Steelers could opt for nose tackle

[JUST-PLAIN-NASTY]

Re: Steelers could opt for nose tackle

Poe was very impressive in his workout today..however I stand by what I say. He is better suited in a 4-3 or as a 3-4 DE, not as a 3-4 NT. Mayock, Davis, and Warren Sapp all said the same thing this morning. The comparison's to Ngata are deserved, but like Ngata, Baltimore moved him out at NT to a more natural position.

That's funny...I'm listening to Mayock right now and he said the opposite. I have been listening since they started and Sapp & Davis both said with his 32" inch arms and his upper & lower body strength he plays inside on the nose or 4-3 DT. Haven't heard anyone mention him as best suited for a 5 tech but said his athleticism suggest he could play there. The player they said who will be a 5 tech is Still. I will stand by what I say and say Poe is a NT in the Steelers system. Ngata moved outside when Cody came on and still slides inside on passing downs. From all the highlights I could gather on him he lines up inside and is a space eater. I saw the game against Mississippi State and there is limited on youtube. I would appreciate if you could send me the film you said you watched that gave you the impression he isn't first round talent. Perhaps I will see the same thing you did. Mayock has him ranked as the 3rd best DT and there may be 5 that go in the first.

[JUST-PLAIN-NASTY]

Re: Steelers could opt for nose tackle

Poe is very intriguing. The Steelers need a NT of the future. That is a given and something they've neglected over the past several drafts. I don't know if the combination of Hood + McClendon is the answer at NT.

The thing is ... Poe seems to be within our range. We haven't had a chance to get someone like him at NT because we're never in range. If he's there and we pass him up, then what happens next year when Hampton is either cut or retired?

The Steelers always have an eye on the future and NT is a HUGE part of that.... if you can get a force at NT, you do it.

If Glenn and Poe are available then it gets real tough.

If Glenn is available I would think he would be the pick over Poe. If Poe & Hightower are on the board, I would take Poe over Hightower. If Poe is gone, I would try and trade down and maybe still could get Hightower. Problem for me is if we can't trade down. They better love Hightower or take BPA.

[steelz09]

Re: Steelers could opt for nose tackle

Poe is very intriguing. The Steelers need a NT of the future. That is a given and something they've neglected over the past several drafts. I don't know if the combination of Hood + McClendon is the answer at NT.

The thing is ... Poe seems to be within our range. We haven't had a chance to get someone like him at NT because we're never in range. If he's there and we pass him up, then what happens next year when Hampton is either cut or retired?

The Steelers always have an eye on the future and NT is a HUGE part of that.... if you can get a force at NT, you do it.

If Glenn and Poe are available then it gets real tough.

If Glenn is available I would think he would be the pick over Poe. If Poe & Hightower are on the board, I would take Poe over Hightower. If Poe is gone, I would try and trade down and maybe still could get Hightower. Problem for me is if we can't trade down. They better love Hightower or take BPA.

True. Poe benefits though because IMO i think NT is more difficult to replace than a guard. Glenn is more prove against top tier competition. Add the fact that he could possibly dominate at G and also backup your tackle positions and that adds HUGE value. That is why I think he will be taken in the teens. Just a hunch.

I really like that LB from Boise and South Carolina's Ingram is sick. Hightower may be the most realistic pick though.

[Dee Dub]

Re: Steelers could opt for nose tackle

[quote=JUST-PLAIN-NASTY]

Poe was very impressive in his workout today..however I stand by what I say. He is better suited in a 4-3 or as a 3-4 DE, not as a 3-4 NT. Mayock, Davis, and Warren Sapp all said the same thing this morning. The comparison's to Ngata are deserved, but like Ngata, Baltimore moved him out at NT to a more natural position.

That's funny...I'm listening to Mayock right now and he said the opposite. I have been listening since they started and Sapp & Davis both said with his 32" inch arms and his upper & lower body strength he plays inside on the nose or 4-3 DT. Haven't heard anyone mention him as best suited for a 5 tech but said his athleticism suggest he could play there. The player they said who will be a 5 tech is Still. I will stand by what I say and say Poe is a NT in the Steelers system. Ngata moved outside when Cody came on and still slides inside on passing downs. From all the highlights I could gather on him he lines up inside and is a space eater. I saw the game against Mississippi State and there is limited on youtube. I would appreciate if you could send me the film you said you watched that gave you the impression he isn't first round talent. Perhaps I will see the same thing you did. Mayock has him ranked as the 3rd best DT and there may be 5 that go in the first.[/quote:15gkcydr]

Did you DVR it? Right before his first or second 40 yard dash it was said.

