Should all the coaches still be fired asap?

[RuthlessBurgher]

Really? After ever game we lose all you hear is how so and so needs to get fired. AFTER EVERY SINGLE LOSS

Fixed that for you.

[birtikidis]

Fixed that for you.

Hell ruthless, there were games that we had people calling for coaches to get fired after a win! I wish it were just losses but dang, some people just love to be unhappy.

[birtikidis]

Could you imagine a day when Ovi wouldn't call for the firing of Lebeau? We could hold the other team to 0 net yards and have the defense score 3 touchdowns and he'd still say the game passed him by.

[RuthlessBurgher]

Could you imagine a day when Ovi wouldn't call for the firing of Lebeau? We could hold the other team to 0 net yards and have the defense score 3 touchdowns and he'd still say the game passed him by.

a 4-3 defense would have scores 4 TD's and held them to negative yards.

[Slapstick]

a 4-3 defense would have scores 4 TD's and held them to negative yards.

All the while starting rookies and second year players....

[Shawn]

Yes Shawn "context" matters. Great point.
Here is some context for the decline in defense.
It is a year removed from an aging defense that STILL ranked 6th in scoring and 1st in yards.

Since that time:
We will start 2 player from that starting lineup Sunday

Our defense consists of Timmons and Heyward and Worilds in their prime and are at best marginal probowl backup level players. More likely none make the probowl.
The rest are:
Talented young pups who have a bright future but are not close to their prime
Over the hill vets who are a shell of their former selves
Just bad players who are the best we've got
No talent at corner whatsoever

So when we drop to "middle of the pack" defensively it is because DL suddenly can't coach?

Context matters people.

Fair enough. So, if you haven't primed the pump who's issue is that? If its ALL a talent issue, then who's job is it to stock the shelves and develop the talent? Why is a slow Troy who hasn't made a real play all year starting over Thomas? If he isn't better than Troy by now I fear for the future. Our best DB is an overpaid Allen. Why is he overpaid? Because we have no one else. So, while some of it is indeed talent and transition...the other part of this is why did it get to this point? I'll tell you why because guys didn't develop like they should...and the talent we did develop left. Is that Tomlins issue or LeBeaus?

[Shawn]

Really? Every year all you hear is how so and so needs to get fired. EVERY SINGLE YEAR

The vast majority of us do not call for the heads of coaches. I was a LeBeau apologist for years. But, when the writing is on the wall...I'll call it. What I hope is LeBeau silences the critics. But, IMO this is his last chance to do so. If the D that showed up against the Ravens shows its ugly head and the D we seen against Carolina is a mirage...LeBeau as beloved as he is will hopefully step down peacefully.

[feltdizz]

Fair enough. So, if you haven't primed the pump who's issue is that? If its ALL a talent issue, then who's job is it to stock the shelves and develop the talent? Why is a slow Troy who hasn't made a real play all year starting over Thomas? If he isn't better than Troy by now I fear for the future. Our best DB is an overpaid Allen. Why is he overpaid? Because we have no one else. So, while some of it is indeed talent and transition...the other part of this is why did it get to this point? I'll tell you why because guys didn't develop like they should...and the talent we did develop left. Is that Tomlins issue or LeBeaus?

Its a franchise issue. We made some questionable decisions when it comes to restocking our defense.

I still think it takes too long to learn this defense. I think it takes 3 to 5 years to master and its not sustainable in todays NFL.

[feltdizz]

The vast majority of us do not call for the heads of coaches. I was a LeBeau apologist for years. But, when the writing is on the wall...I'll call it. What I hope is LeBeau silences the critics. But, IMO this is his last chance to do so. If the D that showed up against the Ravens shows its ugly head and the D we seen against Carolina is a mirage...LeBeau as beloved as he is will hopefully step down peacefully.

I'm in this camp. One thing people need to undersrand is Carolina's offense isn't explosive. They rely on the D getting TO's and working with short fields.

Tampa sucks on O and Jax isn't much better... hopefully the D gains some confidence and momentum.

[NorthCoast]

The vast majority of us do not call for the heads of coaches. I was a LeBeau apologist for years. But, when the writing is on the wall...I'll call it. What I hope is LeBeau silences the critics. But, IMO this is his last chance to do so. If the D that showed up against the Ravens shows its ugly head and the D we seen against Carolina is a mirage...LeBeau as beloved as he is will hopefully step down peacefully.

Be more specific. What is the benchmark to judge LeBeau did a good job this season? Where does the defense need to be? Top 15 scoring? top 10? the "eye test"? If you are the HC, what is your metric to judge DL's performance?

[birtikidis]

All the while starting rookies and second year players....

And they'd all be TE's

[Shawn]

Be more specific. What is the benchmark to judge LeBeau did a good job this season? Where does the defense need to be? Top 15 scoring? top 10? the "eye test"? If you are the HC, what is your metric to judge DL's performance?

I think it will be obvious. The eye test...are we seeing the trend going up. Is this D putting the team in positions to win? I could care less about the stats. Not saying they are completely unimportant but I won't be checking them.

[Captain Lemming]

Fair enough. So, if you haven't primed the pump who's issue is that? If its ALL a talent issue, then who's job is it to stock the shelves and develop the talent?

Primarily the GM.
Parcels called it "buying the groceries" which is why he wanted to be GM when he coached.

Why is a slow Troy who hasn't made a real play all year starting over Thomas? If he isn't better than Troy by now I fear for the future.

Because he is all of four games removed from the probowl and was at worst the third best defender on the team last season. It's still September.

Our best DB is an overpaid Allen. Why is he overpaid? Because we have no one else. So, while some of it is indeed talent and transition...the other part of this is why did it get to this point?

I'll tell you why because guys didn't develop like they should...and the talent we did develop left. Is that Tomlins issue or LeBeaus?

We had the leagues number one pass defense in 2012 with late draft pick Ike who was already old and never could catch, 3rd rounder Lewis who grew into a coveted free agent then left and late pick Gay who was such a scrub he could not ride the pine on another team
AND we had little pass rush.

How is it that a lack of player development?

DL has been making pretty good meals out of DIRT at the corner position for years.
Now he has only feces in the pantry, it is AMAZING he can do anything at all with it.

Seriously, how can people expect great defense when this is what he has to work with?

[Shawn]

Come on CL, you know Troy didn't have a Pro Bowl quality year last season. Name recognition and fan votes don't make a good safety. If it's a Colbert issue then lets rid ourselves of him. But, I have a sneaky suspicion that LeBeau's opinion on talent is heavily weighed in him and Tomlin's decisions. And I don't believe Colbert develops said talent.

[Shawn]

BTW: were you trying to be humorous when you said DL was making "good meals out of dirt" in the secondary?