The Good that no one is talking about....

[SidSmythe]

We are halfway thru the season and I want to focus on the GOOD. Yes I want HALEY GONE (that would be the GREAT). I want TOMLIN on the Hot Seat. But I believe at the core of this team we are functional. Like a tree with a good trunk, we have a lot of pruning to do. I say this for 1 reason ...every game this year the Steelers have been in position to WIN late in the game (except maybe the Cincinnati game).

[Notleadpoisoned]

We are halfway thru the season and I want to focus on the GOOD. Yes I want HALEY GONE (that would be the GREAT). I want TOMLIN on the Hot Seat. But I believe at the core of this team we are functional. Like a tree with a good trunk, we have a lot of pruning to do. I say this for 1 reason ...every game this year the Steelers have been in position to WIN late in the game (except maybe the Cincinnati game).

Good teams do find a way to win those kinds of games, unfortunately this season's version of the Steelers do not. So much for the good.

[Oviedo]

I like your tree analogy. Just make sure you also trim the oldest branch from the defensive side.

[Ghost]

I not being smart here - I'm genuinely curious as to who you'd consider the "trunk"? The reason I ask is because watching yesterday (and the Vikings and Raiders games) I saw very few players that look to be the kind of guys who will position this team to be good. 2 out 3 starting D-linemen, and first off the bench, could be let go. Timmons is solid in the middle and we'll see how Jones develops but the rest of the LBs are average. Clark is done at safety. Troy flashes but is he worth the $$? Gay continues to be a plug-in, nothing more. Ike is not playing to his contract numbers. As a unit, the tackling is horrendous.

On the O side, you have a line in shambles. Bell looks to be the real deal but screwed if he goes down. Miller is the only TE on the team worth anything. WR's as a group are mediocre.

If we're using tree analogies; I'd go with the Steelers being the famous tree on the Auburn campus that the crazy Bama fan drove poisonous spikes into the base and we're all waiting to see when the tree dies.

[SteelBucks]

I'd chop that tree down and grow another. (I'm a bitter guy this morning)

[flippy]

I not being smart here - I'm genuinely curious as to who you'd consider the "trunk"?

Clearly Cotchery is the trunk And I'm not trying to be smart either. He's just the only guy that seemed to show up to play yesterday.

[SteelBucks]

Clearly Cotchery is the trunk And I'm not trying to be smart either. He's just the only guy that seemed to show up to play yesterday.

At the end of the season, the players vote for team MVP. Sadly, at the halfway point, Cotch is the runaway favorite.

[Shawn]

What I find interesting is the Steelers put up 30+ points, and Haley is the problem? How about looking at the pink elephant in the room. LeBeau's D gave up 55 points. The writing has been on the wall for some years now, and it's time to make a change. Give him a scouting job or something...but get some intelligent go getter defensive minded coordinator.

And while I'm not ready to give Haley a pass on how poorly the O has played at times this season. I will say this...the O has looked better...has been putting up points. The O, despite all the injuries along the OL has outplayed the D. Lets just be honest...fans just don't like Haley. They don't want him in the Burgh...don't feel like he belongs. They point out that players and coaches don't like him.

Sounds like another coach...Bellichick. Have you ever heard of anyone who likes him? Including his own players?

[focosteeler]

What I find interesting is the Steelers put up 30+ points, and Haley is the problem? How about looking at the pink elephant in the room. LeBeau's D gave up 55 points. The writing has been on the wall for some years now, and it's time to make a change. Give him a scouting job or something...but get some intelligent go getter defensive minded coordinator.

And while I'm not ready to give Haley a pass on how poorly the O has played at times this season. I will say this...the O has looked better...has been putting up points. The O, despite all the injuries along the OL has outplayed the D. Lets just be honest...fans just don't like Haley. They don't want him in the Burgh...don't feel like he belongs. They point out that players and coaches don't like him.

Sounds like another coach...Bellichick. Have you ever heard of anyone who likes him? Including his own players?

After Ben threw his first TD last night he and Haley looked like they were getting along pretty well over on the sideline. Haley came in with the reputation of being an a$$ and not getting along with players. I haven't seen it yet.

[flippy]

What I find interesting is the Steelers put up 30+ points, and Haley is the problem? How about looking at the pink elephant in the room. LeBeau's D gave up 55 points. The writing has been on the wall for some years now, and it's time to make a change. Give him a scouting job or something...but get some intelligent go getter defensive minded coordinator.

And while I'm not ready to give Haley a pass on how poorly the O has played at times this season. I will say this...the O has looked better...has been putting up points. The O, despite all the injuries along the OL has outplayed the D. Lets just be honest...fans just don't like Haley. They don't want him in the Burgh...don't feel like he belongs. They point out that players and coaches don't like him.

Sounds like another coach...Bellichick. Have you ever heard of anyone who likes him? Including his own players?