Poe will not play much in year one if Casey returns. And playing NT isnt going to be where he is best. Is that where you want to go with pick 24?

[Oviedo]

Re: Steelers could opt for nose tackle

I think it is far less importnat to get a run stuffer when the league is emphasizing passing and it is far important to shutdown an opponents passing attack than running attack.

We need players who can protect our QB to make our passing attack better or get the opponents QB. Is it really important in today's NFL to be #1 against the run. It's probably become a meaningless statistic compared to #1 against the pass or leading in takeaways. Poe likely won't help us do either of those.

[JUST-PLAIN-NASTY]

Re: Steelers could opt for nose tackle

Did you DVR it? Right before his first or second 40 yard dash it was said.

Poe will not play much in year one if Casey returns. And playing NT isnt going to be where he is best. Is that where you want to go with pick 24?

I have been listening live online since 9:00 am. I have heard Mayock and others refer to Poe as a NT and said he could be the best interior tackle there. Poe's best position is NT and that is where he is being projected by everyone. They were just talking about Poe. They just named him as one of the Day 1 starters and said he will play at NT/DT and the athleticism he displayed at the combine will allow a defense to move him around in packages. The guys said he was a Top 15 pick which I don't believe. If you were watching you know the guy. It isn't Charlie Casserly (I think that is how you spell it) but it was the older guy on that press panel.

Poe himself said in his interview, "I think I can rush the passer a lot more than people think," Poe said. "I am used to playing nose tackle, but I played some three-technique, some five-technique. I'm pretty comfortable anywhere along the defensive line.

"I think I'm pretty explosive. That's probably my biggest strength. Most people think just because I'm big I do nothing but power. But I kind of use my quickness to my advantage."

I would answer yes to you question. Hampton may begin on PUP. Even last year when he was healthy Hampton was a shell of himself. The future at NT needs to be addressed here and now just like ILB. I would spend the 24th on Poe as quickly as I would Glenn or Hightower. Even if Hampton does start the season Poe will be in the rotation. If Hampton starts on PUP...Poe could leap frog McClendon early.

[Dee Dub]

Re: Steelers could opt for nose tackle

I think it is far less importnat to get a run stuffer when the league is emphasizing passing and it is far important to shutdown an opponents passing attack than running attack.

We need players who can protect our QB to make our passing attack better or get the opponents QB. Is it really important in today's NFL to be #1 against the run. It's probably become a meaningless statistic compared to #1 against the pass or leading in takeaways. Poe likely won't help us do either of those.

I think it is far more important to get an immediate starter/impact for a position of need, regardless of what that player does well or doesnt do well.

Hightower is a beast and rare find. He will also add to the pass rush. He can go get the QB from inside and that is thing that has been missing lately because Timmons has had to drop so often.

Sorry Ovi, those guys you want to protect your QB wont be there at 24.

[Oviedo]

Re: Steelers could opt for nose tackle

I think it is far less importnat to get a run stuffer when the league is emphasizing passing and it is far important to shutdown an opponents passing attack than running attack.

We need players who can protect our QB to make our passing attack better or get the opponents QB. Is it really important in today's NFL to be #1 against the run. It's probably become a meaningless statistic compared to #1 against the pass or leading in takeaways. Poe likely won't help us do either of those.

I think it is far more important to get an immediate starter/impact for a position of need, regardless of what that player does well or doesnt do well.

Hightower is a beast and rare find. He will also add to the pass rush. He can go get the QB from inside and that is thing that has been missing lately because Timmons has had to drop so often.

Sorry Ovi, those guys you want to protect your QB wont be there at 24.

I'm all in for Hightower over Poe!!!!! I think Hightower will be a beast combined with Timmons and he may give us the ability to inside blitz more with both Timmons and Hightower. If LeBeau can remember what an inside blitz is

Hopefully Hightower is not forced to watch from the sidelines while "he learns the complex defense" and he learns by doing on the field. Coming from Alabama's defense he is probably the most ready to play pick we could get.

