The Denver punt return called back

[Moonie]

Can anyone tell me why the punt wasn't ruled down when Shmarko put his hand on the still ball? How do you down a punt in the NFL? I feel like I've seen hundreds of punts called down when a punting team member merely puts a hand on the ball. Why was this punt different?

How did the Denver return man know it was a live ball when everyone else thought it was downed? Since it was live, looks like Shmark Thomas has made yet another special teams mistake. He doesn't have much time left on the Steelers.

Do Steelers make these dead vs. live ball mistakes more than most? Seems like 2-3 times a year we do something similar, people dancing or milling around while the ball is live.

[Starlifter]

Can anyone tell me why the punt wasn't ruled down when Shmarko put his hand on the still ball? How do you down a punt in the NFL? I feel like I've seen hundreds of punts called down when a punting team member merely puts a hand on the ball. Why was this punt different?

How did the Denver return man know it was a live ball when everyone else thought it was downed? Since it was live, looks like Shmark Thomas has made yet another special teams mistake. He doesn't have much time left on the Steelers.

Do Steelers make these dead vs. live ball mistakes more than most? Seems like 2-3 times a year we do something similar, people dancing or milling around while the ball is live.

here's the way I understand it.

In order to 'down' a punt - the receiving team has to surrender possession by not touching it, and then the kicking team has to take possession. clearly this is what happens 99% of the time. the kicking team runs down and at some point picks up the football. now they can't touch the ball at one point and then carry it deeper towards the opponents goal line. if they try, the spot is where it was first touched. if they merely surround the ball and the receiving team makes no attempt to take possession, the refs will blow the play dead and spot the ball. the key being however in all these scenarios is that possession is involved.

what happened at the steelers game was an illegal touch. here's the rule:

“First touching” is when a player of the kicking team touches a scrimmage kick that is beyond theline of scrimmage before it has been touched by a player of the receiving team beyond the line. If the ballis first touched by a player of the kicking team, it remains in play. First touching is a violation, and thereceivers shall have the option of taking possession of the ball at the spot of first touching, provided nopenalty is accepted on the play, or at the spot where the ball is dead. First touching does not offset a foulby the receivers.


shemarko should have simply picked the ball up. by touching it first and before the receiving team clearly surrendered possession in the eyes of the refs - he turned it into a live ball, and the ability to return it at absolutely zero risk to the receiving team. no matter what the result of the play after the broncos picked it up - if they didn't like it, they could have had the ball returned to where shemarko touched it and had the penalty enforced.

another famous example of this is the snow game when leon lett illegally touched the ball and allowed the receiving team to then take it in for a score.

it's rare and confusing. but I believe this is what happened with the broncos.

[winwithd]

here's the way I understand it.

In order to 'down' a punt - the receiving team has to surrender possession by not touching it, and then the kicking team has to take possession. clearly this is what happens 99% of the time. the kicking team runs down and at some point picks up the football. now they can't touch the ball at one point and then carry it deeper towards the opponents goal line. if they try, the spot is where it was first touched. if they merely surround the ball and the receiving team makes no attempt to take possession, the refs will blow the play dead and spot the ball. the key being however in all these scenarios is that possession is involved.

what happened at the steelers game was an illegal touch. here's the rule:

“First touching” is when a player of the kicking team touches a scrimmage kick that is beyond theline of scrimmage before it has been touched by a player of the receiving team beyond the line. If the ballis first touched by a player of the kicking team, it remains in play. First touching is a violation, and thereceivers shall have the option of taking possession of the ball at the spot of first touching, provided nopenalty is accepted on the play, or at the spot where the ball is dead. First touching does not offset a foulby the receivers.


shemarko should have simply picked the ball up. by touching it first and before the receiving team clearly surrendered possession in the eyes of the refs - he turned it into a live ball, and the ability to return it at absolutely zero risk to the receiving team. no matter what the result of the play after the broncos picked it up - if they didn't like it, they could have had the ball returned to where shemarko touched it and had the penalty enforced.

another famous example of this is the snow game when leon lett illegally touched the ball and allowed the receiving team to then take it in for a score.

it's rare and confusing. but I believe this is what happened with the broncos.

Shamarko's foot was on the white stripe (sideline) at the same time he was touching the ball. Upon review the play should have been brought back anyway. Someone i heard, I think it was Tomlin, said Shamarko should have picked the ball up and handed it to the official.

I was excited for this guy as a rookie because he was so explosive, if he could get right 'above the shoulders' I think he could be a long term answer at safety.

[Oviedo]

Shamarko's foot was on the white stripe (sideline) at the same time he was touching the ball. Upon review the play should have been brought back anyway. Someone i heard, I think it was Tomlin, said Shamarko should have picked the ball up and handed it to the official.

I was excited for this guy as a rookie because he was so explosive, if he could get right 'above the shoulders' I think he could be a long term answer at safety.

Shamarko is likely nothing more than a journeyman back up. What is really frustrating is that we traded a pick to move up to get him

[Iron City Inc.]

here's the way I understand it.


shemarko should have simply picked the ball up. by touching it first and before the receiving team clearly surrendered possession in the eyes of the refs - he turned it into a live ball, and the ability to return it at absolutely zero risk to the receiving team. no matter what the result of the play after the broncos picked it up - if they didn't like it, they could have had the ball returned to where shemarko touched it and had the penalty enforced.

.

Had the Broncos fumbled the return and we recovered it it would still be their ball. Once we had the illegal touching they can not loose possession. Unusual rule but a rule none the less.

[Shawn]

Shamarko is likely nothing more than a journeyman back up. What is really frustrating is that we traded a pick to move up to get him

stop your complaining and enjoy our playoff run.

[Starlifter]

Shamarko's foot was on the white stripe (sideline) at the same time he was touching the ball. Upon review the play should have been brought back anyway. Someone i heard, I think it was Tomlin, said Shamarko should have picked the ball up and handed it to the official.

I was excited for this guy as a rookie because he was so explosive, if he could get right 'above the shoulders' I think he could be a long term answer at safety.

yes, that's true and if reviewed would have negated everything else - but not relevant with respect to the discussion of downing a punt vs. illegal touching. that's why I didn't mention it.

[Mr.wizard]

Touching it doesn't down the ball you have to actually "posses" it for it to be whistled dead. Its the same Idea when the punt is crossing the goaline and a player slaps it backwards, the ball is still live until the kicking team picks it up. If the kicking team touches it without downing it the receiving team can return it with fear of fumble.

[BradshawsHairdresser]

Touching it doesn't down the ball you have to actually "posses" it for it to be whistled dead. Its the same Idea when the punt is crossing the goaline and a player slaps it backwards, the ball is still live until the kicking team picks it up. If the kicking team touches it without downing it the receiving team can return it with fear of fumble.

Do you mean "without fear of fumble"?

[Moonie]

Thanks for the explanations.

Schmarckoh T. must be one confused/dopey football player. And the Denver returner relatively quick witted to realize Schmark's dopehood.

[Mr.wizard]

Do you mean "without fear of fumble"?

If the kicking team touches the ball without downing it the receiving team can return it and even if they fumble it away they still get the ball at the spot of the touch.

[BradshawsHairdresser]

If the kicking team touches the ball without downing it the receiving team can return it and even if they fumble it away they still get the ball at the spot of the touch.

Yup. Thought that's what you meant. Just wanted to make sure I understood you correctly.