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Thread: New England Patriots vs. Los Angeles Rams..who wins?

  1. #121

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    Quote Originally Posted by ikestops85 View Post
    Maybe you can use facts, tie it to logic so we can see how you came about your opinion. Just a thought.
    Okay. I'm going to do this just once. Because it might get kind of long. I think it is a waste of time because I don't think anyone is going to be swayed from the side that there on. But here goes......

    Ruth was trying to make a case of Tomlin being compared to Sean Payton and Ruth basically summed up that Tomlin is as good as Sean Payton; which is false. Why?

    Because Tomlin came into his job with the nucleus of a Super Bowl team WITH.... a franchise established winning culture (including assistant coaches ) too. Name me one coach tenered as long as Tomlin who came into there job with those 3 things handed to them??? Exactly. So...Tomlin didn't have to develop culture because there was one already there; Tomlin didn't have to seriously evaluate future QB's because he already had a franchise QB and Tomlin didn't have to really build a quality playoff team because the nucleus was already there.

    Sean Payton came into his job having to:

    1. Change a losing Culture
    2. Find and develop players on both sides of the ball
    3. Find a franchise QB

    And Payton did all those things to be the good coach that he is. Yeah it took Payton some time but considering he is also in a tougher conference overall, he's done a good job.

    __________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ _______________
    So....where are we today with Tomlin? We have a head coach that 12 years in:

    1. Doesn't know how to develop a championship culture
    2. Doesn't know how to find and develop players in the secondary
    3. And doesn't know X & O's to have a plan B or C when plan A doesn't work.

    This is 12 years in mind you.

    So after a time, teams take on the personality of their coach. And after living off of what this organization and Cowher established for the first 4 years, the team had to take on the attributes of it's current coach.

    Tomlin has won his fair share of regular season games. I've never denied that. But he's failed the last 8 years ( in the playoffs) after the discipline and effect of what Cowher had eroded away. That's why I reference the last 8 years. the last 8 years are all Tomlin's team in full effect. No residual from Cowher anymore.

    So in conclusion, let's review:

    Payton: In the beginning, Had to build a team from the ground up: Culture, find and develop players. Everything. And became and is a good coach.
    Tomlin: In the beginning, Never had to develop a team, find players or develope culture.

    So who is the better coach? The coach who learned how to build a team successfully from the ground up in the beginning. If you had to hire a coach for a brand new team, who would you hire? Payton easily because he's done it before.

    Tomlin never has and doesn't to this day know how to build a team in it's entirety.

    Which is why we have the problems from Tomlin we are having today...he never had to do the heavy stuff in the beginning and now he has to develop a championship culture (because he eroded away the one Cowher had established) ; learn to adjust by having a plan B & C and finally has to live up to his resume of being a secondary expert.

    Ike, thanks for asking. I appreciate the dialog . A lot of venom has been thrown my way because of me just stating the obvious about Tomlin. But as you can see by the length of this post, I don't want to have to keep going over this. All of the TTL know this about Tomlin but they smooth it over because they like him so much. But their liking of him isn't getting the job done. It's been 10 years since we won a Super Bowl and I don't think we'll be winning one in 2020 so that's 11 years. How long do they keep staying with a coach who can't develop a team to a championship level? He's a nice guy but he can't do it.

    I think we are in the same situation as the Dolphins were in with Shula; 20 years after he won they just kept staying with him because of what he did for them in the 1970's. When it was clear he couldn't do it anymore. He wasted Marino's years in the same manner that Tomlin has wasted the prime years of Ben by not developing an entire defense. And just like the Dolphin fans who kept on wanting to stay with Shula, we have the Tomlin believers wanting to hang on to Tomlin because of what he did with Cowher's culture, players, and assistant coaches.

    How long did the 49ers keep hanging on to George Seifert after he used up Walsh's culture, players, and assistant coaches? I think

    Tomlin is more Seifert then Shula because at least Shula built those teams culture, players and mystique from the ground up.

    It's not about just regular season wins with us; it never is. Our standards are higher because of what we achieved. I'm not apologizing for that either. Just like the Yankees or Lakers.

    Our history is defined by what we've accomplished in the playoffs; not regular season. Just being succesful in the regular season is a fine goal for most teams that have not won multiple Super Bowls. Meaning, the 49ers, Cowboys, Broncos, Us, Raiders...these teams are not just happy to make the playoffs.
    From the 2010-2018 season, (An 8 year period that the majority of Cowher's players & coaches had left) Mike Tomlin has only won 3 playoff games. And two of those wins were against back up Quarterbacks. Our history has been defined by what we do in the postseason; not the regular season.

  2. #122

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    Tomlin being successful in regular season and then flopping in the post season..

    is like a boy who gets an A or B's on his classwork and homework (regular season)
    And then gets a D or F on his test & final exam (post season)

    I'm done. Thanks IKe.
    From the 2010-2018 season, (An 8 year period that the majority of Cowher's players & coaches had left) Mike Tomlin has only won 3 playoff games. And two of those wins were against back up Quarterbacks. Our history has been defined by what we do in the postseason; not the regular season.


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