Fire Mike Tomlin

[brothervad]

Looking back on any of this is an exercise in futility in my opinion.

Sure this is a MB, so it's all about opinions and I guess this is mine.

I too have my problems with Tomlin, but I also have problems with Colbert.

But ladies and gentlemen, I tell you, my assessment of Tomlin as a head coach starts today and finishes at the end of this season.

Even he admitted today that having new people in charge on both sides of the ball is uncharted territory for him.

For me, the test of great coach is being able to rise to the challenge.

My bar is I think fairly low, I will use W-L but it is just a framework.

1) 8-6 he did a good job given the challenge (I know people will say no losing record, but look what happens when teams lose their franchise QB).

2) 9-5 or better great job

3) Playoff run Coach of the year status

4) Super Bowl appearance, I will say my inclinations were incorrect on his shortcomings.

Anything less than 8-6 will have me say the jury is still out on him.

Just my bar...fair or unfair.

Brothervad

[NorthCoast]

Putting this back out there not to convince the Tomlin haters but maybe to give some perspective on his approach to coaching:

https://theundefeated.com/features/mike-tomlin-pittsburgh-steelers-in-search-of-the-real-coach/

[Steel Maniac]

Looking back on any of this is an exercise in futility in my opinion.

Sure this is a MB, so it's all about opinions and I guess this is mine.

I too have my problems with Tomlin, but I also have problems with Colbert.

But ladies and gentlemen, I tell you, my assessment of Tomlin as a head coach starts today and finishes at the end of this season.

Even he admitted today that having new people in charge on both sides of the ball is uncharted territory for him.

For me, the test of great coach is being able to rise to the challenge.

My bar is I think fairly low, I will use W-L but it is just a framework.

1) 8-6 he did a good job given the challenge (I know people will say no losing record, but look what happens when teams lose their franchise QB).

2) 9-5 or better great job

3) Playoff run Coach of the year status

4) Super Bowl appearance, I will say my inclinations were incorrect on his shortcomings.

Anything less than 8-6 will have me say the jury is still out on him.

Just my bar...fair or unfair.

Brothervad

Brothervad, I like what you said.Since your just judging Tomlin on this year alone, what grade would you give Tomlin so far with two games in the books?

[whatever]

I'm not sure how finishing the season 9-7 is a great job coaching.
This team is loaded (once again), has a easy second half schedule and plays in a weak division.

[Disco1981]

I'm not sure how finishing the season 9-7 is a great job coaching.
This team is loaded (once again), has a easy second half schedule and plays in a weak division.

"Loaded"...Not sure that is the right word...

Franchise QB gone
RB... Always hurt
OL...Everyone raves about, Can't run the ball
WR...One!

DL... Hargrave the best imo...The 3 big money ones....meh
LB..Watt......Bush I'd a room, that's it
DB...Haden solid, Like Sutton, Nelson average, Edmonds ( no.2 pick ) Average so far, new guy

How are we loaded again

[Disco1981]

I'm not sure how finishing the season 9-7 is a great job coaching.
This team is loaded (once again), has a easy second half schedule and plays in a weak division.

"Loaded"...Not sure that is the right word...

Franchise QB gone
RB... Always hurt
OL...Everyone raves about, Can't run the ball
WR...One!

DL... Hargrave the best imo...The 3 big money ones....meh
LB..Watt......Bush Is a Rook, that's it
DB...Haden solid, Like Sutton, Nelson average, Edmonds ( no.2 pick ) Average so far, new guy

How are we loaded again

[Ernie]

tuitt is tough.. Heyward looks like the least of the 3 right now

[brothervad]

Brothervad, I like what you said.Since your just judging Tomlin on this year alone, what grade would you give Tomlin so far with two games in the books?

It's not good. I have felt for a while now that Tomlin's teams are never prepared at the start of the season...and while it just may be fuzzy memory of sloppy play or gut feeling there is some data to indicate this to be true

Looking since 2014 this how the first quarter of the seasons of the Steelers have looked:

	2014		2015		2016		2017		2018
W/L	11	5	10	6	11	5	13	3	9.5	6.5
1Q (W/L)	2	2	2	2	3	1	3	1	1.5	2.5
% of losses for season	40%		33%		25%		33%		38%

So the records look great and for that I don't complain. But you do see that the Steelers do lose more than 25% of their games in the first month of the season. And even in their 13-3 season they lost their 2nd game in week 5 (3-2). So I guess to answer your question...I have come to expect slow starts from the Steelers. Although in none of the earlier seasons did they ever start out 0-2.

