Damn, its a great time to need an ILB in the draft

[Dresden]

Re: Damn, its a great time to need an ILB in the draft

[quote=steelerkeylargo]

David from Nebraska is a stud...

Yep!! And that type of cover ability is rare.

I absolutely love David....however.....I don't think he is big enough to play in a 3-4.

I think he could. If he adds 10 lbs he right about the same size as Larry Foote.

Where David would excel in coverage I believe he would be a liability in the run game. He needs to play in space where he can use his athleticism.[/quote:1cyo3go1]


It was also said that Ray Lewis was undersized coming out of college. But that's not even the point.
Dude,... Tomlin drafts MARGINALLY talented/collegiately productive undersized backers just to waste picks for sh#ts and giggles,... and the David kid is actually a stud. He's TRULY talented, productive and plays with an intensity and football awareness that's superior to Timmons NOW. He could easily put on 10-15 lbs.

I would love to see him in a Steeler Uniform. And while were at it (dreaming of great draft selections that will never happen),...picture Kenny Tate of Maryland playing in place of Ryan Clark ?

[NJ-STEELER]

Re: Damn, its a great time to need an ILB in the draft

I hope some of you guys clamoring to add an ILB to what is a unit already near the top of the league aren't the same ones that are here Monday morning wondering why our offense struggles so much

Historically. Inside LB In the 3-4 can be filled later in the draft. Especially considering the surrounding players the position of need will be playing with.

With Timmons, wood, and debo. We might get away playing a message boarder next to them. Kind of like olsavsky back in the 90s

[focosteeler]

Re: Damn, its a great time to need an ILB in the draft

I am curious to see what Sly can do when given real opportunities. I know he has gotten some playing time but I still dont think we have gotten to see the real Sly

[StarSpangledSteeler]

Re: Damn, its a great time to need an ILB in the draft

I hope some of you guys clamoring to add an ILB to what is a unit already near the top of the league aren't the same ones that are here Monday morning wondering why our offense struggles so much

Historically. Inside LB In the 3-4 can be filled later in the draft. Especially considering the surrounding players the position of need will be playing with.

With Timmons, wood, and debo. We might get away playing a message boarder next to them. Kind of like olsavsky back in the 90s

I like where you're going with this one, but let me help clarify...

Steelers offense is scoring 21.2 points per game (ranked 18th in NFL).

Packers offense is scoring 34.7 points per game (ranked 1st in NFL).

Steelers defense is holding opponents to 17.1 points per game (ranked 4th in NFL).

San Francisco defense is holding opponents to 14.6 points per game (ranked 1st in NFL).

If we draft a star ILB, and a star NT, and a star FS, what kind of results are all you guys projecting?... Are we going to hold opponents to under 14 points? That's only 3 points better than our current roster. That's not a very good return on investment. That's spending our draft picks "emotionally" instead of "rationally".

Now if we draft a top OT, and two top OG's, what kind of results would you project?... Easily 7 more points per game and I'll tell you why... Ben would have more time to throw, and get sacked less, and would stay healthy longer. We'd be able to run the ball better because our "horses" up front would be blowing open running lanes instead of getting pushed backwards 2 yards. In the red zone we'd actually be able to score TD's (instead of FG's) by simply running the ball, and if teams responded by stacking the box, it would leave our WR weapons in single coverage. But most of all, we'd be able to sustain drives better, and control time of possession better, keeping our defense off the field, which would reduce our points allowed even further WITHOUT EVEN DRAFTING DEFENSE.

Perhaps the most logical reason to draft OL is because the NFL is turning into a passing league. It is rewarding high powered offenses and punishing great defenses. We need to follow the trend instead of fighting against it.

OFFENSE! OFFENSE! OFFENSE!

[steelerkeylargo]

Re: Damn, its a great time to need an ILB in the draft

Where David would excel in coverage I believe he would be a liability in the run game. He needs to play in space where he can use his athleticism.[/quote]


It was also said that Ray Lewis was undersized coming out of college. But that's not even the point.
Dude,... Tomlin drafts MARGINALLY talented/collegiately productive undersized backers just to waste picks for sh#ts and giggles,... and the David kid is actually a stud. He's TRULY talented, productive and plays with an intensity and football awareness that's superior to Timmons NOW. He could easily put on 10-15 lbs.

