C.P.

[BIG FAN]

Why is it that Carson Palmer, with all this great receiver talent, goes from the twenties to the twenties, but when in the red zone falters against simple cover two?
How many times last year did they get more than two touchdowns in a game when they got that close?
Or better yet, outside of the debacle against the game against the stains, how often did he pass for two or more touchdowns a game?
I don't know, that's why I'm asking you folks who "wait till' next year."

[Jom112]

Re: C.P.

Why is it that Carson Palmer, with all this great receiver talent, goes from the twenties to the twenties, but when in the red zone falters against simple cover two?
How many times last year did they get more than two touchdowns in a game when they got that close?
Or better yet, outside of the debacle against the game against the stains, how often did he pass for two or more touchdowns a game?
I don't know, that's why I'm asking you folks who "wait till' next year."

The cover 2 works very well when a team only has two receivers that you have to deal with. With Chris Henry's suspension and Chatman's injury we didn't have a solid #3 receiver for the majority of the season. Couple that with no TE threats and a less than average running game and you have a scheme that works well against us.

Our offensive coordinator realized that so we went out in the offseason and drafted 2 receivers and signed a solid TE. The running game is still suspect but we should be more successful against the cover 2 this season...

[Les 74]

Re: C.P.

The running game is still suspect but we should be more successful against the cover 2 this season...

...........but you'll still suck against every other scheme in the league and once again fail to make the playoffs.

[Jom112]

Re: C.P.

The running game is still suspect but we should be more successful against the cover 2 this season...

...........but you'll still suck against every other scheme in the league and once again fail to make the playoffs.

Looking for some attention?

[Les 74]

Re: C.P.

The running game is still suspect but we should be more successful against the cover 2 this season...

...........but you'll still suck against every other scheme in the league and once again fail to make the playoffs.

Looking for some attention?

No,if I was looking for attention,I would do something retarded like this:

[Jom112]

Re: C.P.

No,if I was looking for attention,I would do something retarded like this:

I think I'll start treating you the same way I treat all annoying little kids (And please tell me your not out of high school yet). I will start ignoring you.

When you stop being annoying and actually post something even slightly to what the thread is about you can rejoin in the conversations...

[proudpittsburgher]

Re: C.P.

No,if I was looking for attention,I would do something retarded like this:

I think I'll start treating you the same way I treat all annoying little kids (And please tell me your not out of high school yet). I will start ignoring you.

When you stop being annoying and actually post something even slightly to what the thread is about you can rejoin in the conversations...

Post is titled C.P., which, in the context of this discussion referrs to Carson Palmer. True, the thread is not titled "C.P. the homo" (which he is, btw ), which i clearly shown in the picture, but he is indeed what this thread is about. Sooooooo, he actually DID post "something even slightly to what the thread is about". Now move on, junior!

[Les 74]

Re: C.P.

No,if I was looking for attention,I would do something retarded like this:

I think I'll start treating you the same way I treat all annoying little kids (And please tell me your not out of high school yet). I will start ignoring you.

When you stop being annoying and actually post something even slightly to what the thread is about you can rejoin in the conversations...

Post is titled C.P., which, in the context of this discussion referrs to Carson Palmer. True, the thread is not titled "C.P. the homo" (which he is, btw ), which i clearly shown in the picture, but he is indeed what this thread is about. Sooooooo, he actually DID post "something even slightly to what the thread is about". Now move on, junior!

Thanks for the back-up,pp.I wonder if all Bungle fans are this moronic.................come to think of it,nevermind.

[NKySteeler]

Re: C.P.

Personally, I really do love Carson as a qb.... I watched him throughout his years at USC prior to going pro.... Ben, I must admit that I never paid too much attention... But the fact of the matter is that Ben has better numbers than Carson in more than just wins and losses.... I stole this from Msm's post:

Ben Roeth career 3rd down passing

90.3 Passer rating
62% completion percentage
8.2 Yards per attempt

CARSON PALMER CAREER 3RD DOWN PASSING

80% passer rating
59% PERCENT COMPLETION PERCENTAGE
6.5 YARDS PER ATTEMPT


NOTE: Huge Difference between 8.2 yards per attempt and 6.5
----------------------------------------------------------------------

