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Thread: Fire Mike Tomlin

  1. #291
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    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Lemming View Post
    Really. Would ANYBODY be shocked if it was Grimm? Everybody thought he was gonna be the guy.



    First of all, you made the ridiculous assertion that if he were white his “resume” would not get him hired. I made no case in this thread about after the hire, even went out of my way to make that clear.
    Besides Tomlin the only guy left taught fat guys to block.

    As Ruthless points out, Tomlins experience is TYPICAL in today’s NFL.



    But I will “go there” if you insist.

    Cowher coached Cowhers players for years.
    Two seasons after Cowher, Tomlin takes Cowhers 20th defense to a level NEVER ACHIEVED under Cowher.

    The best Steeler defenses since Noll were coached by Tomlin NOT Cowher.
    That is a fact Jack.

    Imagine some hot shot kid replaced Tomlin and Burns and Davis thrive with the best pass defense in the league? You gonna say it was Tomlins players or the new coach?
    Be honest. You know the answer.



    Then just admit your initial point that I-took issue with was wrong.



    I think a time comes when most coaches rhetoric loses its power. Should he be fired after disappointing this year I’d agree.
    It happened to Noll.

    But the idea that he had no resume’ deserving of consideration, or that he has no credit for success?

    I don’t think so.
    Nobody would have been surprised by Grimm or Whis, strictly because they were with the organization at the time. That's the difference. Nobody ever even heard of Tomlin.

    1 year as a coordinator, where his defense was ranked last against the pass, with no ties to anyone in Pittsburgh, was obviously more than enough to get one of the most coveted coaching positions in all of sports?

  2. #292
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    Why in every workplace in America, people are hired/promoted based on race or sex but it can't possibly happen in the NFL?
    Especially by a team that invented a hiring rule ....c'mon man. Don't be so naive.

  3. #293
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    Quote Originally Posted by Terrapin View Post
    Nobody would have been surprised by Grimm or Whis, strictly because they were with the organization at the time. That's the difference. Nobody ever even heard of Tomlin.

    1 year as a coordinator, where his defense was ranked last against the pass, with no ties to anyone in Pittsburgh, was obviously more than enough to get one of the most coveted coaching positions in all of sports?
    No one in Pittsburgh heard of Cowher when he was hired.

    I think Joe Greene was interviewed as well.

    I remember a lot of people said “who???” when we hired Cowher.

    I know I did.

    I think our next coach will also be someone we aren’t familiar with who is from outside the organization.

    We probably don’t hire from within because it gives our FO an advantage in molding our coaches into our way of operating.

  4. #294
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    Quote Originally Posted by whatever View Post
    Why in every workplace in America, people are hired/promoted based on race or sex but it can't possibly happen in the NFL?
    Especially by a team that invented a hiring rule ....c'mon man. Don't be so naive.

    First off, it isn’t like that in every workplace. If you think it is then it says a lot about you as a person.

    Second, Rivera was interviewed so we already fulfilled the Rooney Rule.

    Third, Tomlin comes from the Dungy coaching tree so he had some respect on his name already.

    4th, Tomlin had a ring already and coached Tampa’s secondary into a TD machine... that same coaching helped JH return an INT 100 yards in the SB. All the players talked about how Tomlin instilled them to block like maniacs anytime there was an INT.

    5th, Tomlin has the gift of gab. Whether you like it or not you know damn well if he walked into an interview he would get the job because he is the ultimate salesman when it comes to “coach speak.”

    6th.. he isn’t going anywhere until he’s gone so why continue to stress about it?

  5. #295
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oh wow View Post
    First off, it isn’t like that in every workplace. If you think it is then it says a lot about you as a person.

    Second, Rivera was interviewed so we already fulfilled the Rooney Rule.

    Third, Tomlin comes from the Dungy coaching tree so he had some respect on his name already.

    4th, Tomlin had a ring already and coached Tampa’s secondary into a TD machine... that same coaching helped JH return an INT 100 yards in the SB. All the players talked about how Tomlin instilled them to block like maniacs anytime there was an INT.

    5th, Tomlin has the gift of gab. Whether you like it or not you know damn well if he walked into an interview he would get the job because he is the ultimate salesman when it comes to “coach speak.”

    6th.. he isn’t going anywhere until he’s gone so why continue to stress about it?
    Couldn't have said it better myself Dizz.

  6. #296
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oh wow View Post
    No one in Pittsburgh heard of Cowher when he was hired.

    I think Joe Greene was interviewed as well.

    I remember a lot of people said “who???” when we hired Cowher.

    I know I did.

    I think our next coach will also be someone we aren’t familiar with who is from outside the organization.

    We probably don’t hire from within because it gives our FO an advantage in molding our coaches into our way of operating.
    I hate the "Rooney Rule" argument because it doesn't stand up if you look at anything outside of Tomlin's skin color.