I would love to see him in a Steeler Uniform. And while were at it (dreaming of great draft selections that will never happen),...picture Kenny Tate of Maryland playing in place of Ryan Clark ? [/quote][/quote]


Wrong!! The Steelers (Tomlin and Cowher) draft undersized DE's to play LB. Not undersized LB'ers that are borderline Safety size. I love Lavonte David as a player but he does not fit our system. He will be a Thomas Davis (hopefully without the injuries) type player at the next level.

[JUST-PLAIN-NASTY]

Re: Damn, its a great time to need an ILB in the draft

I hope some of you guys clamoring to add an ILB to what is a unit already near the top of the league aren't the same ones that are here Monday morning wondering why our offense struggles so much

Historically. Inside LB In the 3-4 can be filled later in the draft. Especially considering the surrounding players the position of need will be playing with.

With Timmons, wood, and debo. We might get away playing a message boarder next to them. Kind of like olsavsky back in the 90s

I like where you're going with this one, but let me help clarify...

Steelers offense is scoring 21.2 points per game (ranked 18th in NFL).

Packers offense is scoring 34.7 points per game (ranked 1st in NFL).

Steelers defense is holding opponents to 17.1 points per game (ranked 4th in NFL).

San Francisco defense is holding opponents to 14.6 points per game (ranked 1st in NFL).

If we draft a star ILB, and a star NT, and a star FS, what kind of results are all you guys projecting?... Are we going to hold opponents to under 14 points? That's only 3 points better than our current roster. That's not a very good return on investment. That's spending our draft picks "emotionally" instead of "rationally".

Now if we draft a top OT, and two top OG's, what kind of results would you project?... Easily 7 more points per game and I'll tell you why... Ben would have more time to throw, and get sacked less, and would stay healthy longer. We'd be able to run the ball better because our "horses" up front would be blowing open running lanes instead of getting pushed backwards 2 yards. In the red zone we'd actually be able to score TD's (instead of FG's) by simply running the ball, and if teams responded by stacking the box, it would leave our WR weapons in single coverage. But most of all, we'd be able to sustain drives better, and control time of possession better, keeping our defense off the field, which would reduce our points allowed even further WITHOUT EVEN DRAFTING DEFENSE.

Perhaps the most logical reason to draft OL is because the NFL is turning into a passing league. It is rewarding high powered offenses and punishing great defenses. We need to follow the trend instead of fighting against it.

OFFENSE! OFFENSE! OFFENSE!

Philosophy and reality are far apart. Sound philosophy but can't be realized. Steelers won't have a shot at a Top OT and more than likely a Top OG. The Steelers are smart enough in their drafting to look at need and if it can't be filled to take BPA. OG need when they are on the clock...Nobody graded there. NT or ILB when they are on the clock....Very good possibility. To select a position and try to associate it with the stats is really a non factor. Taking the 5th or 6th best OT or 3rd OG may not have any impact. Taking a 1st or 2nd rated player at NT or ILB could.

Right now...The only OL I am interested in is DeCastro in the 1st. Based on need and where he grades out...But he is rising fast....DeCastro could be long gone. The only other OG on the radar for me is Cordy Glenn and he has some work to do before I throw his name in the hat. The top OTs will be gone and the drop off is huge. If you have been a Steelers fan for awhile...You know dam well what the answer is in this scenario. The will look to the other side of the ball and look to fill the need at OG in 2-3. If there is nobody on defense graded out at need still on the board...BPA.

[SuperSize]

Re: Damn, its a great time to need an ILB in the draft

No comments on the kid from BC, Kuechly?

Just wondering, he's a local kid from here in Cincinnati and the local rag had a big piece on him 2-3 weeks ago. I've never seen him play, but he's listed ~240, and he leads the nation in tackles.