BEN ROETH 1ST QUARTER PASSING CAREER

105% PASSER RATING
9.4 YARDS PER ATTEMPT

CARSON PALMER 1ST QTR PASSING CAREER

93% PASSER RATING
7.2 YARDS PER ATTEMPT
-------------------------------------------------------------------------


BEN ROETH 4TH QTR PASSING CAREER

PASSER RATING 85%
7.7 YARDS PER ATTEMPT

cARSON palmer Career 4th QTR passing

PASSER RATING 79%
6.3 YARDS PER ATTEMPT
------------------------------------------------------------------------


BEN ROETH CAREER YARDS PER ATTEMPT AVG on all passes

8.1

PALMER CAREER YARDS PER ATTEMPT AVG on all passes
7.3
------------------------------------------------------------------------



BEN ROETH CAREER FUMBLES, FUMBLES LOST, INTERCEPTIONS

18 FUMBLES, 8 FUMBLES LOST, 54 INTERCEPTIONS

CARSON CAREER FUMBLES, FUMBLES LOST, INTERCEPTIONS

27 FUMBLES, 12 FUMBLES LOST , 63 INTERCEPTIONS
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


BEN ROETH CAREER PASSER RATING During Night Games

100.7%

CARSON PALMER CAREER PASSER RATING During Night Games

75%
--------------------------------------------------------------

Ben Roeth passer rating indoors

111%

Carson passer rating indoors

96%
-----------------------------------------------------------------

Ben roeth Passer Rating during PERCIPITATION

95%

Carson Passer Rating During Percipitation

74%
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Ben Roeth career Passer rating when Temperature is between 20-40 Degrees Fahrenheit

88%

Carson palmer career Passer rating When Temperature is between 20-40 Degrees Fahrenheit

77%
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ben roeth Career Passer Rating when Temp is above 80 degrees

111.1 %

Carson palmer Career Passer rating when Temp is above 80 Degress

110.8
---------------------------------------------------------------------------


Ben Roeth Career passer rating in December

95%

Carson Palmer Career Passer rating in December

84%
--------------------------------------------------------------------------


Ben Roeth Career Rushing Yardage total and per carry average

515 yards , 3.3 per carry

Carson Palmer Career rushing Yardage Total and per carry Average

135 yards, 1.3 per carry
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ben Roeth Career Passer rating on Turf

96%

Carson Palmer Career Passer rating on Turf

89%
------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ben Roeth passer Rating on 3rd Down & 8-10 Yards

90%

Carson Palmer Passer rating on 3rd down & 8-10 Yards

71%


Bottom line is that Ben is better.... If you wish to place blame on thier O-line, WRs', etc..., well, then so be it. But bottom line is that Ben is getting the job done more so than Carson.

[Ozey74]

Re: C.P.

[costanza2k1]

Re: C.P.

Just keep on keepin on brotha

[Jom112]

Re: C.P.

Bottom line is that Ben is better.... If you wish to place blame on thier O-line, WRs', etc..., well, then so be it. But bottom line is that Ben is getting the job done more so than Carson.

Solid argument, I won't deny that. But is it Ben that's getting it done more than Carson or is it the Steelers TEAM that is getting it done more than Carson?

Here is how the Teams rank in terms of passing offense since Carson and Ben took over:

2007: Bengals #7, Steelers #22
2006: Benagls #6, Steelers #9
2005: Bengals #5, Steelers #24
2004: Bengals #17, Steelers #28

And here are the rushing offense numbers for that same timeframe:

2007: Bengals #24, Steelers #3
2006: Bengals #26, Steelers #10
2005: Bengals #11, Steelers #5
2004: Bengals #17, Steelers #2

As I stated earlier both QB's are really good fits for their respective teams. The Bengals are best when their passing game is strong and their running game is at least decent. The Steelers on the other hand are best (Like in '05) when their running game is strong and their passing game is just decent. When the Steelers get pass happy like they did in '06, they failed to reach the playoffs.

Also it's eaiser to have better numbers when you pass less than 300 times a year. Which is why I have given Ben a lot of credit after what he did this past season. Last season was the first time that Ben threw more than 300 times and the team was successful. Now the question is can Ben repeat that?

