on me.....let's go bucs!!!!!!!!

C'mon Flip. I have to totally agree with Pap on this...the blame lies solely with the three assholes who committed the act. Not taking personal responsibility is a huge part of what is wrong with our society, so let's not feed the monster. I'm not suggesting that the bar they were at didn't over-serve or the ball park failed to adequately provide security, it's just that we need to place blame where it belongs and make an example these guys.

[aggiebones]

Re: If a fan died in Pittsburgh, what would seem fair????

Helping to create the aura of obnoxiousness is what Philly sports teams do. Maybe not create, but certainly don't dissuade. The better start becoming more proactive or someone will sue and win at some point. You can't claim ignorance from events that repeat in your parking lot. Its not the first time for someone in an opposing uniform to get a heavy beating. They just finally killed someone. Maybe they need to hire a couple thousand security and set up the parking lot as a police state. I'd damn sure prevent alcohol for EVERYONE in the lot and stadium for some set period. And police it. The accepted behavior level there cannot continue. There is rowdy human behavior and then animalistic behavior.

[snarky]

Re: If a fan died in Pittsburgh, what would seem fair????

They should have the same legal liability as any other establishment that serves alcohol.

Now as far as the league goes -- if they want to get involved with something like this there are a few options for extreme cases like this.

1) Force the team to play a few home games behind closed doors
2) Deduct wins from their total
3) Playoff ban
4) Straight fine

Numbers one through three are used effectively in association football in Europe. It causes most fans to be self-policing. And if you look at the level of hooliganism at games over the last twenty years it is down dramatically.

I'm not advocating for these in american sports. I don't think the level of hooliganism is high enough to be a concern. But these are the four options I see.

[feelthesteel]

Re: If a fan died in Pittsburgh, what would seem fair????

Philly is a screwed up place to see a NFL game if your the other team.
not too cool.
although they dont bother Steeler fans too much because both PENN teams.

[aggiebones]

Re: If a fan died in Pittsburgh, what would seem fair????

I could see a probationary status thrust upon them to force them to clean up their act a bit. Its not a new once in a lifetime problem. Yes, they finally killed someone, but the acts have been the same.