Would we have a better Defense if...

[Lebsteel]

We traded down, picked up another 2nd round pick, drafted 6'2" 265 lb. Brandon Graham in Rd. 1, played him at OLB and moved James Harrison to ILB?

[Steel Life]

Re: Would we have a better Defense if...

I'm assuming you're keeping Timmons inside at Farrior's spot? There's a logic to what you're suggesting & I think that Harrison is unselfish enough to do it. Would you consider the same option for others like Worilds or Hughes?

[hawaiiansteel]

Re: Would we have a better Defense if...

We traded down, picked up another 2nd round pick, drafted 6'2" 265 lb. Brandon Graham in Rd. 1, played him at OLB and moved James Harrison to ILB?

great idea, Brandon Graham may very well be the best pass rusher in the draft. with Willie Gay back there defending, you need to get to the QB quick.

i'm not sure if Harrison can play ILB or not, but he's getting older and can't play forever. Groom Graham as Harrison's replacement now, we all know how long it takes to learn Saint LeBeau's defense.

[NJ-STEELER]

Re: Would we have a better Defense if...

didn't jimmy play ILB in his first few camps here

[Oviedo]

Re: Would we have a better Defense if...

We traded down, picked up another 2nd round pick, drafted 6'2" 265 lb. Brandon Graham in Rd. 1, played him at OLB and moved James Harrison to ILB?

I'd have no problem with Brandon Graham in Round 1. Who knows, he could develop into a better pass rusher than Harrison.

I have actually proposed Harrison and Timmons inside together before. The wear and tear will eventually beat up Harrison on the outside because he is a pure bull rusher and bangs with guys who outweigh him by 50+ pounds every play. We started seeing him get dinged last year. But he is a rock who I think would be an awesome run stopper in the middle.

[papillon]

Re: Would we have a better Defense if...

We traded down, picked up another 2nd round pick, drafted 6'2" 265 lb. Brandon Graham in Rd. 1, played him at OLB and moved James Harrison to ILB?

I'd rather an ILB with Harrison inside and move Timmons to his natural position as an OLB. He was drafted to play outside; the Steelers didn't realize that Woodley was going to become a very good OLB so quickly and that Silverback was going to become a DMVP and stalwart OLB. They are simply finding a way to get Timmons' athletic ability on the field by playing him inside.

Timmons will be Silverback's replacement in 2-3 years.

Pappy

[Lebsteel]

Re: Would we have a better Defense if...

We traded down, picked up another 2nd round pick, drafted 6'2" 265 lb. Brandon Graham in Rd. 1, played him at OLB and moved James Harrison to ILB?

I'd have no problem with Brandon Graham in Round 1. Who knows, he could develop into a better pass rusher than Harrison.

I have actually proposed Harrison and Timmons inside together before. The wear and tear will eventually beat up Harrison on the outside because he is a pure bull rusher and bangs with guys who outweigh him by 50+ pounds every play. We started seeing him get dinged last year. But he is a rock who I think would be an awesome run stopper in the middle.

I didn't take time to explain my logic, but Harrison being outweighed by at least 80 to 100 lbs. by most left tackles is part of the reason I was thinking that way. He is certainly not the prototypical height and weight of a 3-4 OLB. As we all know he is only 6'0" and 242 lbs. Graham is only 6'1" but is 25 lbs. heavier and runs a 4.6 to 4.7 40 while benching 31 reps. So he is certainly quick enough and strong enough to fight off the big LTs. He absolutely dominated Bryan Baluga, a top 10 LT prospect, last year. So, it may be an option if the Steelers are able to trade down, but I'm not sure I would do it if we stay at 18.

[Oviedo]

Re: Would we have a better Defense if...

We traded down, picked up another 2nd round pick, drafted 6'2" 265 lb. Brandon Graham in Rd. 1, played him at OLB and moved James Harrison to ILB?

I'd rather an ILB with Harrison inside and move Timmons to his natural position as an OLB. He was drafted to play outside; the Steelers didn't realize that Woodley was going to become a very good OLB so quickly and that Silverback was going to become a DMVP and stalwart OLB. They are simply finding a way to get Timmons' athletic ability on the field by playing him inside.

