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Thread: Trading Up for a QB

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Northern_Blitz View Post
    Maybe part of the reason the Browns are a terrible FO is because they make desperate, knee jerk decisions?

    Mahomes was selected 10th and Jackson was selected 32nd.

    They're probably the two best young QBs in the league.

    Seems like taking a gamble at that range in the first is safer than a massive trade up like the Rams did. And their guy doesn't look all that good right now (despite having elite defenders who they probably won't be able to keep now that they ponied up the big $$$ for the QB).

    Maybe it's becoming easier to get decent QBs a bit later in the draft since they are slanting the rules in favor of the O?

    And as you often point out, it's not like having Ben has led us to a ton of playoff success in recent years.

    Maybe inflation of QB salaries will see the pendulum shift to decent cheap guys on good contracts so the rest of the team can be better? Hopefully something like that happens, because we'll need a new QB fairly soon.
    I think it’s easier to get QB’s later in the draft if you actual commit to their style of play.

    Lamar wouldn’t look good in a pro style offense. That’s not his game. I’m not a big Josh Allen fan but he turned the corner because the Bills have gone run heavy and actually have QB runs designed for Allen. Dude still made some head scratching decisions late in that game but he’s still young.

    While I’m not sold on Mason I think if we put him in a OK State type offense he would look much better. Less reads, shotgun on every pass play and max protection and he can probably have a decent year. As much as I hate his stiffness I still think we win one of the last 3 games if Mason wasn’t beat over the head by Baltimore and Cleveland.

    and if they don’t work out, cut them loose early and try again.
    Tomlinís coming back so what can you do?


  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Lemming View Post
    Of course you say you "trust" someone to do what you want him to do. That is trusting your own opinion, not him.

    If you REALLY trust someone, you believe in what they actually DO regardless your opinion. You say I thought they should do this but they must know better so I "trust" their judgement.

    It is like your saying you "trust" Colbert and Rooney to choose a replacement for Tomlin (on topic per your sig ) but clearly disagree with their opinion of Tomlin.

    If they are too stupid to see after a decade and a half that Tomlin can't coach, they are terrible judges of what makes for a good coach.

    To call it "trust" only when someone does what you already want to do ain't real trust dude.
    what if Colbert “trust” Mason Rudolph?

    dude keeps saying he has trust but he actually doesn’t trust Colbert at all.
    Tomlinís coming back so what can you do?


  3. #13
    Legend

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    And this is why 5 years before you anticipate your franchise QB retiring you start looking. We could have had Lamar Jackson but passed. There is no way around investing a premium pick unless you get very lucky.

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shawn View Post
    And this is why 5 years before you anticipate your franchise QB retiring you start looking. We could have had Lamar Jackson but passed. There is no way around investing a premium pick unless you get very lucky.
    5 years sounds about right.
    From the 2010-2019 season, (A 9 year period that the majority of Cowher's players & coaches had left) Mike Tomlin has only won 3 playoff games. And two of those wins were against back up Quarterbacks.
    Dolphin fans in the 90ís who wanted to hold on to Don Shula for what he did in the 70ís...

    Are the same as Steeler fans (of 2020 ) holding on to Tomlin for what he did in 2008.

    [url]http://www.planetsteelers.com/forums/showthread.php/50121-A-Positive-View-of-they-Draft/page17[/url]

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steel Maniac View Post
    So now we are the browns? Lol.

    Browns= terrible front office/GM
    Cardinals= terrible front office/GM

    You can’t compare Colbert to those front offices & GM’s.
    I don't have the same confidence in his QB opinion.

    I think we have as much basis for confidence in Colbert's judgement of QBs as we have in drafting Cornerbacks.

    He had Ben sitting before him and was ready to take a tackle.

  6. #16
    Legend

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    Quote Originally Posted by Steel Maniac View Post
    5 years sounds about right.
    Well, if Ben plays for two more years at an NFL level that will put Rudolph at the 4 year mark so it seems that the Steelers did invest in a quarterback around the 5 year mark.

