Trouble in Pats' land

[whatever]

yep.. if the Pats don’t turn things around soon we are definitely seeing the Brady effect on the biggest coach of all.

This dude could turn his back on the offense and coach up the D when he had Brady. Now this dude looked like a cotdamn HS coach hiring friends on defense to run the offense and watched players play hot potato in a tie ball game in Vegas.

He went from genius to “geezus” in 4 years.

Same thing with dungy.
Qb ran those teams.

[Northern_Blitz]

said it before and will say it again, it will be interesting seeing how many of these teams play better after firing their OC’s.

Some people think all you have to do is fire a guy to get better.

Based on results, I think our OC is in the bottom 25% of OCs.

In a case like that, I don't think it's unreasonable to think that you have a reasonable chance of improving the offense by getting a new OC.

This is a much different discussion than replacing our head coach.

I think the expected value of changing those two positions based on the track records of those two guys is very different.

[feltdizz]

Based on results, I think our OC is in the bottom 25% of OCs.

In a case like that, I don't think it's unreasonable to think that you have a reasonable chance of improving the offense by getting a new OC.

This is a much different discussion than replacing our head coach.

I think the expected value of changing those two positions based on the track records of those two guys is very different.

anything is possible, we could be better, worse pr the same with a new OC.

I think its unwise to change an OC with a QB coming off his rookie season who hasn’t even had a chance to play a full season yet or take all the reps in camp with HIS playbook.

Then you have another 20 players who also have to learn new terminology and play slower than they would.

Makes sense to see if this young offense can do some things this year before making that change.

[NorthCoast]

Could simply be Mac Jones not being used to losing or having a ridiculous talent edge over most opponents.

This. It's often said that you find out more about the character of a player when he loses than when he wins. Then again, Vince Lombardi said "show me a good loser, and I'll show you a loser"

[Northern_Blitz]

anything is possible, we could be better, worse pr the same with a new OC.

I think its unwise to change an OC with a QB coming off his rookie season who hasn’t even had a chance to play a full season yet or take all the reps in camp with HIS playbook.

Then you have another 20 players who also have to learn new terminology and play slower than they would.

Makes sense to see if this young offense can do some things this year before making that change.

I think it's unwise to use the 2nd year of your rookie QB contract on an OC that you're pretty sure you aren't going to keep after the season.

And to me, it seems like that's the position we're in.

An OC that's presided over bad offenses two years out of two.

Maybe you're right and there's a huge improvement. But if there is, I think it will be mostly because of KP. And that if we looked around to get an OC tailored to the QB, we would have had a better scheme for him.

But we can never run the counterfactual. So you can always say it would have been worse with a different OC. And I can always say it would have been better.

[WindyCitySteel]

much worse. Mac Jones was seen on multiple occasions screaming at his coaches to f#ck off and that the running game f#cking sucks.

Pickett last 5 games played. 5-0
Mac Jones last 5 games.. 2-3

So QBs get the wins now, not head coaches?

[WindyCitySteel]

I think Billicheat is finding life much harder without an elite QB and also having a much harder division with Miami, Buff and even the Jets playing better football.

Also, there are rumors Mac Jones doesn’t respond well to tough coaching (sounds odd) since he went to Bama and played for Billicheats buddy Saban who seems like a hard ass. Could simply be Mac Jones not being used to losing or having a ridiculous talent edge over most opponents.

I thought they set him up to fail?

[WindyCitySteel]

I think its unwise to change an OC with a QB coming off his rookie season who hasn’t even had a chance to play a full season yet or take all the reps in camp with HIS playbook.

It was unwise to change OC with a QB on his last legs the year before. Your argument is the exact reason they should do it now - unless they extend him for the length of Kenny's contract, he's going to have to unlearn even more in 2024.

[WindyCitySteel]

I think it's unwise to use the 2nd year of your rookie QB contract on an OC that you're pretty sure you aren't going to keep after the season.

And to me, it seems like that's the position we're in.

An OC that's presided over bad offenses two years out of two.

Maybe you're right and there's a huge improvement. But if there is, I think it will be mostly because of KP. And that if we looked around to get an OC tailored to the QB, we would have had a better scheme for him.

But we can never run the counterfactual. So you can always say it would have been worse with a different OC. And I can always say it would have been better.

This x 1000. Unfortunately, I think the reason they're comfortable doing this is because they know in Feb of 2024, Tomlin will walk down the hall and plop the playbook on the seat of Mike Sullivan or this new offensive assistant.

His playbook.

[feltdizz]

I think it's unwise to use the 2nd year of your rookie QB contract on an OC that you're pretty sure you aren't going to keep after the season.

And to me, it seems like that's the position we're in.

An OC that's presided over bad offenses two years out of two.

Maybe you're right and there's a huge improvement. But if there is, I think it will be mostly because of KP. And that if we looked around to get an OC tailored to the QB, we would have had a better scheme for him.

But we can never run the counterfactual. So you can always say it would have been worse with a different OC. And I can always say it would have been better.

its unwise to assume Canada is gone after next season BEFORE we see the results of 2023. Kenny and the offense continue where they left off and I think Canada stays.

The bye is when everyone on the offense said they really bought into the Canada offense. Kenny only had 1 INT after the bye. Expect that type of ball protection to continue but also expect Kenny and the offense to improve in the red zone.

[Captain Lemming]

So QBs get the wins now, not head coaches?

You do know YOU LITERALLY DO THAT ALL THE TIME RIGHT?

QBs get ALL the wins. Coaches just get the losses.
Did I get that right?

[feltdizz]

So QBs get the wins now, not head coaches?

Not trying to be rude but this is a dumb ass question. You know damn well Head coaches and QB’s win loss records are part of their stat lines.

Everyone uses win loss records for QB’s. You never see it for any other position for a reason. Its why QB’s get the big bucks.

[feltdizz]

It was unwise to change OC with a QB on his last legs the year before. Your argument is the exact reason they should do it now - unless they extend him for the length of Kenny's contract, he's going to have to unlearn even more in 2024.

I agree in regards to Ben but I think that last year Ben pulled a fast one with his announcement to take a pay cut.

I think the rumor is Colbert and Tomlin were ready to move on but Rooney was okay bringing Ben back.

and I’m not sure Canada is gone after this year just because fans want to move on. This upcoming season will decide that IMO.

I know its hard but people need to throw the Ben/Canada year out the window. I don’t think it has any impact on how Canada is being evaluated in regards to Kenny and his future.

[feltdizz]

I thought they set him up to fail?

Not sure I follow. Do you think they set Mac up to succeed with the “do we really need an OC” approach by Billicheat?

[hawaiiansteel]

Not sure I follow. Do you think they set Mac up to succeed with the “do we really need an OC” approach by Billicheat?

I'm not denying that Belicheat is a good head coach.

but hiring his buddy Matt Patricia to be the OC last year was incredibly stupid.