Pete

[PSU_dropout43]

Re: Damn, its a great time to need an ILB in the draft

My late round gem is Danny Trevathan kentucky.

[Dee Dub]

Re: Damn, its a great time to need an ILB in the draft

[quote=JUST-PLAIN-NASTY]

I hope some of you guys clamoring to add an ILB to what is a unit already near the top of the league aren't the same ones that are here Monday morning wondering why our offense struggles so much

Historically. Inside LB In the 3-4 can be filled later in the draft. Especially considering the surrounding players the position of need will be playing with.

With Timmons, wood, and debo. We might get away playing a message boarder next to them. Kind of like olsavsky back in the 90s

I like where you're going with this one, but let me help clarify...

Steelers offense is scoring 21.2 points per game (ranked 18th in NFL).

Packers offense is scoring 34.7 points per game (ranked 1st in NFL).

Steelers defense is holding opponents to 17.1 points per game (ranked 4th in NFL).

San Francisco defense is holding opponents to 14.6 points per game (ranked 1st in NFL).

If we draft a star ILB, and a star NT, and a star FS, what kind of results are all you guys projecting?... Are we going to hold opponents to under 14 points? That's only 3 points better than our current roster. That's not a very good return on investment. That's spending our draft picks "emotionally" instead of "rationally".

Now if we draft a top OT, and two top OG's, what kind of results would you project?... Easily 7 more points per game and I'll tell you why... Ben would have more time to throw, and get sacked less, and would stay healthy longer. We'd be able to run the ball better because our "horses" up front would be blowing open running lanes instead of getting pushed backwards 2 yards. In the red zone we'd actually be able to score TD's (instead of FG's) by simply running the ball, and if teams responded by stacking the box, it would leave our WR weapons in single coverage. But most of all, we'd be able to sustain drives better, and control time of possession better, keeping our defense off the field, which would reduce our points allowed even further WITHOUT EVEN DRAFTING DEFENSE.

Perhaps the most logical reason to draft OL is because the NFL is turning into a passing league. It is rewarding high powered offenses and punishing great defenses. We need to follow the trend instead of fighting against it.

OFFENSE! OFFENSE! OFFENSE!

Philosophy and reality are far apart. Sound philosophy but can't be realized. Steelers won't have a shot at a Top OT and more than likely a Top OG. The Steelers are smart enough in their drafting to look at need and if it can't be filled to take BPA. OG need when they are on the clock...Nobody graded there. NT or ILB when they are on the clock....Very good possibility. To select a position and try to associate it with the stats is really a non factor. Taking the 5th or 6th best OT or 3rd OG may not have any impact. Taking a 1st or 2nd rated player at NT or ILB could.

Right now...The only OL I am interested in is DeCastro in the 1st. Based on need and where he grades out...But he is rising fast....DeCastro could be long gone. The only other OG on the radar for me is Cordy Glenn and he has some work to do before I throw his name in the hat. The top OTs will be gone and the drop off is huge. If you have been a Steelers fan for awhile...You know dam well what the answer is in this scenario. The will look to the other side of the ball and look to fill the need at OG in 2-3. If there is nobody on defense graded out at need still on the board...BPA.[/quote:3m6jsxji]


Excellent post!! I couldnt agree more. JPN...better watch out some team may be a callin'. .

[Dee Dub]

Re: Damn, its a great time to need an ILB in the draft

I hope some of you guys clamoring to add an ILB to what is a unit already near the top of the league aren't the same ones that are here Monday morning wondering why our offense struggles so much

Historically. Inside LB In the 3-4 can be filled later in the draft. Especially considering the surrounding players the position of need will be playing with.

With Timmons, wood, and debo. We might get away playing a message boarder next to them. Kind of like olsavsky back in the 90s

For the record, I for one am not "clamoring" to add an ILB as you put it. But I do recognioze that with Farrior's age and his game having started to go down hill, it is a position of need for this team. And if a solid ILB fell to the Steelers I'd be ok with it.

