Big Ben and Jesse James are bonding in the red zone

[Shawn]

He definitely deserves the most blame. Every year we hear about this high powered offense and most years we still had terrible RZ numbers. Anyway me who is honest with themselves will admit Ben isn't the best RZ QB.

I'm fully aware that you believe that. It's interesting how you can predict the Steelers will be just fine without Ben. Make me wonder what he's done to you.

[feltdizz]

I'm fully aware that you believe that. It's interesting how you can predict the Steelers will be just fine without Ben. Make me wonder what he's done to you.

Ben hasn't done anything to me but he hasn't done anything these last few years that make me believe we will be lost without him. Ben is a great QB. He was exactly what we needed when we drafted him but I'm not going to act like those Steeler teams before Ben were terrible. We had some great teams, what we didn't have was a clutch QB at the time. Unfortunately Ben hasn't been as clutch late in his career and he eats up a ton of cap space. While he still gives us the best chance to win I think we will still field competitive teams without him and there is no guarantee we go another 25 years before another SB once he leaves. I'm also not a Ricky Bobby type of fan who thinks if they don't win the SB they are a bunch of losers. While it's frustrating to see them lose in AFCCG's or in the playoffs it's still much better than being 6-10 with no hope for the future.

[Shawn]

Ben hasn't done anything to me but he hasn't done anything these last few years that make me believe we will be lost without him. Ben is a great QB. He was exactly what we needed when we drafted him but I'm not going to act like those Steeler teams before Ben were terrible. We had some great teams, what we didn't have was a clutch QB at the time. Unfortunately Ben hasn't been as clutch late in his career and he eats up a ton of cap space. While he still gives us the best chance to win I think we will still field competitive teams without him and there is no guarantee we go another 25 years before another SB once he leaves. I'm also not a Ricky Bobby type of fan who thinks if they don't win the SB they are a bunch of losers. While it's frustrating to see them lose in AFCCG's or in the playoffs it's still much better than being 6-10 with no hope for the future.

I was a fan in 1981...and remember all those years before Ben. I'm going to highly disagree with you. I believe you may be a bit delusional.

[feltdizz]

I was a fan in 1981...and remember all those years before Ben. I'm going to highly disagree with you. I believe you may be a bit delusional.

well if it happened in 1981 it is certain to repeat itself once Ben leaves? I mean, why wouldn't it?

The NFL was much different in 81 than in will be in 2021. It's delusional to think what happened in 1981 will happen again, especailly when you factor in the athletes, the scouting and the FO in place in Pittsburgh.

[Shawn]

well if it happened in 1981 it is certain to repeat itself once Ben leaves? I mean, why wouldn't it?

The NFL was much different in 81 than in will be in 2021. It's delusional to think what happened in 1981 will happen again, especially when you factor in the athletes, the scouting and the FO in place in Pittsburgh.

I suppose you could take that line of thinking. But, in 1981 there was more of an emphasis on the running game. The rules had yet to be altered to increase passing and scoring. I had to go back to 2003 in order to find a Super Bowl winner without a franchise QB. If anything it has gotten harder to win consistently let alone win a Super Bowl without a franchise/franchise-ish QB.

The only thing supporting your stance is the fact that due to the rule changes, rookie QBs seem to be having more success. With that said, that's still the great minority.

[feltdizz]

Denver and Seattle recently won sB's with defense and average passing attacks. Peyton was a bum his last Super Bowl and they won half their games with a terrible backup QB. Seattle has Russell Wilson and while he seems to be touched by an angle half the time the guy is more of a running threat and isn't really considered a tier one passing QB.

Dallas was a play or 2 away from a NFCCG with a 4th round QB who definitely didn't have a college tape that blew anyone away.

No, I'm not really worried about our franchise after Ben because we have one of the best FO's in all of sports. Our biggest flaw in the 80's was holding onto a HOF coach past his prime but it's hard to move on from a 4 ring HC. If Cowher actually cared about the QB position we probably would have another ring or 2!during his time here even though he was a winner.

The reason rookies are playing better is because they are actually playing instead of rotting on the bench. Hell, Cowher prolly would have kept Ben on the bench until he retired if Maddox didn't get hurt.

One more thing, franchise-ish is all I think we need to win a SB.

[Shawn]

Manning was still a savvy vet presence even though he played like ish down the stretch. You may have a point there but I'll say that Denver D was one of the best I've seen. I'll disagree about Wilson. While he isn't top 5 he is certainly top 10 and I don't think many would disagree. He hasn't had a real WR threat to work with and he still puts up numbers and wins. He's a good QB and I sure as heck would take a guy like that after Ben.

[feltdizz]

Manning was still a savvy vet presence even though he played like ish down the stretch. You may have a point there but I'll say that Denver D was one of the best I've seen. I'll disagree about Wilson. While he isn't top 5 he is certainly top 10 and I don't think many would disagree. He hasn't had a real WR threat to work with and he still puts up numbers and wins. He's a good QB and I sure as heck would take a guy like that after Ben.

I like Russell but let's not act like the threat to run and Beast Mode weren't his best weapons. Peyton was a freaking bum this last SB run.

Thing is, guys like Russell Wilson can be found in later rounds.

[Shawn]

I like Russell but let's not act like the threat to run and Beast Mode weren't his best weapons. Peyton was a freaking bum this last SB run.

Thing is, guys like Russell Wilson can be found in later rounds.

They can be but the math isn't on your side.

[squidkid]

I'm fully aware that you believe that. It's interesting how you can predict the Steelers will be just fine without Ben. Make me wonder what he's done to you.

ben is white