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Thread: Steelers CB Ike Taylor says Santonio Holmes and James Harrison would like to return

  1. #61
    Hall of Famer DukieBoy's Avatar
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    I hate to use the word "chemistry" where Holmes AND Ben are concerned, but boy they had it going for a while, and could it be done again? Holmes character likely is still what it was though, and I am not too interested in doing that again to this team.



    Narcissistic injury is the term used for any threat to a narcissist's outsized ego or self-esteem.



  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Lemming View Post
    His last season here after coming off injury having missed September JH had more tackles than any OTHER Steeler OLBer since 2006. His tackle count was higher than a typical Clay Matthews season. JH bested the !majority of 3-4 OLBer in than "down" season. Dude us as good as Clark Haggins ever was right now. He ain't all world but he is better than what we had on that side last year. I hope Jones improves but JH is "WORILDS' better than the people on our bench.


    I get the love for JH...We all have it. That 2012 season (His last) down the stretch...He disappeared. In the 3 must win games of the season (weeks 14-16)...he had 10 tackles & 1 sack in those 3 losses. That isn't "more tackles than any OTHER Steeler OLBs since 2006". In week 17 when the Steelers sat at 7-8 eliminated from the playoffs & JH put up 11 tackles & 1 sack against the 5-10 Browns in his farewell game. That was 2 years ago. For comparison...Including his last game against the Browns...His last 4 games in 2012...21 tackles & 2 sacks. Worilds last 4 games last year...24 tackles & 4 sacks. The clock always goes forward...JH has regressed since then...All you needed to do is see him last year to know the clock has run out.


    If the starters stay healthy...No reason to bring him back. With his decline & not knowing what is on the bench...Nothing is certain. Am I saying Carter, Moates, & anyone else you want to put on that list helps the Steelers more in 2014? If JJ & Worilds are healthy...yes. He may not even get a helmet gamedays in that scenario because they will need Lbs to play ST. If the Steelers don't sign JH...He will be on the street after the season starts. The whole league saw his 2013 campaign with the Bengals.



  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by feltdizz View Post
    Judging him based on 1 year in Cincy makes no sense at all
    Makes perfect sense. We aren't talking about a young player. We are talking about a 36 year old 11 year vet. There is nothing he could do to slow down what is happening to him.



  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ernie View Post
    Going by your theory, the steelers obviously thought JH had something left in the tank about a year ago...when they offered him a reduced salary. As has been stated, judging JH by one season in Cincy, where he was getting adjusted in a new system, position, etc doesn't make much sense.

    I've been watching some videos of some recent JH workouts, specifically, the one where he was "Pausing" 405 on the bench press for several reps. It takes an absolute monster to pause that kind of weight. Ike Taylor has been working out with JH, and said in a recent interview that JH is in the best shape in his life. I've got to believe that this would translation to some kind of production on the football field...


    Like I said twice...They offered him the pay cut because they thought he could help them out in 2013. If he excepted..JJ would still have been drafted. JJ would have sat behing JH last year unless he could unseat him. My judging of him with the Bengals has nothing to do with system, position etc. If you watched him play...It is based on a 36 year old 11 year vet 3-4 OLB who doesn't have enough game speed to be a starter. Sorry..That's what it is based on.


    I was benching over 400 at 36 & in the best shape of my life. That didn't mean I could go out & still play ball like I was in college. Things catch up to you. His knees & back combined with his age & stiffness has put him in severe decline. It is a young mans game...And he is no longer a young man. That doesn't mean "36".



  5. #65
    Quote Originally Posted by JUST-PLAIN-NASTY View Post


    I am unless there is an injury. Williams, Spence (If he's back), Moats, Carter & Zumwalt will be you back-up unless H Jones pushes Carter off the roster. They have position flexibility now. You might look at the roster & say they are heavy inside but the flexibilty with Shazier, Moats, & Zumwalt makes them deep at ILB & OLB. Harrison is 36 & doesn't appear to have anything in the tank. Gurnateed contract for a non ST back-up...I would pass. If everyone is healthy...He doesn't get a helmet. It's a numbers game on this roster. If an injury happens...He will be on the street. No need to bring him here unless a NEED arises.
    I understand your point, but Worilds isn't the most durable guy. I think it is more likely than not that somebody other than Jason Worilds and Jarvis Jones get starts or significant snaps at OLB. If the choice came down to Harrison or Carter, I'd prefer it be Harrison. Even in a different scheme towards when he was on the downslope, Harrison had more sacks last year (2) than Carter has in his entire career (0). As for special teams, Jarvis Jones can stay on special teams, where he is quite good.

