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Thread: Chiefs, Mahommes SB era done. Your salary cap advantage just ended.

  1. #171
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    Quote Originally Posted by NJ-STEELER View Post
    to me, spending 2nd and 3rd rounder on WRs isn't exactly setting up your biggest asset.

    just look at our history at left tackle. probably the 2nd more position on offense.
    beachum 7th rounder
    villa - street free agent/former WR

    can you honestly try and tell me they've addressed that position like other teams with their franchise QBs did?
    brady, rodgers, etc
    I don't have the time, but it would be interesting to see who the LTs were that were available when we made picks over the decade.

    And then we got AV. Who we picked up for nothing and turned into a pretty good LT. And since he was already pretty good with years ahead of him, it didn't make sense to spend high draft capital on LT. Especially after Shazier got hurt and we had to try to rebuild the D on the fly so they could be at least reasonably good while the O was at it's peak (something we didn't end up accomplishing IMO).

    I don't think it's too surprising that a team that usually drafts in the back half of the first (after the best Ts are gone) tends to draft iOL with the higher draft picks they spend on the position group.

    And then after they invest in the OL, they let it sit for a long time. Because OL have longer careers than most positions.

    And while I think we drafted too many WRs that didn't really pan out, I get the strategy of continually spending high picks on WRs so you don't have to pay the 2nd contracts on WRs (which are too high for what they bring IMO). Especially when you have a HoF QB, who (at least in his prime) tended to make just about any WR look pretty good. I think Sanders is our only WR that left in Ben's prime years that really did anything somewhere else.

  2. #172
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    Quote Originally Posted by Northern_Blitz View Post
    And while I think we drafted too many WRs that didn't really pan out, I get the strategy of continually spending high picks on WRs so you don't have to pay the 2nd contracts on WRs (which are too high for what they bring IMO). Especially when you have a HoF QB, who (at least in his prime) tended to make just about any WR look pretty good. I think Sanders is our only WR that left in Ben's prime years that really did anything somewhere else.
    you also have to take into account a few of higher picks where we took a WR was because we needed a replacement.

    starting with Bryant.
    theN AB
    JUJU

    a bit different then the bengals drafting Higgins high 2nd round and chase the following year at 5 overall.
    that’s 4-5 years together with rookie contracts.
    they also re upped Boyd ( 2nd rounder in 2016) right before drafting burrow and Higgins.

  3. #173
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    I think there are numerous philosophies that can win a Super Bowl.
    The problem I have is our fans thinking ours is the only way and it should never be deviated from.
    To be honest, our first 4 super bowls were before this current form of free agency. We have been fortunate enough to win 2 in this era. I know it’s fun to say we have 6 rings(which we do) but we need to look at how the Steelers compare to the other teams during this time period. Better than lots but not elite like you want to believe.
    It’s funny how certain fans on here like to make fun of the browns. I’m guessing that they don’t know history and don’t realize their success before the Super Bowl was invented.
    I know this is a steeler fan message board and certain fans want it to be all rah rah but some objectively would be welcomed.
    How is it possible to have the best owner, best front office, best gm, best HC, good/great drafts every year and good FA acquisitions every year, but only have 3 playoff wins in 14 years?

  4. #174
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    Quote Originally Posted by whatever View Post
    I think there are numerous philosophies that can win a Super Bowl.
    The problem I have is our fans thinking ours is the only way and it should never be deviated from.
    To be honest, our first 4 super bowls were before this current form of free agency. We have been fortunate enough to win 2 in this era. I know it’s fun to say we have 6 rings(which we do) but we need to look at how the Steelers compare to the other teams during this time period. Better than lots but not elite like you want to believe.
    It’s funny how certain fans on here like to make fun of the browns. I’m guessing that they don’t know history and don’t realize their success before the Super Bowl was invented.
    I know this is a steeler fan message board and certain fans want it to be all rah rah but some objectively would be welcomed.
    It seems like all of these philosophies requires either an elite QB, or an above-average QB on a rookie deal.

    Look at SF. They are probably doing most of the other things very well. But when they face a good QB in the playoffs (there are fewer in the NFC I believe), they lose.

    Seems like you need to get QB right to be "successful" when "successful" is defined as "win a SB".

  5. #175
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    Quote Originally Posted by whatever View Post
    I think there are numerous philosophies that can win a Super Bowl.
    The problem I have is our fans thinking ours is the only way and it should never be deviated from.
    To be honest, our first 4 super bowls were before this current form of free agency. We have been fortunate enough to win 2 in this era. I know it’s fun to say we have 6 rings(which we do) but we need to look at how the Steelers compare to the other teams during this time period. Better than lots but not elite like you want to believe.
    It’s funny how certain fans on here like to make fun of the browns. I’m guessing that they don’t know history and don’t realize their success before the Super Bowl was invented.
    I know this is a steeler fan message board and certain fans want it to be all rah rah but some objectively would be welcomed.
    I love being objective. But dont confuse it with negativity.

    Look at THIS comment. Do you realize that you SIMULTANEOUSLY downplay 4 our our six SBs and HIGHLIGHT that the zero SB Browns do indeed have pre-SB era championships?

    Here is the difference my friend.
    “I” and many others remember 6 Steeler SBs.
    I turn 59 tomorrow and the last time the Browns won a championship WAS THE YEAR OF MY BIRTH.