After Peyton and Brady it's Palmer and Ben. They will always be tied at the hip and I think both will be solid QB's for the next several years...


NOTE: This is just a statical response to a statistical argument. Obviously injuries, ST, defense, SOS, high gas prices and other factors come into account...

[Jom112]

Re: C.P.

No,if I was looking for attention,I would do something retarded like this:

I think I'll start treating you the same way I treat all annoying little kids (And please tell me your not out of high school yet). I will start ignoring you.

When you stop being annoying and actually post something even slightly to what the thread is about you can rejoin in the conversations...

Post is titled C.P., which, in the context of this discussion referrs to Carson Palmer. True, the thread is not titled "C.P. the homo" (which he is, btw ), which i clearly shown in the picture, but he is indeed what this thread is about. Sooooooo, he actually DID post "something even slightly to what the thread is about". Now move on, junior!

Reading is fundamental.

The key word is my response was the word "AND". If LesTool74 stops being annoying AND he posts something of relavance then I will no longer treat him like an infant.

As for yourself, if you want to talk football then come and bring it...

[NKySteeler]

Re: C.P.

When the Steelers get pass happy like they did in '06, they failed to reach the playoffs....

'06 was really not a fair indicator of Bens' production, and was more of an anomoly to his record... He had the accident, which took away not only his strength but also his prep time before the season. Then the apendectomy, which set him back further.

But yes, it is the team. But who runs the team?...The quarterback.

The Steelers have long since had a strong rushing attack, so they have naturally played to thier strengths. Just as the Bengals have done with thier passing game. I really don't think anyone on this board would argue that Ward, Washington, and Ced could compare to what Johnson, T.J., and Henry have done in recent years.

But as to the actual comparison, it is a bit of apples and oranges. However, success and production of the overall group also reflects the qb who leads them. I know that you do not agree with this, but I really feel that Carson is calm cool and collected until it gets to crunch time, then falters. Ben has demonstrated the ability to win under pressure evidenced by his playoff record. Even when he played somewhat poorly in the playoffs, he kept it together enough to win.

Just my .

[Jom112]

Re: C.P.

When the Steelers get pass happy like they did in '06, they failed to reach the playoffs....

'06 was really not a fair indicator of Bens' production, and was more of an anomoly to his record... He had the accident, which took away not only his strength but also his prep time before the season. Then the apendectomy, which set him back further.

But yes, it is the team. But who runs the team?...The quarterback.

The Steelers have long since had a strong rushing attack, so they have naturally played to thier strengths. Just as the Bengals have done with thier passing game. I really don't think anyone on this board would argue that Ward, Washington, and Ced could compare to what Johnson, T.J., and Henry have done in recent years.

But as to the actual comparison, it is a bit of apples and oranges. However, success and production of the overall group also reflects the qb who leads them. I know that you do not agree with this, but I really feel that Carson is calm cool and collected until it gets to crunch time, then falters. Ben has demonstrated the ability to win under pressure evidenced by his playoff record. Even when he played somewhat poorly in the playoffs, he kept it together enough to win.

Just my .

This is where we differ. You look at the Denver game, Carson drove us down the field and we scored a TD to come within one. It's not his fault if Brad St. Louis had a bad snap. Carson played very well against a tough defense in a tough atmosphere.

Then against Pitt at the end of '06. Carson drove us down and setup a very makeable field goal for Graham. Unfortunately Graham missed. Again Carson did what he had to and led the team effectively.

Carson on some other occasions did have some situations where he couldn't get it done but that happens with ALL qb's. I remember Ben trying to lead the Steelers down the field against us in the final minutes of a game and ended up throwing an INT to end it. Those things happen.

I don't think Carson falters at the end of games (Although he does need to improve on holding onto the football), but the team has a whole does need to improve at finishing games. That also includes Marvin and the coaching staff and their ability/inability to effectively manage a game.

Now I have a question for you NK, do you think that Ben really is the leader of the Steelers? Carson was voted by the team as a captain of the offense. Even with players like Willie Anderson and TJ on the team. Ben even after his best season didn't get the team MVP award which went to Harrison. Do you think the players on the Steelers offense line up behind him and follow his lead?