The Good that no one is talking about....

[Shawn]

And a front 7 would make Lebeau look like a genius again

It's time for everyone to make the best tasting chicken salad out of the foulest chicken sh!t that they can. It's all a mess. And Haley is as big a problem as any. Look at his formations and predictable play calling. With a line as bad as we have, why would anyone in their right mind trot out a jumbo package with Cotchery as the WR? That's begging for 10/11 in the box against a line that can't block.

The situational football is predictable. I think Haley moved the pocket for the first time this season last night. There's so much he could be doing to help Ben out that he isn't. If the line can't block, why not incorporate more 3 step drops? Why keep Ben a sitting target all the time? Why use Johnson/Paulson ever? Why have Adams running routes as a TE?

Haley's putting Ben in position to take hits and make mistakes at an alarming rate. This is exactly what he was hired to prevent. Considering he's not doing what he was hired to do, I don't have a problem with moving on from him. Seriously, every player/coach on this team is indefensible right now.

Apples and oranges. Lebeau has Timmons, Keisel, Woodley, Jones, Heyward. I mean how much more talent along the front 7 do you need? If you can't get it done with those guys...hang em up.

[ramblinjim]

I've noticed over the years, that when this team gets down to the Patriots in the 4th quarter they fold. When Ben got picked off and the guy ran the ball back to our thirty, I looked at my wife and said "they score a touchdown in three plays or less" sure enough. Guy goes up the middle, has four people hanging on him and they couldn't get him down. There was a game a few years back against the Patriots that the same thing happened. I was shell shocked watching them give up at the end. At 41-34 I thought "hmmmmmmmmmmmmm.........." that lasted one play.

[flippy]

Apples and oranges. Lebeau has Timmons, Keisel, Woodley, Jones, Heyward. I mean how much more talent along the front 7 do you need? If you can't get it done with those guys...hang em up.

Timmons and Woodley have been erratic. Keisel is to DEs what Larry Foote is to ILBs and I mean that as a compliment. Jones has been demoted. And Heyward's just getting started, but is a relative unknown.

If we had talent in the front 7, we wouldn't have to commit Troy to the box, we'd make tackles, we'd get pressure, and we'd get turnovers.

You could make the same argument for Haley. He's had Pouncey/Velasco, DD, Adams, Gilbert, and Miller blocking for Ben. Out of the 6 OLinemen/TE, 3 are first rounders, 2 are second rounders. And he's got a top pick in the back field to carry the ball.

We have loads of should be talented players on both sides of the ball and no one is performing.

[Shoe]

Apples and oranges. Lebeau has Timmons, Keisel, Woodley, Jones, Heyward. I mean how much more talent along the front 7 do you need? If you can't get it done with those guys...hang em up.

What talent? Keisel is solid, but he's not/never been a game-changing player (e.g. 0 Pro Bowls). Heyward has one good game in 2 plus years, and we're calling him a talent? Woodley had four sacks last year, five the year before that. (BTW, he was going against a back-up RT for the Pats* yesterday. Zero sacks, zero pressures as far as I can remember.) Jarvis Jones is only a rookie, so you can't expect much. The only one you could consider "talent" is Timmons, who consistently shows his inconsistency from game-to-game.

[steelz09]

The good is that a lot of people finally see that Tomlin isn't a good coach, Lebeau's time has passed and our high dollar vets need to go.

[SS Laser]

I am not sure 09. I think the high dollar vets need to take a pay cut and play better. Who will replace the over priced vets? Who replaces Ike and Troy? The replacements for Harrison and big snack are not playing any better then old vets at this point. There are young guys and guys drafted high not playing to there draft position on both sides of the ball. Is Ben really losing it or pressing to much? To many turn overs for him. This team is a mess as a team. I only hope the young players can step it up very soon and have a very good draft.

[Shawn]

Chicken or egg guys. Much of the D we are currently giving up 55 points with are the guys who took us to a SB. How much of this is other teams just know how to break LeBeau's system in half now? He had a very good run...many years of domination. But, he is trying to beat 2000 teams with a 1990's D.

[thor75]

IMO though the OL coach and OL scouts should be banned from the facility. Something is seriously wrong with this unit.

Kugler had the same results. I'm just not sure where to point the finger. OL coach has changed, OC has changed. Still the same bad oline.

[NorthCoast]

We're 25th in scoring O with 19 ppg. We're 23rd in D giving up 26 ppg. Both units suck. Why does one have to take the blame and not the other?

We essentially need a top 5 D to hold opponents to less than our O scores. We'd only need a top 10 O to score more than our D gives up. Everything is a mess and it's one great big negative feedback loop. Ben turns the ball over like crazy which hurts the D. And the D doesn't get any turnovers making it harder on the O.

And we've become overly down on 2 of the best players in the history of the game who are struggling in this mess in Ben and Troy. Ben's pressing always playing from behind and taking chances he shouldn't. Troy is guessing like a madman trying to make something happen on his side. And their play is amplifying everything bad about this team.

Sometimes a turd is just a turd. I don't think we need to make excuses to justify bad play all around. It's ok to say Ben sucks. It's ok to say Troy sucks. It's ok to say Haley sucks. It's ok to say Lebeau sucks. Everything sucks - lol.

Why defend the defense? Because just last season they were 5th in scoring defense. Surely that is a good defense at its most basic level. Maybe the wheels can come off quickly, but they can also return just as quick if the right moves are made.

[Vader]

Chicken or egg guys. Much of the D we are currently giving up 55 points with are the guys who took us to a SB. How much of this is other teams just know how to break LeBeau's system in half now? He had a very good run...many years of domination. But, he is trying to beat 2000 teams with a 1990's D.

Heyward- 0 SB
McClendon- 0 SB
Allen- 0 SB
Jones- 0 SB
Worilds- 0 SB
Thomas- 0 SB
Williams- 0 SB

Yea, exactly the same team that took us to the SB...