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Thread: I don't want this to get lost in the loss

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by hackjam View Post
    And giving a little extra to the opponents!


    That actually is what brought it to mind.




    In view of the fact that Mike Tomlin has matched Cowhers record I give him the designation:

    TCFCLTC-
    The Coach Formerly Considered Less Than Cowher

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by hackjam View Post
    I don't think the 3-4/4-3 stuff really matters anymore. Nickel is effectively the base set for all teams now and with the reclassification of the 4-3 DEs/3-4 OLBs as EDGEs there's a lot of gray area. You hear about positionless basketball in the NBA and you're seeing shades of it across the fronts of a lot of NFL defenses as well.

    Also depends on scheme, even back in the day. Bruce Smith got a few sacks one gapping in those old Buffalo 3-4 defenses. JJ Watt was in a supposed 3-4 as well.

    I ask because I don't know, were Noll's 3-4 defenses in the 80s two gapping or is that something that came along with Cowher?
    The Bills played a 3-4 for sure during their heyday in the early 90s so that tells me that Bruce Smith was a freak (which I think we all knew anyhow) so as an RDE in a 3-4 he had 200 sacks and then you have Aaron Smith who was an RDE in a 3-4 who had 44 sacks but held down the position in such a fashion that it was fruitless to run in his direction.

    I believe that Noll was exclusively a 4-3 guy and that Cowher and Lebeau brought the 3-4 to Pittsburgh which was basically the birth of that particular style of defense. No other teams were using or very few other teams were using so the Steelers were always able to find players that fit their scheme from college because no other teams were considering them. Maybe, it doesn't matter so much the scheme, maybe I want it to matter because I love Heyward and the heart that he puts into being a DE for the Pittsburgh Steelers. And, without it mattering I don't think he'll get into the HOF and I'd love to see him make the HOF someday.

    Pappy


    The referee said that you hit Brian Sipe too hard. Did you hit him too hard?
    I hit him as hard as I could - Jack Lambert

  3. #23
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    I agree with a lot of your opinions with hall of fame stuff, I also think Aaron smith was just as effective and even more underrated than heyward is, smith was as good of a defensive player as anyone else in the nfl, constant motor that never took a play

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by hackjam View Post
    Wilfork will be an interesting case. Him and Hampton may be the last of the true 0-tech NTs for some time (arguably Ngata though he kind of played everywhere from 0 tech to 5 tech). Hampton keeps popping up on the HOF finalist lists but yeah his chances are super low.
    Wilfork also has 2x rings. And that helps (like our guys from the 70s).

    But if he does get in, it probably helps Cam.

    Wilfork: 5 probowls; 1 All-Pro; 16 sacks in 13 years. 2x SB rings. I didn't have TFLs in my other post, but Wilfork had 39.

    After this year Cam should probably have the same number of probowls (currently 4). He already has more APs (2); way more sacks 62.5 and TFLs 93.

    Hopefully Cam can get a SB ring, but he's running out of at bats I think.
    Last edited by Northern_Blitz; 11-23-2021 at 09:34 AM.

  5. #25
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    A thread on a fan board is not enough. Heyward deserves his own shrine in Pittsburgh. Ten weeks of elite play at the age of 32, on top of studded career highlights over a decade in the NFL.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Northern_Blitz View Post
    Wilfork also has 2x rings. And that helps (like our guys from the 70s).

    But if he does get in, it probably helps Cam.

    Wilfork: 5 probowls; 1 All-Pro; 16 sacks in 13 years. 2x SB rings. I didn't have TFLs in my other post, but Wilfork had 39.

    After this year Cam should probably have the same number of probowls (currently 4). He already has more APs (2); way more sacks 62.5 and TFLs 93.

    Hopefully Cam can get a SB ring, but he's running out of at bats I think.
    Well.. Cam also has to show up in the playoffs.

    Dude is a beast but our DL has been blown up the last few playoff games. Its not all on Cam but it would be nice if guys like Cam, Tuitt and Watt showed up and showed out in the playoffs.
    Tomlinís coming back so what can you do?


  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by feltdizz View Post
    Well.. Cam also has to show up in the playoffs.

    Dude is a beast but our DL has been blown up the last few playoff games. Its not all on Cam but it would be nice if guys like Cam, Tuitt and Watt showed up and showed out in the playoffs.
    Agree completely.




    In view of the fact that Mike Tomlin has matched Cowhers record I give him the designation:

    TCFCLTC-
    The Coach Formerly Considered Less Than Cowher

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by papillon View Post
    The Bills played a 3-4 for sure during their heyday in the early 90s so that tells me that Bruce Smith was a freak (which I think we all knew anyhow) so as an RDE in a 3-4 he had 200 sacks and then you have Aaron Smith who was an RDE in a 3-4 who had 44 sacks but held down the position in such a fashion that it was fruitless to run in his direction.

    I believe that Noll was exclusively a 4-3 guy and that Cowher and Lebeau brought the 3-4 to Pittsburgh which was basically the birth of that particular style of defense. No other teams were using or very few other teams were using so the Steelers were always able to find players that fit their scheme from college because no other teams were considering them. Maybe, it doesn't matter so much the scheme, maybe I want it to matter because I love Heyward and the heart that he puts into being a DE for the Pittsburgh Steelers. And, without it mattering I don't think he'll get into the HOF and I'd love to see him make the HOF someday.

    Pappy
    Read a write up recently about DL in the NFL. Said the classic positions have become this gray area because of sub packages being used. DE, DT, NT, OLB, EDGE, all an alphabet soup at this point.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by JTP53609 View Post
    I agree with a lot of your opinions with hall of fame stuff, I also think Aaron smith was just as effective and even more underrated than heyward is, smith was as good of a defensive player as anyone else in the nfl, constant motor that never took a play
    People always imagine Casey and Smith were so dominant not because they made plays but that they were indispensable in allowing others to make plays particularly in the run game.

    The best run defense of their careers?
    1. Year we went to SB against Green Bay. Smith was injured early and ZIGGY HOOD played most of the season.
    2. 2004. Casey was injured most of the season replaced by HOKE (Who had 1 loss for his career when replacing Casey).

    They were very good players for their roles true, but "great"? Nah.




    In view of the fact that Mike Tomlin has matched Cowhers record I give him the designation:

    TCFCLTC-
    The Coach Formerly Considered Less Than Cowher

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Lemming View Post
    People always imagine Casey and Smith were so dominant not because they made plays but that they were indispensable in allowing others to make plays particularly in the run game.

    The best run defense of their careers?
    1. Year we went to SB against Green Bay. Smith was injured early and ZIGGY HOOD played most of the season.
    2. 2004. Casey was injured most of the season replaced by HOKE (Who had 1 loss for his career when replacing Casey).

    They were very good players for their roles true, but "great"? Nah.

    Let me add. They "occupied blockers" sure.

    I NEVER ONCE SAW A STEELER DEFENDER OCCUPY BLOCKERS LIKE CAM DID SUNDAY.

    ALL SEASON LONG he has been getting more doubles that they EVER had because the rest of the line is a joke.

    Yet he was making the plays Sunday.

    If Cam is getting double and even TRIPLE teamed the fact that linebackers aren't making plays ain't on him.
    Last edited by Captain Lemming; 11-24-2021 at 11:41 AM.




    In view of the fact that Mike Tomlin has matched Cowhers record I give him the designation:

    TCFCLTC-
    The Coach Formerly Considered Less Than Cowher

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