OT: Super Bowl coaching

[WindyCitySteel]

I bash Tomlin enough, it's only fair I call out what I thought was some bad coaching in the Super Bowl.

McVay stubbornly stuck to the run when it clearly wasn't working, and seemed lost when OBJ when down. I routinely say Tomlin needs a loaded roster to win, but McVay is very similar in that regard, IMO. And the stupid "Philly Special" on 3rd down to an immobile QB was pure ego.

The only reason he's not getting heat today is because Taylor was arguably worse. Four key 3rd and 1 or 4th and 1 plays and Joe Mixon isn't even on the field for any of them. Are you kidding me? If you're going to do that, use Burrow's legs more, don't put it on Samaje Perine.

And speaking of ego calls, going for it on 4th and 1 from midfield on your first possession was a bad one.

For two of the "bright young coaches" in the game, I thought they blinked in the bright lights.

[Northern_Blitz]

I bash Tomlin enough, it's only fair I call out what I thought was some bad coaching in the Super Bowl.

McVay stubbornly stuck to the run when it clearly wasn't working, and seemed lost when OBJ when down. I routinely say Tomlin needs a loaded roster to win, but McVay is very similar in that regard, IMO. And the stupid "Philly Special" on 3rd down to an immobile QB was pure ego.

The only reason he's not getting heat today is because Taylor was arguably worse. Four key 3rd and 1 or 4th and 1 plays and Joe Mixon isn't even on the field for any of them. Are you kidding me? If you're going to do that, use Burrow's legs more, don't put it on Samaje Perine.

And speaking of ego calls, going for it on 4th and 1 from midfield on your first possession was a bad one.

For two of the "bright young coaches" in the game, I thought they blinked in the bright lights.

This is why I don't like "guru" coaches.

I think Tomlin and Cowher were purposefully hired early because they probably didn't have big egos yet and would accept collaboration with the GM and coordinators.

Is Tomlin turning into a guru coach by calling his own defense? Maybe. That's why I would have preferred getting an outside very good DC...so we could recreate the dynamic we had with DLB as DC. I think that's also basically what happened when we had Haley working with Ben. I think they both probably forced each other out of their comfort zones and the offense got better because of it (before the whole thing fell apart because Haley is apparently an *******).

[feltdizz]

Maybe it was the coaching but I felt like the game was a bit boring. A few nice plays but overall I was a bit unimpressed.

Maybe its because this years playoffs were so good?

[brothervad]

Maybe it was the coaching but I felt like the game was a bit boring. A few nice plays but overall I was a bit unimpressed.

Maybe its because this years playoffs were so good?

Honest question here...how would you have felt if Joe B. marched down the field ala Joe Montana and win in the end? The reason I ask is that it may have led to the whole...we have the next great legend discussion this morning.

As for the play calling...I actually do think data analytics is kind of messing the game up a bit. I was at a party yesterday and said...you need to punt here but he will go for it...because the analytics say so...the problem with analytics...is that it doesn't account for the situation/scenario...the Rams team has been here recently, the Bengals it's their first time...don't give them a shorter field at this point becuase of the potential tightness a team being in the show first time in, typically has when playing.

Perhaps one day (probably in the near future), the modeling will enable that multi level detail of analytics, but just having a 4th and 1 at the opponents 49 gives you an 92% chance of success, does not take into account momentum - which is a real thing.

brothervad

[NorthCoast]

It felt at times like both teams were playing not to lose. But CIN's DC screwed up big time by letting Kupp get those key catches on the Rams last drive. Ryan Clark mentioned they went to a 3 deep shell and it was like they gifted wrapped the plays for Stafford.
Neither coach was perfect but McVay made better in-game adjustments, especially after OBJ went down. Taylor should have let Burrow run more. It's what killed the Chiefs defense in their playoff game.

[crushedspirit]

Hmmm, 4 playoff trips in 5 years, 2 SB appearances with 1 SB win, and a 7-3 playoff record.

McVay must be doing something right, even with his brain lapses.

[Northern_Blitz]

Hmmm, 4 playoff trips in 5 years, 2 SB appearances with 1 SB win, and a 7-3 playoff record.

McVay must be doing something right, even with his brain lapses.

Is your argument that we can consider coaches that get 4 playoff trips, 2 SB appearances, and 1 SB win in their first 5 years to be good coaches?

If so, I agree.

Also, does this still apply to coaches that go 5-3 in the playoffs over those five years (with two 1st round byes vs. 1)?

And do McVay's accomplishments still count if his best player (Aaron Donald) was drafted before he got there?