Timmons will be Silverback's replacement in 2-3 years.

Pappy

Good points. It would be interesting to see what Timmons speed on the outside could do versus Harrison and Woodley's pure bull rishes. It would be interesting to see them switch up during games and flip keeping the opponents off balance.

[Lebsteel]

Re: Would we have a better Defense if...

We traded down, picked up another 2nd round pick, drafted 6'2" 265 lb. Brandon Graham in Rd. 1, played him at OLB and moved James Harrison to ILB?

I'd rather an ILB with Harrison inside and move Timmons to his natural position as an OLB. He was drafted to play outside; the Steelers didn't realize that Woodley was going to become a very good OLB so quickly and that Silverback was going to become a DMVP and stalwart OLB. They are simply finding a way to get Timmons' athletic ability on the field by playing him inside.

Timmons will be Silverback's replacement in 2-3 years.

Pappy

Yea, but what troubles me about Timmons is that he is even lighter (234 lbs.) than Harrison and does not have a real strong upper body. He certainly has the speed, but I think he could be quickly worn down by the big LTs that weigh 100 lbs. more than him.

[papillon]

Re: Would we have a better Defense if...

We traded down, picked up another 2nd round pick, drafted 6'2" 265 lb. Brandon Graham in Rd. 1, played him at OLB and moved James Harrison to ILB?

I'd rather an ILB with Harrison inside and move Timmons to his natural position as an OLB. He was drafted to play outside; the Steelers didn't realize that Woodley was going to become a very good OLB so quickly and that Silverback was going to become a DMVP and stalwart OLB. They are simply finding a way to get Timmons' athletic ability on the field by playing him inside.

Timmons will be Silverback's replacement in 2-3 years.

Pappy

Yea, but what troubles me about Timmons is that he is even lighter (234 lbs.) than Harrison and does not have a real strong upper body. He certainly has the speed, but I think he could be quickly worn down by the big LTs that weigh 100 lbs. more than him.

It is a concern as you have stated; however, I doubt that Timmons would bull rush an entire game. His greatest gifts are quick twitch muscles, I would expect him to rush more like Freeney than Harrison. Of course, over the course of a game this will wear you down as well, but, not so much physically, but from an aerobic standpoint.

A bull rush or two per game to try and surprise the tackle would be effective for Timmons, other than that I see the swim move, something similar to Freeney's spin move or simple outquick them to the outside (ala Lawrence Taylor). I think he'd hold up fine and he'd be a huge asset chasing down plays form the backside.

Just my 2 cents...

Pappy

[steelblood]

Re: Would we have a better Defense if...

We traded down, picked up another 2nd round pick, drafted 6'2" 265 lb. Brandon Graham in Rd. 1, played him at OLB and moved James Harrison to ILB?

I'd have no problem with Brandon Graham in Round 1. Who knows, he could develop into a better pass rusher than Harrison.

I have actually proposed Harrison and Timmons inside together before. The wear and tear will eventually beat up Harrison on the outside because he is a pure bull rusher and bangs with guys who outweigh him by 50+ pounds every play. We started seeing him get dinged last year. But he is a rock who I think would be an awesome run stopper in the middle.

I don't get the wear and tear angle, oviedo. Inside he'll be banging into squat guards and centers and taking on Fullbacks in the hole. I think the wear and tear is pretty similar, maybe worse inside.

But, I really don't have a problem moving him inside. He is the toughest backer we have and would definitely stick his nose in there.

[Oviedo]

Re: Would we have a better Defense if...

We traded down, picked up another 2nd round pick, drafted 6'2" 265 lb. Brandon Graham in Rd. 1, played him at OLB and moved James Harrison to ILB?

I'd have no problem with Brandon Graham in Round 1. Who knows, he could develop into a better pass rusher than Harrison.

I have actually proposed Harrison and Timmons inside together before. The wear and tear will eventually beat up Harrison on the outside because he is a pure bull rusher and bangs with guys who outweigh him by 50+ pounds every play. We started seeing him get dinged last year. But he is a rock who I think would be an awesome run stopper in the middle.

I don't get the wear and tear angle, oviedo. Inside he'll be banging into squat guards and centers and taking on Fullbacks in the hole. I think the wear and tear is pretty similar, maybe worse inside.

