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Thread: The Draft

  1. #11
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    Casey Hampton started day 1. Kimo von Oelhoffen moved to DE as soon as Casey got here and stayed for 6 years. The more thinking you have to do at your position, the longer it takes to get on the field... which is why a guy like Shark was going to need a multi year window to be ready to play. A talented nose tackle can just go in and eat up blockers and push the pocket. One of the reasons I've been on Nix as the #1 is because I think he provides help at a position of need and makes the team immediately better. Any other guy we pick requires significant time to acclimate to the pro game, the system, develop a relationship with his quarterback, etc.

  2. #12
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    Colbert said the Steelers MAY be a little more active in FA than normal. I would bet they will look FS, CB, & NT. Injecting vets into DLs D makes the most sense to expedite the transition. That way you go into the draft...With "Wants" instead of "Needs".

    You target mid to upper UFA at FS. Maybe a Malcolm Jenkins. That may be the "Farrior-Hartings" type of signing they need to make. I think they have legitimate interest in Delmas if healthy but they also brought him in to scale their FA target at FS. Then possibly look at a young vet at NT. See what Terrance Cody or Cam Thomas would cost. Also look at a CB. Possibly a Nolan Carroll, Antione Cason, or Tracy Porter. Those are all types of "Steeler" FA. If they are going to let Hood & Wood test FA before they make any offer...They will have to do their own due diligence. Taylor may very well be cut. That's all on him. regardless if he takes that cut...Bring in a CB & draft one. Taylor won't be here after '14 IF he returns.

    For conversation...Let's say the Steelers sign Malcolm Jenkins, Can Thomas, & Antione Cason. Put whatever names you want in their but position of FS, NT, & CB. No doubt Jenkins starts...But all 3 capable starters who should compete. More importantly, you could get the 3 of them at a cap number for '14 in the 5-7 mil range.

    Jenkins is your CF FS. Troy can play near the LOS where he still can be disruptive. In Cover 2, Troy can play that LB role & take away LB drop zones. W Allen (If retained), Shark, Golden, or rookie FS will be your other S in sub. That takes the liability out of the back end. But remember...With a Cover 1 safety now...The Steelers could stay in base more than they did last year.

    "IF" Hood goes elsewhere & they retain Woods...Cam Thomas could start at NT & McClendon to DE. If they get Hood on the cheap & retain Woods...Thomas & McClendon battle it out at NT. They still draft a NT later. If at any point they feel Arnfelt, Williams, or a rookie can't provide them DE depth...Keisel is always on the streets.

    If they Steelers have to cut Taylor...Gay, Cason, Brown, & rookie battle it out for the other CB spot. If Taylor takes a paycut...Add his name to that competition. BUT...Seeing his fall off last year...Taylor won't be holding anyone off for the other spot. I would be surprised if he starts all 16 games.

    Now...look what this scenario has done for the Steelers. Going into the draft..The Steelers have ZERO NEEDS. A true BPA @ #15. They have some early "wants" but now the draft could thrust them forward. You want to get a CB & WR early. But you set yourself up to take a ILB, NT, or TE early if he is BPA. That's creates depth, that creates competition, that creates a championship team. Any kid you pick on defense if BPA doesn't have to be counted on to be a starter...But they could push & will start sooner rather than later because of who is in front of them. Any kid you pick on offense if BPA (WR/TE) will have a role as a rookie & make the offense better. They too will push the guys in front of them & will start sooner rather than later because of who is in front of them. To me...That's the way you get this turned around quickly.



  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by JUST-PLAIN-NASTY View Post
    Colbert said the Steelers MAY be a little more active in FA than normal. I would bet they will look FS, CB, & NT. Injecting vets into DLs D makes the most sense to expedite the transition. That way you go into the draft...With "Wants" instead of "Needs".

    You target mid to upper UFA at FS. Maybe a Malcolm Jenkins. That may be the "Farrior-Hartings" type of signing they need to make. I think they have legitimate interest in Delmas if healthy but they also brought him in to scale their FA target at FS. Then possibly look at a young vet at NT. See what Terrance Cody or Cam Thomas would cost. Also look at a CB. Possibly a Nolan Carroll, Antione Cason, or Tracy Porter. Those are all types of "Steeler" FA. If they are going to let Hood & Wood test FA before they make any offer...They will have to do their own due diligence. Taylor may very well be cut. That's all on him. regardless if he takes that cut...Bring in a CB & draft one. Taylor won't be here after '14 IF he returns.

