Pre Snap Motion: More than Man/Zone

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  • NorthCoast
    Legend
    • Sep 2008
    • 26636

    Pre Snap Motion: More than Man/Zone

    Writeup a couple years old but dispels some thinking on the use of presnap motion. This is one of the reasons Canada was brought in as he is a disciple of psm. And the post someone had of the Ravens' struggles against the Steelers is an example of the advantages and havoc it can create. But note what the writeup also says... you can't use the same motions over and over again and expect the same results. That's where all eyes are on the offense this season.




    In an NFL where defensive front versatility is the order of the day and coverage schemes are more advanced than they?ve ever been, it behooves those who design offenses to bring to the table anything possible to plant their flags in the turf. Pre-snap motion, which is used to varying degrees throughout the league to varying degrees of effectiveness, has become a mandatory construct among many of the most effective offenses.

    But none of the public subscription-based football metrics services ? not Football Outsiders, not Pro Football Focus, and not Sports Info Solutions ? make pre-snap motion charting-based stats available, and therefore, we as football fans and and football analysts have no way of knowing the exact effectiveness of the methodology. The first real reference I saw to pre-snap motion in an analytical sense was in Warren Sharp?s 2020 Football Preview, and Sharp laid it all out in compelling fashion.

    Per Sharp, NFL teams used pre-snap motion in the first three quarters of games on 39% of passes, 49% of rushes, and 43% of all plays in the 2019 season. The 49ers led the league with pre-snap motion on 66% of their passes, followed by the Patriots (65%), the Titans (63%), the Ravens (57%), and the Chiefs (53%). Two of those teams made the Super Bowl, the Ravens were the AFC?s number-one seed, the Titans made it to the AFC Championship game, and the Patriots ranked 11th in Football Outsiders? Offensive DVOA metrics despite a receiver group that couldn?t bust a grape.

    Other teams used pre-snap motion at below-average rates, yet saw clear improvement in efficiency when passing with it.

    Overall, NFL teams had 0.2 more yards per attempt, a 3% success rate increase, and 0.02 more EPA per attempt with pre-snap motion. The Vikings, who used the 20th-most pre-snap motion on passing plays last season, saw a bump of 1.6 in yards per attempt, a 6% success rate improvement, and an increase in EPA per attempt of 0.25. The Buccaneers, who could have desperately used anything to make Jameis Winston more efficient in 2019, used pre-snap motion on just 37% of their plays, one of the lowest rates in the league. The league average was 40%. But when Winston had the benefit of pre-snap motion? His yards per attempt went up from 7.2 to 7.7, his EPA from -0.12 to +0.08, and his quarterback rating ascended from 74.1 to 102.7. Yet, the Bucs used pre-snap motion on just 151 passing attempts.

    When talking about the specific schematic advantages of pre-snap motion, most people will point to the ability of the quarterback to read man versus zone coverage based on the motion defender. If the defender follows the motion receiver through the formation, it?s generally man. If the defender stays put and hands the responsibility through the formation, it?s generally zone.

    But defenses are starting to show dummy man/zone looks, and as Orlovsky told me, that?s not the ultimate advantage for quarterbacks ? or, for that matter, anybody on the offensive side of the ball.

    ?Yeah, I think we?re all past man vs. zone,? he told me. ?We?re kind of beyond that. The big thing was creating leverage on certain players. That?s a big deal. You could get certain guys ? when you line up in your formation, and you?re moving your personnel, you can get certain [defenders] to move where you want them. When you use motion, and you kind of know how your opponent will respond, you will call certain plays to be run at certain guys.

    ?We?re seeing more coaches understand that? motion doesn?t have to be married to man/zone. It could be to try and get your run game to be run at certain people. Or, to try and get your passing game directed at certain people, whether it?s man or zone. Because if that nickel defender doesn?t kick over to trips, you can have your slot receiver working on a safety. So now, just off motion, even if it?s against a zone defense, you have really created an advantage. That safety really wants to play the run more than he wants to play the pass. So, it?s really about trying to create advantages, whether it?s via leverage, or via fits in the run game. I think we?ve seen great growth on that in the NFL.?

    Pre-snap motion also creates specific advantages in the run game ? it?s a big reason the Ravens had the NFL?s most schematically evil rushing attack in the NFL last season.

    Ravens offensive coordinator Greg Roman has been brilliant at cooking up different kinds of motion concepts, which is the next level of this ? when offensive minds continue to realize that it?s the complexity of motion that really puts defenses on a string ? as the Ravens, 49ers, and Chiefs already have ? the advantages grow in an exponential sense.

