Tomlin comments inspire confidence in a turnaround.

[Slapstick]

Yet another interesting read.

[feltdizz]

8 years in and Tomlin and Cowher have the same record. IMO Tomlin didn't waste the talent he had since we went to 2 SB's and won 1 in his first 4 years.

I know people hate to hear this but Tomlin has yet to have a losing season. I can't dog Tomlin out too much until he hits rock bottom. If a few .500 seasons are his low point then its a hilarious argument to have regarding who had a better coaching tenure thus far.

I know one thing though...

Cowher went to 2 SB's in 15 years. Demanding 3 or 4 from Tomlin in 8 years in order for him to measure up is a very interesting argument.

[Vader]

8 years in and Tomlin and Cowher have the same record. IMO Tomlin didn't waste the talent he had since we went to 2 SB's and won 1 in his first 4 years.

I know people hate to hear this but Tomlin has yet to have a losing season. I can't dog Tomlin out too much until he hits rock bottom. If a few .500 seasons are his low point then its a hilarious argument to have regarding who had a better coaching tenure thus far.

I know one thing though...

Cowher went to 2 SB's in 15 years. Demanding 3 or 4 from Tomlin in 8 years in order for him to measure up is a very interesting argument.

But you can't look at them in a vacuum. Tomlin walked into a situation where the team was 12 months removed from a SB. He had a 3rd year franchise QB with a great defense. Cowher walked into a team that hadn't won a SB in over a decade and hadn't been to the playoffs but once in 7 years. It's about expectations. Cowher took Kordell Stewart to 2 AFCC games. Tomlin has issues making the playoffs with one of the best QBs in the league. If they don't make the playoffs this year then Tomlin will have missed the playoffs HALF of his tenure. Cowher only missed the playoffs 5 times in 15 years with scrubs at QB and having to replace FAs almost every year.

[feltdizz]

Vader, we know the pedestal you put Cowher on (we ALL loved Cowher, but he's not a deity) but do you honestly think he walked into Pittsburgh, after just 2-years as a Defensive Coordinator in KC, and immediately began selecting draft picks on his own??? There's ZERO chance that happened.

Read this article from Jim Wexell about Cowher's era and some of the similarities to the Tomlin regime. It's a bit long, but really worthwhile:

[URL]http://pit.scout.com/story/1470510-deja-vu-all-over-again?s=68[/URL]

Fabulous read.

[feltdizz]

But you can't look at them in a vacuum. Tomlin walked into a situation where the team was 12 months removed from a SB. He had a 3rd year franchise QB with a great defense. Cowher walked into a team that hadn't won a SB in over a decade and hadn't been to the playoffs but once in 7 years. It's about expectations. Cowher took Kordell Stewart to 2 AFCC games. Tomlin has issues making the playoffs with one of the best QBs in the league. If they don't make the playoffs this year then Tomlin will have missed the playoffs HALF of his tenure. Cowher only missed the playoffs 5 times in 15 years with scrubs at QB and having to replace FAs almost every year.

I would take Tomlins first 8 years over Cowhers...

You can't blame Tomlin for winning a SB with the roster he inherited.

I

[RobinCole]

Vader knows very well that Cowher was not in charge of drafts or free agent signings in his first three years, if he ever was. Like all head coaches, he had substantial input into decisions regarding drafting, signing free agents or trading, but he was not in charge. Hell, even Noll was not in charge of drafts. If he had been, he would have taken Bobby Newhouse instead of Franco in 1972.

The head coach does not outrank the GM.

[Shoe]

Sorry but you are just wrong. Most of Noll's players are GONE by the time of the 95' SB. I don't care when the players were drafted. I said there were very few pro-bowlers on Noll's last team. Which is true. You people seem to think that Cowher took over a great team. Which is just untrue. Cowher took over a team that had been to the playoffs ONCE in the past 7 years. Cowher added a ton of players and most of Noll's were gone quickly. Tomlin won the SB with 10 of 11 starters on defense being from Cowher and 8 of 11 on offense. The 3 on offense not from Cowher's team was a horrible center in Hartwig, a RG that never played again in Stapleton and Spaeth who couldn't block for ****.

Cowher is the contrast. He drafted Searcy, Kirkland, Steed, and Perry in his first draft. He then added Chad Brown, Willie Williams, Buckner, Gildon, Morris, and Bell all before his SB in 95'. To add to that he brought in FAs like Thigpen, John Williams, Tom Newberry and Kevin Greene. So by the time his 3rd season comes around there are 4 Noll starters on offense (even though they all weren't starters for Noll) and 3 on defense. The rest are from Cowher.

Tomlin has almost as many from Cowher TODAY as Cowher had from Noll in just 3 years.

If we agree that the 7 generally most important positions on the field and for our particular team were (in no specific order):
QB
RB
LT
C
NT
OLB
DB

Those spots, for the SB team, were filled by:
QB O'Donnell (Noll)
RB Morris (Cowher)
LT Jackson (Noll)
C Dawson (Noll)
NT Steed? (Cowher)
OLB Lloyd (Noll)
DB Lake (Woodson was hurt; Noll)

So, FOUR long years after Cowher took over the reigns, most of the most important players on our team were still Noll's. Saying "most of the team" was overhauled by the time we got to the SB, well... yeah. It's four seasons in the NFL--turnover happens quickly.