So right now I would say Mike Tomlin is not performing well (or at least the team/coaching as a whole).

brothervad

[brothervad]

I'm not sure how finishing the season 9-7 is a great job coaching.
This team is loaded (once again), has a easy second half schedule and plays in a weak division.

I would agree with the post by Whatever (and others) about your term being loaded is not my term. Also I don't have to look any further back than last year and saw what happened when Aaron Rogers went down. And it wasn't like they didn't have similar talent s we do. (Davante Adams had 1300+ yards).

Connor is a good back but watching Leveon play on Monday night for a bad Jets team made me remember how good he was (saw him hurdle a tackler). Also Connor has always had the injury bug even at Pitt (not talking about Cancer...he had an ACL the season before that happened).

Our WR corp is not proven outside of JuJu. I do not think they are loaded there.
TE is not loaded - it has been an iffy spot for a while now and McDonald is the real deal but he too has had injury issues
OL - I think something is missing and I believe the loss of Munchak shows (IMO)

On D the line is very good, the LB's are a mixture of bust (Dupree) and new/youth and great (TJ Watt)

Secondary young/new/lacking talent or discipline.

Coaching - is questionable for years now.

As far as the easier schedule and my take on 9-7 being great. It's not 9-7 it's 9-5 that is a 64% win percentage. That is a 10-6 season is pretty great given you lost your franchise QB.

As far as the easier schedule. I think the following plays out (at best) 4-2 in division (split with Browns/Ravens, sweep Cincy), 1-3 against NFC west (Arizona only win), L - Chargers, W against the Colts, AFC East (2-2, maybe 3-1, the Bills are the wildcard in this one and it being a home game for the Steelers I think they win). So that tallies up 8-8 or 9-7.

And I think that would be a very good/great coaching job

brothervad

[Jooser]

NEVER thought I'd agree with this blow hard, but he is speaking some truth here. The D stinks, and it's not a lack of talent. TOO MANY high draft picks running around out there. They're simply out of position.

[Mr.wizard]

I'm not sure how finishing the season 9-7 is a great job coaching.
This team is loaded (once again), has a easy second half schedule and plays in a weak division.

We are not loaded and we dont play in a weak division.

[Ernie]

we certainly dont play in a weak division...and i dont think the competition is with Cleveland for last place.

[fordfixer]

We are not loaded and we dont play in a weak division.

Some time I think the front office and the coaching staff is loaded also.

[Obviously]

While it's never enforced, I think we have a rule that posts on politics (and race) should go in Off Topic.

If you're argument is that Tomlin wasn't the best candidate, perhaps you should check on the "success" the other two finalists for the job (Russ Grimm and Ken Wisenhunt) had after leaving the Steelers.

Nevermind, I'll do it for you.
- Grimm (who was the front runner IIRC) had 2 more years as an offensive line coach for a year or two and then was out of coaching. Never considered for another head coaching job.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russ_Grimm

- Wisenhunt had stints as head coach with the Cardinals (6 seasons) and Titans (1.5 season). His record as a coach in arizona was 45 - 51. His record in Ten was 3 - 20. Imagine what would happen if a coach in Pit went 3 - 20! He did have 2 winning seasons in Ari though...you may remember that he lost the SB to our boy Tomlin (even though he had his own Hall of Fame QB in Warner).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ken_Whisenhunt

I get that Tomlin isn't perfect. But, I don't know how anyone could argue that he wasn't easily the best of the three finalists for the job.

Not acknowledging that makes it pretty clear that someone's engaged in revisionist history.

This is a stupid argument for saying Tomlin was the better hire of the 3. The last time I checked Whiz took the Cardinals to the SB and had us beat if it wasn't for Ben throwing the best pass of his life to Holmes. I think Whiz's taking a team that has never been to the SB in two years is much more impressive than a guy who took a team who was two years removed from a SB.

Plus, we don't know what Whiz or Grimm could have done with the roster Tomlin was handed, the same way we don't know what Tomlin would have done in Arizona. I look at Tomlin as being our version of Barry Switzer or George Seifert. The only thing working in Tomlin's favor is the Rooney's seem to be more forgiving then the Cowboys or 49ers and there is a rule created by our owners that gave us this stiff in the first place.

[Steel Maniac]

NEVER thought I'd agree with this blow hard, but he is speaking some truth here. The D stinks, and it's not a lack of talent. TOO MANY high draft picks running around out there. They're simply out of position.

This is my point. The schemes are flawed.