I'm with JPN. I really want DeCastro. And I think Glenn would suffice too. Think about who they will go up against 2 and maybe 3 times a year......Hiloti Ngata.

[BigRob]

Re: Damn, its a great time to need an ILB in the draft

Oh, I'm not saying they should or would draft an ILB in the first two rounds. I just said its a great draft for MLB's.

That means there is a good chance that BPA in rounds 1,2,3 may be a MLB. We have an aging defense. We have won as many games as we have because we have a super defense every year.

We win Super Bowls because we have a wonderful QB. But the backbone of this team is defense. It is aging, and aging particularly at MLB, DL, and Safety.

[steelz09]

Re: Damn, its a great time to need an ILB in the draft

[quote=Shawn][quote=steelerkeylargo]

Where David would excel in coverage I believe he would be a liability in the run game. He needs to play in space where he can use his athleticism.

And I think that is where your concern becomes very valid. Personally, I think the Steelers will want to team up a traditional run stuffing type with Timmons.

I completely agree Shawn. We need a true, instinctive ILB especially for the run defense. Farrior is that guy but his days are numbered. I'd like to see a guy w/ some size that has experience in a 3-4. Just say no to "tweeners", or "hybrid" type players. I want a player that already has experience at ILB and preferably in a 3-4. I'd seriously look at Alabama players.

[StarSpangledSteeler]

Re: Damn, its a great time to need an ILB in the draft

[quote=JUST-PLAIN-NASTY]

I hope some of you guys clamoring to add an ILB to what is a unit already near the top of the league aren't the same ones that are here Monday morning wondering why our offense struggles so much

Historically. Inside LB In the 3-4 can be filled later in the draft. Especially considering the surrounding players the position of need will be playing with.

With Timmons, wood, and debo. We might get away playing a message boarder next to them. Kind of like olsavsky back in the 90s

I like where you're going with this one, but let me help clarify...

Steelers offense is scoring 21.2 points per game (ranked 18th in NFL).

Packers offense is scoring 34.7 points per game (ranked 1st in NFL).

Steelers defense is holding opponents to 17.1 points per game (ranked 4th in NFL).

San Francisco defense is holding opponents to 14.6 points per game (ranked 1st in NFL).

If we draft a star ILB, and a star NT, and a star FS, what kind of results are all you guys projecting?... Are we going to hold opponents to under 14 points? That's only 3 points better than our current roster. That's not a very good return on investment. That's spending our draft picks "emotionally" instead of "rationally".

Now if we draft a top OT, and two top OG's, what kind of results would you project?... Easily 7 more points per game and I'll tell you why... Ben would have more time to throw, and get sacked less, and would stay healthy longer. We'd be able to run the ball better because our "horses" up front would be blowing open running lanes instead of getting pushed backwards 2 yards. In the red zone we'd actually be able to score TD's (instead of FG's) by simply running the ball, and if teams responded by stacking the box, it would leave our WR weapons in single coverage. But most of all, we'd be able to sustain drives better, and control time of possession better, keeping our defense off the field, which would reduce our points allowed even further WITHOUT EVEN DRAFTING DEFENSE.

Perhaps the most logical reason to draft OL is because the NFL is turning into a passing league. It is rewarding high powered offenses and punishing great defenses. We need to follow the trend instead of fighting against it.

OFFENSE! OFFENSE! OFFENSE!

Philosophy and reality are far apart. Sound philosophy but can't be realized. Steelers won't have a shot at a Top OT and more than likely a Top OG. The Steelers are smart enough in their drafting to look at need and if it can't be filled to take BPA. OG need when they are on the clock...Nobody graded there. NT or ILB when they are on the clock....Very good possibility. To select a position and try to associate it with the stats is really a non factor. Taking the 5th or 6th best OT or 3rd OG may not have any impact. Taking a 1st or 2nd rated player at NT or ILB could.