We're 25th in scoring O with 19 ppg. We're 23rd in D giving up 26 ppg. Both units suck. Why does one have to take the blame and not the other?

We essentially need a top 5 D to hold opponents to less than our O scores. We'd only need a top 10 O to score more than our D gives up. Everything is a mess and it's one great big negative feedback loop. Ben turns the ball over like crazy which hurts the D. And the D doesn't get any turnovers making it harder on the O.

And we've become overly down on 2 of the best players in the history of the game who are struggling in this mess in Ben and Troy. Ben's pressing always playing from behind and taking chances he shouldn't. Troy is guessing like a madman trying to make something happen on his side. And their play is amplifying everything bad about this team.

Sometimes a turd is just a turd. I don't think we need to make excuses to justify bad play all around. It's ok to say Ben sucks. It's ok to say Troy sucks. It's ok to say Haley sucks. It's ok to say Lebeau sucks. Everything sucks - lol.

[feltdizz]

What I find interesting is the Steelers put up 30+ points, and Haley is the problem? How about looking at the pink elephant in the room. LeBeau's D gave up 55 points. The writing has been on the wall for some years now, and it's time to make a change. Give him a scouting job or something...but get some intelligent go getter defensive minded coordinator.

And while I'm not ready to give Haley a pass on how poorly the O has played at times this season. I will say this...the O has looked better...has been putting up points. The O, despite all the injuries along the OL has outplayed the D. Lets just be honest...fans just don't like Haley. They don't want him in the Burgh...don't feel like he belongs. They point out that players and coaches don't like him.

Sounds like another coach...Bellichick. Have you ever heard of anyone who likes him? Including his own players?

I'll admit, I jumped on a plane in Pittsburgh with the score 27 to 24 and when the plane touched down they had 55.

WTF? This D is bad... really bad. The O isn't much better but hell.... it is better than the D. We put too much money into too many aging vets. Clark is done, Troy looks to be done (given the money) and so does Ike (given the money).

[feltdizz]

We're 25th in scoring O with 19 ppg. We're 23rd in D giving up 26 ppg. Both units suck. Why does one have to take the blame and not the other?

We essentially need a top 5 D to hold opponents to less than our O scores. We'd only need a top 10 O to score more than our D gives up. Everything is a mess and it's one great big negative feedback loop. Ben turns the ball over like crazy which hurts the D. And the D doesn't get any turnovers making it harder on the O.

And we've become overly down on 2 of the best players in the history of the game who are struggling in this mess in Ben and Troy. Ben's pressing always playing from behind and taking chances he shouldn't. Troy is guessing like a madman trying to make something happen on his side. And their play is amplifying everything bad about this team.

Sometimes a turd is just a turd. I don't think we need to make excuses to justify bad play all around. It's ok to say Ben sucks. It's ok to say Troy sucks. It's ok to say Haley sucks. It's ok to say Lebeau sucks. Everything sucks - lol.

*golf claps to all of this*

too many times we pick sides on this forum. Everything stinks right now... but you know what? It's OK. We RARELY have down years like this but they are bound to happen.

Honestly... what was more likely to happen given our run since 2005, a 4th SB appearance or a losing season?

[Shawn]

Flippy, I know you can see what I see...which is an O that can't control the LOS, protect Ben, or get a push in the running game. Tell me how much of that is Haley's fault? Some? All? None? Who knows. But, I tell you something...if the Steelers have a good OL, many things will fall into place including Ben having time to make better decisions...the long ball being set up by a strong running game...and even the D will benefit from breather time.

Sorry, I'm just not willing to blame all this on Haley who IMO is the least of the Steelers worries. Get a franchise LT, move Pouncey or Velasco to Guard...and let Adams, Gilbert and Beachum fight it out for the RT spot. That will cure much of your woes, and make Haley look like a genius.

[feltdizz]

Flippy, I know you can see what I see...which is an O that can't control the LOS, protect Ben, or get a push in the running game. Tell me how much of that is Haley's fault? Some? All? None? Who knows. But, I tell you something...if the Steelers have a good OL, many things will fall into place including Ben having time to make better decisions...the long ball being set up by a strong running game...and even the D will benefit from breather time.

Sorry, I'm just not willing to blame all this on Haley who IMO is the least of the Steelers worries. Get a franchise LT, move Pouncey or Velasco to Guard...and let Adams, Gilbert and Beachum fight it out for the RT spot. That will cure much of your woes, and make Haley look like a genius.

I'm not going to blame Haley but if the players aren't responding to him he needs to go. OC's come and go all the time.

IMO though the OL coach and OL scouts should be banned from the facility. Something is seriously wrong with this unit.

[steeler_fan_in_t.o.]

After Ben threw his first TD last night he and Haley looked like they were getting along pretty well over on the sideline. Haley came in with the reputation of being an a$$ and not getting along with players. I haven't seen it yet.

Yes, but he also came in with the reputation of being an innovative offensive mind and I haven't seen that yet either.