    For conversation...Let's say the Steelers sign Malcolm Jenkins, Can Thomas, & Antione Cason. Put whatever names you want in their but position of FS, NT, & CB. No doubt Jenkins starts...But all 3 capable starters who should compete. More importantly, you could get the 3 of them at a cap number for '14 in the 5-7 mil range.

    Jenkins is your CF FS. Troy can play near the LOS where he still can be disruptive. In Cover 2, Troy can play that LB role & take away LB drop zones. W Allen (If retained), Shark, Golden, or rookie FS will be your other S in sub. That takes the liability out of the back end. But remember...With a Cover 1 safety now...The Steelers could stay in base more than they did last year.

    "IF" Hood goes elsewhere & they retain Woods...Cam Thomas could start at NT & McClendon to DE. If they get Hood on the cheap & retain Woods...Thomas & McClendon battle it out at NT. They still draft a NT later. If at any point they feel Arnfelt, Williams, or a rookie can't provide them DE depth...Keisel is always on the streets.

    If they Steelers have to cut Taylor...Gay, Cason, Brown, & rookie battle it out for the other CB spot. If Taylor takes a paycut...Add his name to that competition. BUT...Seeing his fall off last year...Taylor won't be holding anyone off for the other spot. I would be surprised if he starts all 16 games.

    Now...look what this scenario has done for the Steelers. Going into the draft..The Steelers have ZERO NEEDS. A true BPA @ #15. They have some early "wants" but now the draft could thrust them forward. You want to get a CB & WR early. But you set yourself up to take a ILB, NT, or TE early if he is BPA. That's creates depth, that creates competition, that creates a championship team. Any kid you pick on defense if BPA doesn't have to be counted on to be a starter...But they could push & will start sooner rather than later because of who is in front of them. Any kid you pick on offense if BPA (WR/TE) will have a role as a rookie & make the offense better. They too will push the guys in front of them & will start sooner rather than later because of who is in front of them. To me...That's the way you get this turned around quickly.
    I expect they'll be doing a lot in FA with the mid tier guys as well. I'd also add they should bring Foote back or find a FA ILB.

  4. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by JUST-PLAIN-NASTY View Post
    Colbert said the Steelers MAY be a little more active in FA than normal. I would bet they will look FS, CB, & NT. Injecting vets into DLs D makes the most sense to expedite the transition. That way you go into the draft...With "Wants" instead of "Needs".
    For as long as I can remember, the Steelers have always gone into the draft with at least one playable option at every starting position. It may be a guy who could use upgrading, but they typically are very good about ensuring that they only have wants, not needs.

    Cason is an interesting name. I've always thought of him as a Steelers type of DB. I'd bet that if the Steelers address any position through FA, it will be S and DL - either a NT or a DE. At corner, I think Ike takes a pay cut and they go into the season with Ike, Allen, Gay and a draft pick, with the pick a guy who can start in 2015 after working in sub packages this year.

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by B&GinNC View Post
    Casey Hampton started day 1. Kimo von Oelhoffen moved to DE as soon as Casey got here and stayed for 6 years. The more thinking you have to do at your position, the longer it takes to get on the field... which is why a guy like Shark was going to need a multi year window to be ready to play. A talented nose tackle can just go in and eat up blockers and push the pocket. One of the reasons I've been on Nix as the #1 is because I think he provides help at a position of need and makes the team immediately better. Any other guy we pick requires significant time to acclimate to the pro game, the system, develop a relationship with his quarterback, etc.



    Don't forget how that unfolded. Hampton had to take over week 7 for in ineffective Kendrick Clancy. Von Oelhoffen came here to play DE with Smith and started at DE with Clancy at nose. He didn't slide out when Hampton came here. He slide inside in '04 when Hampton went down for the year with his knee.

    Nix will still have a learning curve. If you watch the tape on him at ND, he still likes to be a penetrator in the run game. He would also have to unseat McClendon. Hood & Heyward didn't start right away but they had people in front of them. Even if they didn't...They weren't starter ready. If Nix ends up being BPA at #15...I'm sure they will consider. Right now, he isn't inside the Top 20 & weight, conditioning, & knee issues have to be answered. Add in the fact the NT played 30% of the defensive snaps last year...They better be 110% sure on him. Two new starters in the secondary probably pushes that 30% closer to 50% so that would make more sense then.

