Who is this guy in this years draft?

[K Train]

Oh yeah not to mention Ziggy Hood. I mean could they have drafted a guy who looks like Tarzan and plays like Jane? Dupree is Hood 2.0.

Hood was a blunder in a year they really needed DL. I was angry at the pick for a long long time but i forgive them.

[Shawn]

Who were these tough and technically skills players that you are talking about? Aside from Aaron Smith and Casey Hampton?

Porter? Speed product at 6-4 244
Kendrell Bell? 6-1 234...SMALLER than Shazier
Larry Foote? Another undersized LB
How about Farrior? A vastly undersized MLB
Alonzo Jackson?
How about polamalu? Freakishly athletic, completely undersized USC product?

I guess Shaun Nua, Orien Harris, and Anthony smith were all "tough players" lol

You made my point for me. Most of those guys besides Alonzo were very physical players. Bell might have been the most physical player we have had since Lambert. Farrior was a run stuffing beast. Porter wasn't just finesse, as he could lock horns as well. That's what we are missing in recent drafts. We pass on a guy like Mosley because he didn't have the 40 time. We draft Ziggy Hood. We draft JJ who really only had one contested sack his senior season and that was a running back he got past. I am noticing a trend. Could be a coincidence but I'm thinking not. And when we draft Dupree over a guy like OD, I'll know Im right.

[birtikidis]

You made my point for me. Most of those guys besides Alonzo were very physical players. Bell might have been the most physical player we have had since Lambert. Farrior was a run stuffing beast. Porter wasn't just finesse, as he could lock horns as well. That's what we are missing in recent drafts. We pass on a guy like Mosley because he didn't have the 40 time. We draft Ziggy Hood. We draft JJ who really only had one contested sack his senior season and that was a running back he got past. I am noticing a trend. Could be a coincidence but I'm thinking not. And when we draft Dupree over a guy like OD, I'll know Im right.

I think we passed on Mosley more because of the long line of disappointing LB'rs out of Alabama and his injury history more than his 40 time.
For all you know, Mosely could blow out that knee again and be forced to leave football. One season a great career does not make.

[birtikidis]

sorry, it was his shoulder and hip, not his knee.

[K Train]

You made my point for me. Most of those guys besides Alonzo were very physical players. Bell might have been the most physical player we have had since Lambert. Farrior was a run stuffing beast. Porter wasn't just finesse, as he could lock horns as well. That's what we are missing in recent drafts. We pass on a guy like Mosley because he didn't have the 40 time. We draft Ziggy Hood. We draft JJ who really only had one contested sack his senior season and that was a running back he got past. I am noticing a trend. Could be a coincidence but I'm thinking not. And when we draft Dupree over a guy like OD, I'll know Im right.

I think you are looking at Jones and Shazier and falsely making conclusions about their toughness. Shazier's knee getting rolled up on isnt a good measure of his toughness. Jones has looked slow at times, but not soft...hes not putting up sack numbers but he has no quit in him and if you are going to talk about "one contested sack" you can talk about leading the nation in TFL too.

Hood was soft, i wont contest that ever.

Then Timmons, Woodley, Heyward, Tuitt, and even Harrison who won over Tomlin but not Cowher are all very tough players.

You are looking at shaziers ridiculous speed and making a conclusion that they are the Al Davis raiders now, thats just not true. They took him over mosely because they liked him, his value was right around there, and they are familiar with the program. Some people hate that, but it works like that an AWFUL lot around the league

Then they draft a 6-8 350 pound NT....

I dont know how old you are but you are doing the same thing all old guys do in being convinced the past was always better, or tougher, previous generations always reign supreme blah blah blah.

Also, I hope Dupree is not the pick over Odighizuwa....really im hoping they trade up for ray though.....is he soft too just because hes fast?

[Slapstick]

Hood was a blunder in a year they really needed DL. I was angry at the pick for a long long time but i forgive them.

Perhaps, but there were no real players at that point in the draft...look at the names drafted after Hood...maybe one or two names of better players, but that's about it...

[K Train]

Perhaps, but there were no real players at that point in the draft...look at the names drafted after Hood...maybe one or two names of better players, but that's about it...

Awful draft....could have had Maualuga or Darius Butler.

Yuck lol

[Shawn]

I think we passed on Mosley more because of the long line of disappointing LB'rs out of Alabama and his injury history more than his 40 time.
For all you know, Mosely could blow out that knee again and be forced to leave football. One season a great career does not make.

I would think anyone with minimal football knowledge could have seen Mosley was a player. The school shouldn't have any bearing.

[Shawn]

I think you are looking at Jones and Shazier and falsely making conclusions about their toughness. Shazier's knee getting rolled up on isnt a good measure of his toughness. Jones has looked slow at times, but not soft...hes not putting up sack numbers but he has no quit in him and if you are going to talk about "one contested sack" you can talk about leading the nation in TFL too.

Hood was soft, i wont contest that ever.

Then Timmons, Woodley, Heyward, Tuitt, and even Harrison who won over Tomlin but not Cowher are all very tough players.

You are looking at shaziers ridiculous speed and making a conclusion that they are the Al Davis raiders now, thats just not true. They took him over mosely because they liked him, his value was right around there, and they are familiar with the program. Some people hate that, but it works like that an AWFUL lot around the league

Then they draft a 6-8 350 pound NT....

I dont know how old you are but you are doing the same thing all old guys do in being convinced the past was always better, or tougher, previous generations always reign supreme blah blah blah.