    (My arrival and a 6 decade long period of Brown ineptitude- coincidence? I think not).

    Most folks who EVER saw a Browns championship are DEAD, half of the few remaining cant remember where they live if they get lost, so what do a few championships in an era that only “Bob the Revelator” can actually remember matter?
    Last edited by Captain Lemming; 03-20-2023 at 03:01 PM.




    In view of the fact that Mike Tomlin has matched Cowhers record I give him the designation:

    TCFCLTC-
    The Coach Formerly Considered Less Than Cowher

  6. #176
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    Quote Originally Posted by whatever View Post
    I think there are numerous philosophies that can win a Super Bowl.
    The problem I have is our fans thinking ours is the only way and it should never be deviated from.
    To be honest, our first 4 super bowls were before this current form of free agency. We have been fortunate enough to win 2 in this era. I know it’s fun to say we have 6 rings(which we do) but we need to look at how the Steelers compare to the other teams during this time period. Better than lots but not elite like you want to believe.
    It’s funny how certain fans on here like to make fun of the browns. I’m guessing that they don’t know history and don’t realize their success before the Super Bowl was invented.
    I know this is a steeler fan message board and certain fans want it to be all rah rah but some objectively would be welcomed.
    better than lots but not elite..hmmmm

    so who is elite besides the Pats during our last 2 SB’s from 2000 to 2023? Hell, lets go back to the 80’s until now if you would like.

    Who has won more than 2 SB’s besides the Pats? Giants maybe? But how do their down years compare to ours? Who has 4 SB appearances and at least 2 wins?

    I’m not saying there aren’t others but the list probably isn’t long. We’ve had a drought recently that also coincided with an aging QB and a D that went from legendary to average while also having a horrifying injury to its play caller on defense in his prime.

    This isn’t a trick question, I just want to know who fills the spaces between Pats and Steelers while using the word elite these last 30 years.
    Last edited by feltdizz; 03-20-2023 at 03:02 PM.
    I lost a bet about Najee gaining 1300 yards.

    "Our head coach has failed to win a playoff game for seven years in a row. His game day strategy, culture of divas, in game decisions, clock management, player evaluation, hires, and affinity with sub par starters at RB, P, and OL are holding the Steelers back. That standard remains the standard"



  7. #177
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    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Lemming View Post
    I love being objective. But dont confuse it with negativity.

    Look at THIS comment. Do you realize that you SIMULTANEOUSLY downplay 4 our our six SBs and HIGHLIGHT that the zero SB Browns do indeed have pre-SB era championships?

    Here is the difference my friend.
    “I” and many others remember 6 Steeler SBs.
    I turn 59 tomorrow and the last time the Browns won a championship WAS THE YEAR OF MY BIRTH.

    (Yes, I take full credit for creating their near 6 decade long period of ineptitude)

    Most folks who EVER saw a Browns championship are DEAD so what do a few championships in an era that only “Bob the Revelator” can actually remember.
    You are missing the point. I love telling my friends that my team has 6 super bowls but you also need to take other things into consideration.
    To act like the nfl didn’t exist and records and titles aren’t worth anything until the Super Bowl was invited is ridiculous.
    Apparently most of the people in HOFs that played over 50 years ago weren’t any good because you didn’t watch them
    play?
    You can’t compare todays players to players of 50 years ago.
    You can’t compare teams of today vs 50 years ago.
    You also can’t compare how the 4 Super Bowl Steelers were built to how the steelers operate today.
    Those teams would have been raped in FA if the rules were set up that way.
    I’m not taking anything away from those wins.
    The fact is the ‘Steelers way’ of putting together teams today is nowhere near what it was back then.
    How is it possible to have the best owner, best front office, best gm, best HC, good/great drafts every year and good FA acquisitions every year, but only have 3 playoff wins in 14 years?

  8. #178
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    Quote Originally Posted by Northern_Blitz View Post
    It seems like all of these philosophies requires either an elite QB, or an above-average QB on a rookie deal.

    Look at SF. They are probably doing most of the other things very well. But when they face a good QB in the playoffs (there are fewer in the NFC I believe), they lose.

    Seems like you need to get QB right to be "successful" when "successful" is defined as "win a SB".
    I think we debunked that ‘rookie qb contract’ a couple months ago.
    I agree with a great qb, most of the time.
    How is it possible to have the best owner, best front office, best gm, best HC, good/great drafts every year and good FA acquisitions every year, but only have 3 playoff wins in 14 years?

  9. #179
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    Quote Originally Posted by whatever View Post
    You also can’t compare how the 4 Super Bowl Steelers were built to how the steelers operate today.
    Those teams would have been raped in FA if the rules were set up that way.
    I actually BELIEVE wholeheartedly in this point. It is why the expectation of a 70s dynasty just because you have the 5th or 6th best QB among his peers is a flawed expectation.




    In view of the fact that Mike Tomlin has matched Cowhers record I give him the designation:

    TCFCLTC-
    The Coach Formerly Considered Less Than Cowher

  10. #180
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    Quote Originally Posted by whatever View Post
    I think we debunked that ‘rookie qb contract’ a couple months ago.
    I agree with a great qb, most of the time.
    Link?

    It's the biggest advantage in the league to have an above average QB on a rookie deal. QBs on those deals are massively underpaid. And within a give year, the cap makes roster management (close to) a zero sum game.

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