But, I really don't have a problem moving him inside. He is the toughest backer we have and would definitely stick his nose in there.

Would be the mauling he gets by OTs and they way they get him in head locks and twist his neck. That would be called holding on the inside but OTs are getting a pass. That's why I think bull rushers aren't getting calls because they are locking up with the OTs.

Just my opinion on what I see.

[Dee Dub]

Re: Would we have a better Defense if...

For next year??? Absolutely not!! It would take Graham some time to make that move to 3-4 OLB. In the years after that??? Hmmmmm?? Interesting. Then James Harrison is 33. I'm not so sure that is a good idea.

[frankthetank1]

Re: Would we have a better Defense if...

We traded down, picked up another 2nd round pick, drafted 6'2" 265 lb. Brandon Graham in Rd. 1, played him at OLB and moved James Harrison to ILB?

I'd rather an ILB with Harrison inside and move Timmons to his natural position as an OLB. He was drafted to play outside; the Steelers didn't realize that Woodley was going to become a very good OLB so quickly and that Silverback was going to become a DMVP and stalwart OLB. They are simply finding a way to get Timmons' athletic ability on the field by playing him inside.

Timmons will be Silverback's replacement in 2-3 years.

Pappy

Yea, but what troubles me about Timmons is that he is even lighter (234 lbs.) than Harrison and does not have a real strong upper body. He certainly has the speed, but I think he could be quickly worn down by the big LTs that weigh 100 lbs. more than him.

It is a concern as you have stated; however, I doubt that Timmons would bull rush an entire game. His greatest gifts are quick twitch muscles, I would expect him to rush more like Freeney than Harrison. Of course, over the course of a game this will wear you down as well, but, not so much physically, but from an aerobic standpoint.

A bull rush or two per game to try and surprise the tackle would be effective for Timmons, other than that I see the swim move, something similar to Freeney's spin move or simple outquick them to the outside (ala Lawrence Taylor). I think he'd hold up fine and he'd be a huge asset chasing down plays form the backside.

Just my 2 cents...

Pappy

i agree i think timmons should be playing outside. he is so fast he would be great rushing the qb at olb. he was great in college playing olb. it reminds me a little bit of chris hope playing fs

[Oviedo]

Re: Would we have a better Defense if...

We traded down, picked up another 2nd round pick, drafted 6'2" 265 lb. Brandon Graham in Rd. 1, played him at OLB and moved James Harrison to ILB?

I'd rather an ILB with Harrison inside and move Timmons to his natural position as an OLB. He was drafted to play outside; the Steelers didn't realize that Woodley was going to become a very good OLB so quickly and that Silverback was going to become a DMVP and stalwart OLB. They are simply finding a way to get Timmons' athletic ability on the field by playing him inside.

Timmons will be Silverback's replacement in 2-3 years.

Pappy

Yea, but what troubles me about Timmons is that he is even lighter (234 lbs.) than Harrison and does not have a real strong upper body. He certainly has the speed, but I think he could be quickly worn down by the big LTs that weigh 100 lbs. more than him.

It is a concern as you have stated; however, I doubt that Timmons would bull rush an entire game. His greatest gifts are quick twitch muscles, I would expect him to rush more like Freeney than Harrison. Of course, over the course of a game this will wear you down as well, but, not so much physically, but from an aerobic standpoint.

A bull rush or two per game to try and surprise the tackle would be effective for Timmons, other than that I see the swim move, something similar to Freeney's spin move or simple outquick them to the outside (ala Lawrence Taylor). I think he'd hold up fine and he'd be a huge asset chasing down plays form the backside.

Just my 2 cents...

Pappy

i agree i think timmons should be playing outside. he is so fast he would be great rushing the qb at olb. he was great in college playing olb. it reminds me a little bit of chris hope playing fs

Case in point. Look at when Starks and Colon got called for holding---it was against speed rushers that forced them to "reach." I can't remember a single time they were called for holding against a bull rush where they lock up with the pass rusher.

I think if the league continues to refuse to call blatant holding if the OT is locked up with the pass rusher teams are going to be forced to evolve to speed rusher which force the big OTs to move and reach. I think Timmons would be great in that role.