    Pappy


    The referee said that you hit Brian Sipe too hard. Did you hit him too hard?
    I hit him as hard as I could - Jack Lambert

    2.49 - Chase Claypool, WR, Notre Dame
    3.102 - Alex Highsmith, OLB, Charlotte
    4.124 - Anthony McFarland, RB, Maryland
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  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shawn View Post
    And this is why 5 years before you anticipate your franchise QB retiring you start looking. We could have had Lamar Jackson but passed. There is no way around investing a premium pick unless you get very lucky.
    I disagree with this.

    Even is MR turns out to be a decent QB, we'll have wasted his rookie contract by the time Ben retires.

    I think be best time to look for a franchise QB is the year they retire or the year after. Do poorly to get a good pick and use that pick to draft a QB. Then hope you picked well.

    I think the best way to win in the NFL is to have a good QB on a rookie deal. If you try to replace your guy too early, you lose that opportunity.

    This is actually what I think we'll do now. I think we'll hold on to Mason and one of Duck or Lynch. Give MR a chance when Ben retires. If he fails, then go hunting for the next guy.
    Talent vs coaching: [url]www.planetsteelers.com/forums/showthread.php/48851-Poll-Question-for-Everyone/page14[/url]

    Steelers vs. Other Teams with good QBs: ... /47985-Steelers-most-successful-failure/page5

    Tomlin playoff record vs. expectations (Cowher pg24): ... /48742-Rooney-Brown-meeting/page22

    Tomlin's Las year: ... 49599-Just-sayin?p=778284#post778284

    Maniac Talent>Coaching: ...49632-Trades?p=779158#post779158

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Lemming View Post
    I don't have the same confidence in his QB opinion.

    I think we have as much basis for confidence in Colbert's judgement of QBs as we have in drafting Cornerbacks.

    He had Ben sitting before him and was ready to take a tackle.
    I think the league has lots of data showing that scouting QBs is very difficult and no one is really good at it.

    It's like goalies in hockey. You need to get a good one, but it's a crap-shoot even for guys who had good college / minor league performance.

    I also don't get Maniac's professed trust in Colbert. I feel like he's been pretty staunchly against Colbert's ability to draft CBs (based on data), but maybe I'm confusing him with another poster.
    Talent vs coaching: [url]www.planetsteelers.com/forums/showthread.php/48851-Poll-Question-for-Everyone/page14[/url]

    Steelers vs. Other Teams with good QBs: ... /47985-Steelers-most-successful-failure/page5

    Tomlin playoff record vs. expectations (Cowher pg24): ... /48742-Rooney-Brown-meeting/page22

    Tomlin's Las year: ... 49599-Just-sayin?p=778284#post778284

    Maniac Talent>Coaching: ...49632-Trades?p=779158#post779158

  9. #19
    Legend

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    Quote Originally Posted by papillon View Post
    Well, if Ben plays for two more years at an NFL level that will put Rudolph at the 4 year mark so it seems that the Steelers did invest in a quarterback around the 5 year mark.

    Pappy
    We has a "first round grade" on the guy?
    Why am I supposed to "trust" his opinion of QBs?

    I do get it, we need one. At some point we need to take a shot.

    But the idea that we have ANY basis for thinking he is "better" than other GMs at picking them has no basis whatsoever in what he has done.

  10. #20
    Legend

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    Quote Originally Posted by Northern_Blitz View Post
    I think the league has lots of data showing that scouting QBs is very difficult and no one is really good at it.

    It's like goalies in hockey. You need to get a good one, but it's a crap-shoot even for guys who had good college / minor league performance.

    I also don't get Maniac's professed trust in Colbert. I feel like he's been pretty staunchly against Colbert's ability to draft CBs (based on data), but maybe I'm confusing him with another poster.
    I do agree here. QB is hard to call
    But dude was about to go TACKLE with Ben on the board...a RARE shot at a franchise QB and was gonna say no.

    Even worse was word that he and Cowher WANTED Rivers (some predictions had Ben going before Rivers)....so it wasnt like they weren't interested in the position.

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