Right now...The only OL I am interested in is DeCastro in the 1st. Based on need and where he grades out...But he is rising fast....DeCastro could be long gone. The only other OG on the radar for me is Cordy Glenn and he has some work to do before I throw his name in the hat. The top OTs will be gone and the drop off is huge. If you have been a Steelers fan for awhile...You know dam well what the answer is in this scenario. The will look to the other side of the ball and look to fill the need at OG in 2-3. If there is nobody on defense graded out at need still on the board...BPA.[/quote:29c6040k]

Love your avatar. Completely disagree with your post. You tend to make generalized statements based on your "opinion" and then try to turn them into "facts" by wording them strongly. (The tough guy poster approach.) Let me state a couple of facts:

The Steeler have drafted: Rienstra, Ricketts, Faneca, and Simmons (all guards) in the first round. That is a "fact". Whether they will do it this year or not remains to be seen, but don't tell me they won't do it just because "you" don't see value at the OG position. That is your "opinion". They have drafted an OG in the first round before and could do it again.

When you say "The Steelers won't have a shot at a top OT..." or "The top OT's will be long gone..." you are stating your "opinion". History does not support that statement. In 2011 Steelers could've selected Sherrod at 1.31. At many points during the season he was rated as a top 10 pick. In 2010 the Steelers could've selected Bulaga at 1.18. At many points during the season he was rated as a top 10 pick. Also in 2010 the Steelers could've selected Rodger Saffold at 1.18 (who has turned out to be a solid starter at LT). In 2006 the Steelers could've selected Marcus McNeil at 1.25 (who became a multi year pro-bowler). It doesn't unfold that way every year but it does happen. These are "facts".

The "fact" is we currently have the 4th rated defense in points allowed (17.1). The "fact" is we currently have the 19th rated offense in points scored (21.2). As of right now, there is more room for improvement on the offensive side than the defensive side. That is a "fact". When you say... "If you have been a Steelers fan for awhile...You know dam well what the answer is in this scenario. The will look to the other side of the ball and look to fill the need at OG in 2-3..." that is your "opinion". The "fact" is over the last 20 years the Steelers have alternated 1st round picks between offense (in even years) and defense (in odd years) in every single year with only three exceptions (1995, 1999, 2005). In each case they drafted OFFENSE (WR, WR, TE). They have not doubled up on defense in back to back years in the last 20 years. Now, does that mean they must draft offense? No. But to say you know dam well they will look to the other side of the ball is not consistent with the Steelers pattern of drafting in any way.

I understand everyone has a different opinion. That's what this board is for. But when you state your opinion like a tough guy and the facts prove the opposite it makes you look uneducated or at least makes your argument not well thought out. (Just my opinion.)

[BigRob]

Re: Damn, its a great time to need an ILB in the draft

The fact is that we are not performing as well on the defensive side of the ball as in years past. I think this is in part due to the age of the defense.

Our stalwarts are aging. We have an oooold defense with frew youngry's ready to step in at NT, S, and LB. I do not believe in Stevenson as starter material.

We need to get younger at NT, ILB, and Safety. I do agree we need an o-line upgrade as well.

I would like the Rounds 1-3 focused on some combination of NT, OL, S, ILB.

[Dee Dub]

Re: Damn, its a great time to need an ILB in the draft

[quote=jhansle1][quote=Shawn]

Where David would excel in coverage I believe he would be a liability in the run game. He needs to play in space where he can use his athleticism.

And I think that is where your concern becomes very valid. Personally, I think the Steelers will want to team up a traditional run stuffing type with Timmons.

I completely agree Shawn. We need a true, instinctive ILB especially for the run defense. Farrior is that guy but his days are numbered. I'd like to see a guy w/ some size that has experience in a 3-4. Just say no to "tweeners", or "hybrid" type players. I want a player that already has experience at ILB and preferably in a 3-4. I'd seriously look at Alabama players.

I would prefer the prototypical ILB for our 3-4 as well, however, if a lesser graded player is there and Lavonte David is there, I'd prefer David. Again, he is listed as only 10 pounds lighter Larry Foote.

I would hardly say James Farrior is a true instinctive ILB for the run. In his primve he held his own, but his strength has always been that he is a well rounded ILB. He had a ton of versatility in his prime. And Lavonte David is every bit that.