[JUST-PLAIN-NASTY]

Re: Steelers could opt for nose tackle

Dub...The guy is Mike Lombardi and he is on right now. He is the one that thinks Poe is a Top 20 pick.

[JUST-PLAIN-NASTY]

Re: Steelers could opt for nose tackle

Mayock just said Poe's measurables match what he saw on tape. He said if he works hard someone will have an All pro. He said he didn't have the stats but he showed the athleticism on tape. He played on a poor defense and had to beat double teams. What he showed in his measurables doesn't come along often in a DT. He said his split of 1.68 (official) was ranked with the LBs.

[RuthlessBurgher]

Re: Steelers could opt for nose tackle

Poe is very intriguing. The Steelers need a NT of the future. That is a given and something they've neglected over the past several drafts. I don't know if the combination of Hood + McClendon is the answer at NT.

The thing is ... Poe seems to be within our range. We haven't had a chance to get someone like him at NT because we're never in range. If he's there and we pass him up, then what happens next year when Hampton is either cut or retired?

The Steelers always have an eye on the future and NT is a HUGE part of that.... if you can get a force at NT, you do it.

If Glenn and Poe are available then it gets real tough.

If Glenn is available I would think he would be the pick over Poe. If Poe & Hightower are on the board, I would take Poe over Hightower. If Poe is gone, I would try and trade down and maybe still could get Hightower. Problem for me is if we can't trade down. They better love Hightower or take BPA.

I've been advocating trading up for DeCastro (and still do), but if that is not possible, then I'd rank 'em 1. Glenn 2. Poe 3. Hightower.

[Dee Dub]

Re: Steelers could opt for nose tackle

Mayock just said Poe's measurables match what he saw on tape. He said if he works hard someone will have an All pro. He said he didn't have the stats but he showed the athleticism on tape. He played on a poor defense and had to beat double teams. What he showed in his measurables doesn't come along often in a DT. He said his split of 1.68 (official) was ranked with the LBs.

I dont disagree with any of this. He is a beast no doubt. I think he is better suited as a 4-3 DT or a 3-4 DE. I just dont think he is the ideal NT in a 3-4. And as far as what you said about Lombardi came from a team who ran a 4-3. He didnt draft 3-4 NT's when he was working for the Raiders.

[RuthlessBurgher]

Re: Steelers could opt for nose tackle

[quote=Dee Dub]

Mayock just said Poe's measurables match what he saw on tape. He said if he works hard someone will have an All pro. He said he didn't have the stats but he showed the athleticism on tape. He played on a poor defense and had to beat double teams. What he showed in his measurables doesn't come along often in a DT. He said his split of 1.68 (official) was ranked with the LBs.

I dont disagree with any of this. He is a beast no doubt. I think he is better suited as a 4-3 DT or a 3-4 DE. I just dont think he is the ideal NT in a 3-4. And as far as what you said about Lombardi came from a team who ran a 4-3. He didnt draft 3-4 NT's when he was working for the Raiders.[/quote:2jxdjyaa]

Poe and Ta'Amu weigh the same (within 2 lbs of one another...346 vs. 34, have arms that are the same length (32"), and Poe is only 1 inch taller than Ta'Amu (6'4" vs. 6'3"). Yet, Ta'Amu is a prototypical NT and Poe is better suited as a 4-3 DT or 3-4 DE? Not all NT's are 6'1" like Casey Hampton...Ted Washington was 6'5".

[JUST-PLAIN-NASTY]

Re: Steelers could opt for nose tackle

[quote=Dee Dub]

Mayock just said Poe's measurables match what he saw on tape. He said if he works hard someone will have an All pro. He said he didn't have the stats but he showed the athleticism on tape. He played on a poor defense and had to beat double teams. What he showed in his measurables doesn't come along often in a DT. He said his split of 1.68 (official) was ranked with the LBs.

I dont disagree with any of this. He is a beast no doubt. I think he is better suited as a 4-3 DT or a 3-4 DE. I just dont think he is the ideal NT in a 3-4. And as far as what you said about Lombardi came from a team who ran a 4-3. He didnt draft 3-4 NT's when he was working for the Raiders.[/quote:1a95pmsh]

You can have your opinion. I have mine about Hightower at #24 and would hope they trade back to get him if it comes down to it. Being that there is only about 22-24 1st round prospects, Hightower ILB slots as a 2nd rounder because I believe now only Kuechly is the only true 1st round talent. So they should fall back and pick up a pick and still get him...If they can.