I'm not hating on Cowher. I'm trying to make the point, that Cowher benefited at least as much as Tomlin did, from a full pantry to cook with (to continue the food analogy ).

[NorthCoast]

If we agree that the 7 generally most important positions on the field and for our particular team were (in no specific order):
QB
RB
LT
C
NT
OLB
DB

Those spots, for the SB team, were filled by:
QB O'Donnell (Noll)
RB Morris (Cowher)
LT Jackson (Noll)
C Dawson (Noll)
NT Steed? (Cowher)
OLB Lloyd (Noll)
DB Lake (Woodson was hurt; Noll)

So, FOUR long years after Cowher took over the reigns, most of the most important players on our team were still Noll's. Saying "most of the team" was overhauled by the time we got to the SB, well... yeah. It's four seasons in the NFL--turnover happens quickly.

I'm not hating on Cowher. I'm trying to make the point, that Cowher benefited at least as much as Tomlin did, from a full pantry to cook with (to continue the food analogy ).

Don't try to confuse the naysayers with facts. It will only cause them to imagine some other reason why the HC suddenly forgot how to coach.

[Sword]

The Ravens did it mid-season and they won a Super Bowl after doing so. Isn't that evidence that firing a coordinator mid season can work fabulously? Oh wait, the Rooneys only know how to be slow and un-reactive.

lol..they move about as slow as the turtle in the pond in my backyard....

[hawaiiansteel]

[feltdizz]

^^^^^^$$$$$$$$$$ ^^^^^^

[Vader]

If we agree that the 7 generally most important positions on the field and for our particular team were (in no specific order):
QB
RB
LT
C
NT
OLB
DB

Those spots, for the SB team, were filled by:
QB O'Donnell (Noll)
RB Morris (Cowher)
LT Jackson (Noll)
C Dawson (Noll)
NT Steed? (Cowher)
OLB Lloyd (Noll)
DB Lake (Woodson was hurt; Noll)

So, FOUR long years after Cowher took over the reigns, most of the most important players on our team were still Noll's. Saying "most of the team" was overhauled by the time we got to the SB, well... yeah. It's four seasons in the NFL--turnover happens quickly.

I'm not hating on Cowher. I'm trying to make the point, that Cowher benefited at least as much as Tomlin did, from a full pantry to cook with (to continue the food analogy ).

Cowher didn't benefit as much as Tomlin. That's just ignorant. Tomlin had 10 of 11 starters on defense from Cowher. You trying to mix and match players is bull. Saying that OLB is important but I guess CBs, DLs, WRs, safeties and TEs aren't important is just non-sense. I know most of you guys love Tomlin. That's fine. But trying to say that Tomlin and Cowher basically took over the same teams is just stupid and shows the ignorance that is on this board. Cowher takes over a team that hadn't won anything in over a decade. Tomlin takes over a team 12 months removed from a SB. Tomlin has Cowher players at ALMOST EVER POSITION. While Cowher has a few of Noll's players like John Jackson who never sniffed a pro-bowl and Dawson who never sniffed one until Cowher got there.

But keep drinking the Tomlin cool-aid and having delusions that Tomlin and Cowher took over the same team.

[Slapstick]

Cowher didn't benefit as much as Tomlin. That's just ignorant. Tomlin had 10 of 11 starters on defense from Cowher. You trying to mix and match players is bull. Saying that OLB is important but I guess CBs, DLs, WRs, safeties and TEs aren't important is just non-sense. I know most of you guys love Tomlin. That's fine. But trying to say that Tomlin and Cowher basically took over the same teams is just stupid and shows the ignorance that is on this board. Cowher takes over a team that hadn't won anything in over a decade. Tomlin takes over a team 12 months removed from a SB. Tomlin has Cowher players at ALMOST EVER POSITION. While Cowher has a few of Noll's players like John Jackson who never sniffed a pro-bowl and Dawson who never sniffed one until Cowher got there.

But keep drinking the Tomlin cool-aid and having delusions that Tomlin and Cowher took over the same team.

Yeah, that's yet another straw man argument. Nobody ever said that Tomlin and Cowher took over the same team. It is fair to say that Cowher didn't benefit as much as Tomlin...it is also fair to say that Tomlin accomplished much more with the team he took over. The point is about veteran leadership. While Tomlin may have inherited more talent, to pretend that Cowher took over a team devoid of talent or that Cowher's teams did not fall off after losing that core of veteran leaders is disingenuous.

[hawaiiansteel]

Ed Bouchette @EdBouchette ·

#Steelers are 56-4 when leading by at least 10 points under Mike Tomlin

[URL]https://twitter.com/EdBouchette[/URL]

[ikestops85]

Ed Bouchette @EdBouchette ·

#Steelers are 56-4 when leading by at least 10 points under Mike Tomlin

[URL]https://twitter.com/EdBouchette[/URL]

Is Ed saying that LeBeau's defenses don't consistently blow big leads? I'd have never thought that from reading this site.