  6. #66
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    I'm just going to post this in summary to everything. We are talking about a Steeler GREAT 1 year removed from the organization. Does anyone in here really think with JJ & Worilds healthy...JH signed would come in here at 36 years old & take JJ or Worilds spot as a starter? The JH you saw play last year for the Bengals? The JH who may have turned into a 2 DOWN 3-4 OLB? That's the worst label you could get. He has NO flex anymore in his ankles, knees, or back to rush the QB. He is as stiff as a piece of steel. He can't man up in coverage. Guys...Putting on the Black & Gold #92 doesn't turn him back into Superman. I LOVE JH! But he wasn't JH in the last 3 must win games of 2012. He was at best an average athlete at LB last year for the Bengals. Father time has shown up.

    On the business side...Just think about it. 36 year old overtaking a 1st round pick & a 9 mil transition LB or a multi year LB. I'm going to leave it at that.


    I understand the love for JH. JJ & Worilds are your starters. If they are healthy...Hard to see JH back. The rest of the depth chart has to play ST. JH on the 53 week 1 is a guaranteed contract of about 1 mil. May not even get a helmet with JJ & Worilds healthy. He makes no business sense at that point. If someone goes down, I could see it. He could be the best option because he could come in & give you some snaps because he would know the system. That being said, he will be on the street if they need him.

    I won't discount signing him totally because of his relationship. I could see JH talking to the Rooneys & asking them to let him go through camp with an "understanding". If they feel they have better options at the end of preseason...JH will retire before the 53. I do believe this conversation would take place IF they sign him with everyone healthy. I also think this option will not exist until the pads go on & the Steelers see what they have in Latrobe.



  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by JUST-PLAIN-NASTY View Post
    Makes perfect sense. We aren't talking about a young player. We are talking about a 36 year old 11 year vet. There is nothing he could do to slow down what is happening to him.
    spot duty could definitely slow down what is happening if JH came back as a reserve and fills in when Worilds gets hurt (and he will get hurt, he always gets hurt) or if JJ still needs the 3 years all OLB need in our scheme.

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by phillyesq View Post
    I understand your point, but Worilds isn't the most durable guy. I think it is more likely than not that somebody other than Jason Worilds and Jarvis Jones get starts or significant snaps at OLB. If the choice came down to Harrison or Carter, I'd prefer it be Harrison. Even in a different scheme towards when he was on the downslope, Harrison had more sacks last year (2) than Carter has in his entire career (0). As for special teams, Jarvis Jones can stay on special teams, where he is quite good.



    That comment of "Worilds isn't the most durable guy" was a whole other conversation. But Worilds did play in the most games out of JH & Woodley the last two years they were all here together. Even if you take the last 4 years overall...Worilds played in 57 games...JH 55...Woodley 50. Only injury will keep Worilds or JJ from starting the season. Production could change that as the season goes but as a Steeler fan...Nobody should be routing for that scenario. I understand the dislike for Carter...But he is only 25 & came into the league at 22. He is in his make or break camp imo. As a backup, the 2012 JH did look better than the current version of Carter. However, I would have to see the 2014 JH at OLB against Carter & Moats before I say he is my choice. The biggest thing JH has working against him besides his age & decline is as the #3 or #4 OLB...You are going to have to play all STs. Carter & Moats can.



  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by feltdizz View Post
    spot duty could definitely slow down what is happening if JH came back as a reserve and fills in when Worilds gets hurt (and he will get hurt, he always gets hurt) or if JJ still needs the 3 years all OLB need in our scheme.
    Spot duty won't slow down what is happening to JH but spot duty could keep him productive through the season. I would have to see what JH, Carter, Moates, & whatever else is here on the field before I make a decision. The 2013 version of JH didn't look like he could hold anyone off. That doesn't mean he can't...But I'm not crowning him anything based on what I saw.



  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by JUST-PLAIN-NASTY View Post
    It is based on a 36 year old 11 year vet 3-4 OLB who doesn't have enough game speed to be a starter.
    No one is suggesting signing him to be a starter over Jones or Worilds. He'd be a veteran backup behind an inexperienced 2nd year player and an injury-prone who will be counted on to be a full-time starter for a full season for the first time in his career. You can get by with a veteran #3 OLB who doesn't play special teams (if he was the #5 OLB who didn't play special teams, that might be another story). There are plenty of other young LB's, DB's, WR's, RB's, etc. who can contribute on special teams. A guy who knows our system, who could be a positive influence on the young starters, and provide us with an insurance policy in case of injury? Sign me up. I'm not expecting the DMVP version of Deebo here. Just a guy who could offer more than the likes of Carter or Moats in our regular defense if needed in case of injury.

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