I didn't hear anyone like you stated sharing your opinion like you stated. I watched all of Poe's workouts since group 8 came on camera 2 at 11:00 am online and nobody ever said Poe would make a better 3-4 DE. Many stated he could be the best DT in this draft and is the best NT. I saw all his workouts including his position drills and the kid will be a dimension the Steelers haven't had with Hampton. He very well could stay on the field in the middle of sub packages but more improtantly be able to push the pocket deep and give a pass rush that will benefit the OLBs in play action not allowing the QBs to step up. He will occupy 2 OL and keep the ILBs clean.

I don't know where Lombardi worked has to do with his evaluation of a player in a draft. I'm sure they don't pay him to report what he would do if he was still working for the Raiders. But like he said, the value of a DT versus an ILB isn't close. He even said a team may pass on Kuechly to take Poe because the value at DT when a prospect like him is there has to come first even if you need an ILB and they grade out together. It is true...When you have elite talent at the DT/NT, pass rusher (DE/OLB), or CB it is valued more than ILB, 3-4 DE, & S. Of course matter of opinion as to who is elite but we get to see who the decision makers will tab "elite" come draft time.

[Dee Dub]

Re: Steelers could opt for nose tackle

[quote=JUST-PLAIN-NASTY][quote="Dee Dub":15iuwb3u]

Mayock just said Poe's measurables match what he saw on tape. He said if he works hard someone will have an All pro. He said he didn't have the stats but he showed the athleticism on tape. He played on a poor defense and had to beat double teams. What he showed in his measurables doesn't come along often in a DT. He said his split of 1.68 (official) was ranked with the LBs.

I dont disagree with any of this. He is a beast no doubt. I think he is better suited as a 4-3 DT or a 3-4 DE. I just dont think he is the ideal NT in a 3-4. And as far as what you said about Lombardi came from a team who ran a 4-3. He didnt draft 3-4 NT's when he was working for the Raiders.[/quote:15iuwb3u]

You can have your opinion. I have mine about Hightower at #24 and would hope they trade back to get him if it comes down to it. Being that there is only about 22-24 1st round prospects, Hightower ILB slots as a 2nd rounder because I believe now only Kuechly is the only true 1st round talent. So they should fall back and pick up a pick and still get him...If they can.

I didn't hear anyone like you stated sharing your opinion like you stated. I watched all of Poe's workouts since group 8 came on camera 2 at 11:00 am online and nobody ever said Poe would make a better 3-4 DE. Many stated he could be the best DT in this draft and is the best NT. I saw all his workouts including his position drills and the kid will be a dimension the Steelers haven't had with Hampton. He very well could stay on the field in the middle of sub packages but more improtantly be able to push the pocket deep and give a pass rush that will benefit the OLBs in play action not allowing the QBs to step up. He will occupy 2 OL and keep the ILBs clean.

I don't know where Lombardi worked has to do with his evaluation of a player in a draft. I'm sure they don't pay him to report what he would do if he was still working for the Raiders. But like he said, the value of a DT versus an ILB isn't close. He even said a team may pass on Kuechly to take Poe because the value at DT when a prospect like him is there has to come first even if you need an ILB and they grade out together. It is true...When you have elite talent at the DT/NT, pass rusher (DE/OLB), or CB it is valued more than ILB, 3-4 DE, & S. Of course matter of opinion as to who is elite but we get to see who the decision makers will tab "elite" come draft time.[/quote:15iuwb3u]


Agreed about trading back for Hightower. I would love that too, problem is I dont think he gets past Baltimore. So because of that I'd grab him at 24.

You are right about what was said about Poe. What was actually said (by Charles Davis), is that Ta'Amu is a zero, two gap player (NT in a 3-4). And Mayock agreed. Then they both said Poe could play all over the place. I just replayed it. Sorry about that.

But I stand by what I say. I think Ta'Amu and Brandon Thompson are better suited at NT than Poe. Poe, like Ngata, will be better at DE in a 3-4.