[flippy]

Is your argument that we can consider coaches that get 4 playoff trips, 2 SB appearances, and 1 SB win in their first 5 years to be good coaches?

If so, I agree.

Also, does this still apply to coaches that go 5-3 in the playoffs over those five years (with two 1st round byes vs. 1)?

And do McVay's accomplishments still count if his best player (Aaron Donald) was drafted before he got there?

And the circular argument starts over

[NJ-STEELER]

Is your argument that we can consider coaches that get 4 playoff trips, 2 SB appearances, and 1 SB win in their first 5 years to be good coaches?

If so, I agree.

Also, does this still apply to coaches that go 5-3 in the playoffs over those five years (with two 1st round byes vs. 1)?

And do McVay's accomplishments still count if his best player (Aaron Donald) was drafted before he got there?

rams went 13 years without a winning season before mcvay got there

the coach i think you're referring to had a team that won the SB a season removed

[feltdizz]

Is your argument that we can consider coaches that get 4 playoff trips, 2 SB appearances, and 1 SB win in their first 5 years to be good coaches?

If so, I agree.

Also, does this still apply to coaches that go 5-3 in the playoffs over those five years (with two 1st round byes vs. 1)?

And do McVay's accomplishments still count if his best player (Aaron Donald) was drafted before he got there?

He inherited Donald!!! It doesn’t count. lol

[NJ-STEELER]

Is best player (Aaron Donald) was drafted
?

a few more picks in that draft and it would have been hilarious to read all the excuses for not drafting a multiple DPOY.

... he doesn't fit out skeeeem
... yinz need a 350 Lb iDL to stop the run
... he's not big enough to occupy OL to let our linebackers run free na'aat

and lastly, we can't afford to pay 1 guy that much money

[crushedspirit]

Is your argument that we can consider coaches that get 4 playoff trips, 2 SB appearances, and 1 SB win in their first 5 years to be good coaches?

If so, I agree.

Also, does this still apply to coaches that go 5-3 in the playoffs over those five years (with two 1st round byes vs. 1)?

And do McVay's accomplishments still count if his best player (Aaron Donald) was drafted before he got there?

He did what he could with Jared friggin Goff as his QB the first 4 seasons, even getting to the SB with that pumpkin wearing a jersey. He had Donald there who is elite, but this current team is pretty much his roster, including being part of drafting the best WR in the game today. First year with an actual NFL QB and he wins it all. Have to give credit where it's due, even if he has his lapses.

[crushedspirit]

I didn't even post to argue anything. Was just pointing out the guy has accomplished much in his first 5 seasons, even with his lapses at times.

[NJ-STEELER]

He did what he could with Jared friggin Goff as his QB the first 4 seasons, even getting to the SB with that pumpkin wearing a jersey. He had Donald there who is elite, but this current team is pretty much his roster, including being part of drafting the best WR in the game today. First year with an actual NFL QB and he wins it all. Have to give credit where it's due, even if he has his lapses.

we will see if he learns from those lapses.

we ctainly haven't seen the improvement here from 14-15 years ago

[Northern_Blitz]

I didn't even post to argue anything. Was just pointing out the guy has accomplished much in his first 5 seasons, even with his lapses at times.

Sorry Crushedspirit. It sometimes gets cumbersome having the same conversations over and over (and I certainly share in the blame for that).

I thought that the similarities between Tomlin and McVay were pretty striking in their first 5 years. And my guess is that most who strongly dislike Tomlin would agree with us that McVay is a good coach.

I agree that he is a good coach. And at this point, I think he has a great chance to be more successful that Tomlin (in the playoffs at least). Because Tomlin and Ben didn't have very much playoff success after those first 5 years. I do think it's impressive that McVay has had success with 2 different QBs. I bet that's pretty rare, especially in such a short amount of time.

I was less sure the first time because it was a single good season with a highly drafted QB (who didn't look great or terrible at the time) and a great defense*. I think that's the recipe for good success in the NFL these days.

But I'm a believer that McVay's is a good coach this year (and would have been even if they didn't win the SB).

He has accomplished a lot in a short time.

I think that he'll probably still be a good coach if this is short lived success because of how they build their team (acquire good players at the expense of draft picks). Because winning this much in a short period of time is always going to be hard in the NFL.

* I still think that the D is the best part of the Rams team despite the fact that McV is thought to be an offensive guy. But I think a big part of being a good HC is playing well with others and he's clearly doing that on D (where he probably isn't running nearly as much as he does on O).