    The "Any other guy we pick requires significant time to acclimate to the pro game, the system," goes for any rookie...Regardless of side of the ball. Rookie years for Wallace (39/756 6 tds), Sanders (28/376 2 tds), & Brown (16/167-17 kr 1 td) gave contribution as 3rd & 6th rounders. The last 2 1st rd WR / TE picks of Holmes & Miller pitched in 88/1,283 8 tds combined their rookie years. That's contribution. If I go back to 2000 (5 picks), rookie defensive 1st round picks started 17 of 78 games their rookie years. 8 of them were JJ this year. If I do the same for offensive 1st round picks (8 picks), they started 75 of 96 games. Not in those numbers are the 12 games Decastro missd in the beginning of the year or the 13 games Mendy missed after his injury. That would have been 25 more starts making that number 100 out of 121 games. I think the evidence is overwhelming that offensive guys see the field sooner & contribute which is contrary to your "significant time to acclimate to the pro game" claim.



  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by phillyesq View Post
    For as long as I can remember, the Steelers have always gone into the draft with at least one playable option at every starting position. It may be a guy who could use upgrading, but they typically are very good about ensuring that they only have wants, not needs.

    Cason is an interesting name. I've always thought of him as a Steelers type of DB. I'd bet that if the Steelers address any position through FA, it will be S and DL - either a NT or a DE. At corner, I think Ike takes a pay cut and they go into the season with Ike, Allen, Gay and a draft pick, with the pick a guy who can start in 2015 after working in sub packages this year.


    Exactly. It is almost certain they have to do somethig in FA to ensure that happens. I think Taylor takes a substantial cut to stay. If he doesn't...I think they have to bring in a FA CB when they cut him. But I don't believe the Steelers are confident he can be penciled in to start all next year. His decline was abrupt. I think they will draft one early but I don't think they can be comfortable with the possiblity of Gay & that rookie being pushed to start. In the big picture...If there is an injury to Allen...Two of Taylor, Gay, Brown, or a rookie will have to start. That would mean Brown or the rookie would be the nickel. Maybe you see where the concern is. If Taylor goes down one of Gay, Brown, or a rookie will have to start but that still puts Brown or the rookie at nickel. Being that Brown looks like he is on his way out...That all spells depth problems.



  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eddie Spaghetti View Post
    look on the bright side

    the back up back up QB spot is covered, so we won't have to spend a pick there again this year
    say it again....

    we didn't hear you the first 200 times.

  8. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by feltdizz View Post
    say it again....

    we didn't hear you the first 200 times.
    kinda like your dick lebeau shtick

    so original

  9. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by JUST-PLAIN-NASTY View Post


    Exactly. It is almost certain they have to do somethig in FA to ensure that happens. I think Taylor takes a substantial cut to stay. If he doesn't...I think they have to bring in a FA CB when they cut him. But I don't believe the Steelers are confident he can be penciled in to start all next year. His decline was abrupt. I think they will draft one early but I don't think they can be comfortable with the possiblity of Gay & that rookie being pushed to start. In the big picture...If there is an injury to Allen...Two of Taylor, Gay, Brown, or a rookie will have to start. That would mean Brown or the rookie would be the nickel. Maybe you see where the concern is. If Taylor goes down one of Gay, Brown, or a rookie will have to start but that still puts Brown or the rookie at nickel. Being that Brown looks like he is on his way out...That all spells depth problems.
    I understand the depth issues at CB. If I was the Steelers, I would try to extend Cortez Allen this year to ensure that he is locked up beyond this year, and giving the Steelers at least Allen and Gay under contract in 2015. I'd also grab a guy to groom as Ike's replacement. Not necessarily a high pick - I could see grabbing another Ike Taylor/Cortez Allen type guy in the 4th.

    I'm assuming the Ike takes a big pay cut and stays. I can't see the Steelers signing a starter-level FA (like Cason) if Taylor returns. I think that they'd draft a guy to improve depth, but I don't think they'd sign a starter level player and bring both Gay and Allen off the bench.

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eddie Spaghetti View Post
    kinda like your dick lebeau shtick

    so original
    relax francine... it was a joke.

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