    ?I don?t necessarily care if an offense motions,? Orlovsky said, putting his defensive coordinator hat on. ?But when they have different motions, that?s when I?ve got a problem. [Remember when] Chip Kelly was the greatest thing in the world because he played with tempo? Well, defenses caught up and started playing with tempo. Then, the great coaches, Sean McVay being one of them, they?ve got all different kinds of tempo. They?ve got stupid-fast tempo, then the fast tempo, then the ?okay no-huddle? tempo, then the slow tempo. That?s what screws with defenses. Because then, you don?t know. You?ve got to be ready all the time. That?s when you?re on your heels, and you?re guessing rather than dictating. Those offenses that are constantly changing the way they?re doing the motion ? for defenses, you can no longer feel confident in what you?re doing. You are always going to be a step slow.?
  • Steel Maniac
    Banned
    • Apr 2017
    • 19472

    #2
    Originally posted by NorthCoast
    Writeup a couple years old but dispels some thinking on the use of presnap motion. This is one of the reasons Canada was brought in as he is a disciple of psm. And the post someone had of the Ravens' struggles against the Steelers is an example of the advantages and havoc it can create. But note what the writeup also says... you can't use the same motions over and over again and expect the same results. That's where all eyes are on the offense this season.




    In an NFL where defensive front versatility is the order of the day and coverage schemes are more advanced than they?ve ever been, it behooves those who design offenses to bring to the table anything possible to plant their flags in the turf. Pre-snap motion, which is used to varying degrees throughout the league to varying degrees of effectiveness, has become a mandatory construct among many of the most effective offenses.

    But none of the public subscription-based football metrics services ? not Football Outsiders, not Pro Football Focus, and not Sports Info Solutions ? make pre-snap motion charting-based stats available, and therefore, we as football fans and and football analysts have no way of knowing the exact effectiveness of the methodology. The first real reference I saw to pre-snap motion in an analytical sense was in Warren Sharp?s 2020 Football Preview, and Sharp laid it all out in compelling fashion.

    Per Sharp, NFL teams used pre-snap motion in the first three quarters of games on 39% of passes, 49% of rushes, and 43% of all plays in the 2019 season. The 49ers led the league with pre-snap motion on 66% of their passes, followed by the Patriots (65%), the Titans (63%), the Ravens (57%), and the Chiefs (53%). Two of those teams made the Super Bowl, the Ravens were the AFC?s number-one seed, the Titans made it to the AFC Championship game, and the Patriots ranked 11th in Football Outsiders? Offensive DVOA metrics despite a receiver group that couldn?t bust a grape.

    Other teams used pre-snap motion at below-average rates, yet saw clear improvement in efficiency when passing with it.

    Overall, NFL teams had 0.2 more yards per attempt, a 3% success rate increase, and 0.02 more EPA per attempt with pre-snap motion. The Vikings, who used the 20th-most pre-snap motion on passing plays last season, saw a bump of 1.6 in yards per attempt, a 6% success rate improvement, and an increase in EPA per attempt of 0.25. The Buccaneers, who could have desperately used anything to make Jameis Winston more efficient in 2019, used pre-snap motion on just 37% of their plays, one of the lowest rates in the league. The league average was 40%. But when Winston had the benefit of pre-snap motion? His yards per attempt went up from 7.2 to 7.7, his EPA from -0.12 to +0.08, and his quarterback rating ascended from 74.1 to 102.7. Yet, the Bucs used pre-snap motion on just 151 passing attempts.

    When talking about the specific schematic advantages of pre-snap motion, most people will point to the ability of the quarterback to read man versus zone coverage based on the motion defender. If the defender follows the motion receiver through the formation, it?s generally man. If the defender stays put and hands the responsibility through the formation, it?s generally zone.

    But defenses are starting to show dummy man/zone looks, and as Orlovsky told me, that?s not the ultimate advantage for quarterbacks ? or, for that matter, anybody on the offensive side of the ball.

    ?Yeah, I think we?re all past man vs. zone,? he told me. ?We?re kind of beyond that. The big thing was creating leverage on certain players. That?s a big deal. You could get certain guys ? when you line up in your formation, and you?re moving your personnel, you can get certain [defenders] to move where you want them. When you use motion, and you kind of know how your opponent will respond, you will call certain plays to be run at certain guys.