Also, I hope Dupree is not the pick over Odighizuwa....really im hoping they trade up for ray though.....is he soft too just because hes fast?

I don't base my opinion of toughness on their 40 times. I base it on the game play. I doubt many have seen more of Shazier than myself including Steeler staff before the 2014 draft. He wasn't "soft" but he wasn't physical. He was easily washed out of plays and locked up. He didn't out muscle many people. He was fast, athleticm shot gaps with the best of em but didn't out muscle anyone. He wasn't known for his toughness. JJ IMO is more physical but lacked serious strength coming into the league. He didn't beat but one guy for a sack his senior year. I think he is getting better and stronger and will eventually be a good lbr for us. I also think Shazier is going to pan out eventually. But, neither are truly physical guys.

[K Train]

I would think anyone with minimal football knowledge could have seen Mosley was a player. The school shouldn't have any bearing.

Same thing could be said about Shazier though.

Mosely is probably the better MLB prospect because shazier is a true WILL backer but from a team looking to be "more multiple" he is an excellent piece to have

[Shawn]

Same thing could be said about Shazier though.

Mosely is probably the better MLB prospect because shazier is a true WILL backer but from a team looking to be "more multiple" he is an excellent piece to have

You won't get any argument from me here. Shazier brings a certain ability to move him all over the field. I believe that's how they will use him eventually, if not this season. His first step is ridiculous and I honestly don't think there is a RT in the league who can block him when he gets the jump. tOSU moved him around effectively. Why not here?

[RuthlessBurgher]

I don't base my opinion of toughness on their 40 times. I base it on the game play. I doubt many have seen more of Shazier than myself including Steeler staff before the 2014 draft. He wasn't "soft" but he wasn't physical. He was easily washed out of plays and locked up. He didn't out muscle many people. He was fast, athleticm shot gaps with the best of em but didn't out muscle anyone. He wasn't known for his toughness. JJ IMO is more physical but lacked serious strength coming into the league. He didn't beat but one guy for a sack his senior year. I think he is getting better and stronger and will eventually be a good lbr for us. I also think Shazier is going to pan out eventually. But, neither are truly physical guys.

Shazier and Mosely were both ranked similarly last year. Both were bonafide first round talents, but were available in the middle of the round because teams value QB's, OT's, pass rushers, and corners more than ILB's in this day and age. Shazier had more speed and less of an injury history than Mosley coming out. Once upon a time, Timmons was the speedy young linebacker, but at this point in his career, he is the consistent physical presence in the middle. Once upon a time, Polamalu was able to be a quasi-safety-linebacker-hybrid who was physically gifted enough to be the disruptive rover wildcard of our defense, but those abilities have obviously significantly declined with age. Drafting Shazier gave them someone with attributes of a young Timmons and a young Polamalu, since they no longer had a player like either of those guys in their younger days. Drafting Mosley would have given them someone who is similar to what Timmons is for us now. Would getting another Timmons be a good thing? Sure. But Shazier was more of a unique prospect, and I'm not surprised that team went that route. Mosely would have been a solid pick as well, but teams often get similar type players in the second round (Bobby Wagner, James Laurinaitis, Paul Pozluszny, etc.).

[Slapstick]

I don't understand the complaints about drafting Shazier and Jarvis Jones...

They were two of the most productive LBs in college when they were drafted...people complain about "finesse" and "speed" when they could just as easily look at the production...

That would be the only thing to make me nervous about Ogidhizuwa and Dupree...though if Ogidhizuwa's hips are healed, you at least have a true reason why he didn't produce...and his best stretch of games were his last six, IIRC...

[Shawn]

I don't understand the complaints about drafting Shazier and Jarvis Jones...

They were two of the most productive LBs in college when they were drafted...people complain about "finesse" and "speed" when they could just as easily look at the production...

That would be the only thing to make me nervous about Ogidhizuwa and Dupree...though if Ogidhizuwa's hips are healed, you at least have a true reason why he didn't produce...and his best stretch of games were his last six, IIRC...

There are many highly productive QBs as well, doesn't mean they are ideal first round picks. Also, I'm not really "complaining" about either pick. I am making an argument that physicality and pure technical skills are taking a back burner to speed and athleticism in recent drafts. I believe the new regime believes there are certain physical traits you cant teach and they value that over a polished product, they value you that over a guy who will lock horns and hit you in the mouth. It's a partial reason why this D is no longer feared, no longer intimidating and I don't see that changing with JJ or Shazier.

[Shawn]

Shazier and Mosely were both ranked similarly last year. Both were bonafide first round talents, but were available in the middle of the round because teams value QB's, OT's, pass rushers, and corners more than ILB's in this day and age. Shazier had more speed and less of an injury history than Mosley coming out. Once upon a time, Timmons was the speedy young linebacker, but at this point in his career, he is the consistent physical presence in the middle. Once upon a time, Polamalu was able to be a quasi-safety-linebacker-hybrid who was physically gifted enough to be the disruptive rover wildcard of our defense, but those abilities have obviously significantly declined with age. Drafting Shazier gave them someone with attributes of a young Timmons and a young Polamalu, since they no longer had a player like either of those guys in their younger days. Drafting Mosley would have given them someone who is similar to what Timmons is for us now. Would getting another Timmons be a good thing? Sure. But Shazier was more of a unique prospect, and I'm not surprised that team went that route. Mosely would have been a solid pick as well, but teams often get similar type players in the second round (Bobby Wagner, James Laurinaitis, Paul Pozluszny, etc.).

I don't disagree with any of that. I understand the reasoning.