    His hire is almost exactly the same as Cowher's. Both promising, young, passionate coaches moving up the coaching ranks mentored by very good coaches that probably gave them strong recommendations despite them not having lots of experience.

    I guess the biggest difference would be that Tomlin's recommendation came from Dungy. He's a guy who won a ring with us (led the team in Ints in a SB season), then coached our DBs, then was promoted to our DC. He later became a HC for Indy and was Tomlin's employer. So, his "ties to Pittsburgh" were that he's part of the 2nd generation of Noll's coaching tree and directly trained by a guy who was part of the Steel Curtain. I'm sure that the Rooneys put a lot of faith in that recommendation (another perk of having an ownership group that players respect).

    But even this isn't super different from Cowher. Though his contributions to the Steelers weren't nearly what Dungy's were, Marty did get a cup of coffee of the Steelers roster in 71 (before being traded again that season and ultimately retiring to pursue coaching).

    And in hindsight, it's OBVIOUS that Tomlin was the best choice of the three potential hires. The Rooney's have been awesome at hiring good coaches and creating a good environment for them to thrive in. Or maybe they just rolled snake eyes three times in a row.

    They are basically the same...except for one super obvious and totally trivial detail.
    Last edited by Northern_Blitz; 09-20-2019 at 10:31 AM.
    Talent vs coaching: [[url]www.planetsteelers.com/forums/showthread.php/48851-Poll-Question-for-Everyone/page14][/url]

    Steelers vs. Other Teams with good QBs: [... /47985-Steelers-most-successful-failure/page5]

    Tomlin playoff record vs. expectations (Cowher pg24): [... /48742-Rooney-Brown-meeting/page22]

    Tomlin's Las year: [... 49599-Just-sayin?p=778284#post778284]

  7. #297
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    Quote Originally Posted by Terrapin View Post
    Nobody would have been surprised by Grimm or Whis, strictly because they were with the organization at the time. That's the difference. Nobody ever even heard of Tomlin.

    1 year as a coordinator, where his defense was ranked last against the pass, with no ties to anyone in Pittsburgh, was obviously more than enough to get one of the most coveted coaching positions in all of sports?
    Pass defense is how you judge a DB coach. He was cornerbacks coach of the best pass defense of the era at Tampa Bay.
    He was DC of the Vikings with the number 8 defense. You ignore that people did nothing but pass on that team as they had a HISTORICALLY great run defense. Overall defense......
    THAT is how you judge a coordinator.

    You guys love to parse his record unfavorably.

  8. #298
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    Quote Originally Posted by Terrapin View Post
    Nobody would have been surprised by Grimm or Whis, strictly because they were with the organization at the time. That's the difference. Nobody ever even heard of Tomlin.
    In the organization an advantage?
    When Cowher was hire Mean Joe was the insider AND black.
    Dan did not NEED his own rule.....it is HIS value to provide equal opportunities, not a guaranteed job.

    The Steelers hired the more impressive Cowher FROM OUTSIDE.

    Both young and dynamic, more motivator than tactician.
    Frankly, there is no more similar consecutive coaching hires in the LEAGUE than Cowher and Tomlin. Heck the “type” goes back to Noll.

    We have NEVER had a Walsh or Belichick type tactician as a coach.

  9. #299
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    Quote Originally Posted by Northern_Blitz View Post
    I hate the "Rooney Rule" argument because it doesn't stand up if you look at anything outside of Tomlin's skin color.

    His hire is almost exactly the same as Cowher's. Both promising, young, passionate coaches moving up the coaching ranks mentored by very good coaches that probably gave them strong recommendations despite them not having lots of experience.

    I guess the biggest difference would be that Tomlin's recommendation came from Dungy. He's a guy who won a ring with us (led the team in Ints in a SB season), then coached our DBs, then was promoted to our DC. He later became a HC for Indy and was Tomlin's employer. So, his "ties to Pittsburgh" were that he's part of the 2nd generation of Noll's coaching tree and directly trained by a guy who was part of the Steel Curtain. I'm sure that the Rooneys put a lot of faith in that recommendation (another perk of having an ownership group that players respect).

    But even this isn't super different from Cowher. Though his contributions to the Steelers weren't nearly what Dungy's were, Marty did get a cup of coffee of the Steelers roster in 71 (before being traded again that season and ultimately retiring to pursue coaching).

    And in hindsight, it's OBVIOUS that Tomlin was the best choice of the three potential hires. The Rooney's have been awesome at hiring good coaches and creating a good environment for them to thrive in. Or maybe they just rolled snake eyes three times in a row.

    They are basically the same...except for one super obvious and totally trivial detail.
    There should be no problem hiring the next HC then.

  10. #300
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    Quote Originally Posted by whatever View Post
    There should be no problem hiring the next HC then.
    Yup. But until that time comes it’s probably best to stop trying to make a case for Tomlin to get fired since you know how our FO operates.

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