    ?We?re seeing more coaches understand that? motion doesn?t have to be married to man/zone. It could be to try and get your run game to be run at certain people. Or, to try and get your passing game directed at certain people, whether it?s man or zone. Because if that nickel defender doesn?t kick over to trips, you can have your slot receiver working on a safety. So now, just off motion, even if it?s against a zone defense, you have really created an advantage. That safety really wants to play the run more than he wants to play the pass. So, it?s really about trying to create advantages, whether it?s via leverage, or via fits in the run game. I think we?ve seen great growth on that in the NFL.?

    Pre-snap motion also creates specific advantages in the run game ? it?s a big reason the Ravens had the NFL?s most schematically evil rushing attack in the NFL last season.

    Ravens offensive coordinator Greg Roman has been brilliant at cooking up different kinds of motion concepts, which is the next level of this ? when offensive minds continue to realize that it?s the complexity of motion that really puts defenses on a string ? as the Ravens, 49ers, and Chiefs already have ? the advantages grow in an exponential sense.

    ?I don?t necessarily care if an offense motions,? Orlovsky said, putting his defensive coordinator hat on. ?But when they have different motions, that?s when I?ve got a problem. [Remember when] Chip Kelly was the greatest thing in the world because he played with tempo? Well, defenses caught up and started playing with tempo. Then, the great coaches, Sean McVay being one of them, they?ve got all different kinds of tempo. They?ve got stupid-fast tempo, then the fast tempo, then the ?okay no-huddle? tempo, then the slow tempo. That?s what screws with defenses. Because then, you don?t know. You?ve got to be ready all the time. That?s when you?re on your heels, and you?re guessing rather than dictating. Those offenses that are constantly changing the way they?re doing the motion ? for defenses, you can no longer feel confident in what you?re doing. You are always going to be a step slow.?

    So your saying that the defenses have made an adjustment so the offenses who use presnap motion have to make the adjustment to the adjustment. LOL. Meaning, whatever play you run, it will come down to your execution. (taking for granted that a decent play is called)

    Comment

    • NorthCoast
      Legend
      • Sep 2008
      • 26636

      #3
      Originally posted by Steel Maniac
      So your saying that the defenses have made an adjustment so the offenses who use presnap motion have to make the adjustment to the adjustment. LOL. Meaning, whatever play you run, it will come down to your execution. (taking for granted that a decent play is called)
      There's a clip out there that showed the Walsh led Niners running presnap motion on a play. So while the concept is old as the hills the skill guys are different and the schemes increasingly looking to create matchup problems.

      In some ways it's not unlike the QB sneak. Been around forever but Philly has exploited it in a whole new way.

      Comment

      • Steel Maniac
        Banned
        • Apr 2017
        • 19472

        #4
        Originally posted by NorthCoast
        There's a clip out there that showed the Walsh led Niners running presnap motion on a play. So while the concept is old as the hills the skill guys are different and the schemes increasingly looking to create matchup problems.

        In some ways it's not unlike the QB sneak. Been around forever but Philly has exploited it in a whole new way.
        Yep...the concept of pre-snap motion is old. I think if you use presnap motion, the best way to use it is to make sure you run different plays off of the same motion and fomation. The whole goal is to find and exploit match ups ..dictate to the defense. Run different plays out of the same formations and motions..keeping the defense guessing. Remain unpredictable.

        A lot of the time, when I watch teams who use it, they show a lot of different formations WITH the pre snap motion. Meaning..the formation tips the defense off (run or pass) and the pre snap motion isn't as effective. So run the same formation ( a little more often) but run & pass out of it more. Then the defense doesn't know what your doing in that formation and then your pre snap motion is more optimal.

        Just an observation.

        Comment

        • whisper
          Legend
          • Mar 2020
          • 9423

          #5
          The kind of motion Canada has going tricks no one and reveals nothing about the D: It's basically a big waste of time.

          Comment

          • Steel Maniac
            Banned
            • Apr 2017
            • 19472

            #6
            Originally posted by whisper
            The kind of motion Canada has going tricks no one and reveals nothing about the D: It's basically a big waste of time.
            hahahahahahha. Don't worry. Weather your for him or against him, all eyes will be tightly focused on Canada and his schemes this year.

            Comment

            • NorthCoast
              Legend
              • Sep 2008
              • 26636

              #7
              Originally posted by whisper
              The kind of motion Canada has going tricks no one and reveals nothing about the D: It's basically a big waste of time.
              The Ravens beg to differ.

              Comment

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