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Thread: I thought this day would never come

  1. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by Ernie View Post
    It's amazing to me how far this country has fallen away from it's founding principles...
    even to the extent that the "Tea Party" gets blamed by many as the reason why the country is in the shape it's in. I'm just glad that you folks are still in the minority for the time being.
    The problem is that people think they know what the founding principles of the country are...and it turns out, they are wrong...

    Actually, what is happening is, unfortunately, human nature...

    There was a study recently performed regarding the root cause of the intense political polarization that we have to deal with in this country...

    I'll do my best to find a link, but, to paraphrase, it studied the psychological and sociological effects of an intense crisis on a country.

    To boil it down, two things happen after a crisis:

    1) In the short term, everyone comes together and supports each other.

    2) In the long term, after the initial feelings wear off, sides tend not only to drift back to their respective ideologies, but to drift even further on whatever side they fell...the right leans further right and the left leans further left...

    Once that happens, people who have views that exist closer to the center find it impossible to function...

    For example, Steve LaTourette was a nine-term congressional representative and a Republican. He was well-liked in his district and could have been re-elected for many more terms...his personal approval rating within his district was almost always favorable, even when Congressional approval was low...

    He retired. LaTourette existed to the right of the center...but not far enough to suit many of his Congressional colleagues. He was a guy who would, when necessary, reach "across the aisle" in order to accomplish things for the good of the country. Being part of the most ineffective Congress in history wore on him. Seeing a Congress unable to overcome rampant polarization in order to accomplish anything meaningful was too much.

    Obama's views exist closer to the center than many Republicans care to admit. He has been called "The Most Liberal President"...and while that is a nice Fox News soundbite, it isn't true. He was elected not because he was the most liberal. He appealed to the middle of both sides. He hasn't changed. Unfortunately, everything around him has.

  2. #52
    Okay it's the law. Well guess what there are a ton of other laws on the books as well that don't get enforced such as immigration. The Libs won't enforce those because they need the minority votes. I love this country. I served 12 years of my life in the military 8 of which were spent in the teams. I now still work for my country by enforcing it's laws but only the ones that they chose for me to. So yes I have better idea of how our government works that most.

  3. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by SanAntonioSteelerFan View Post
    I'm confused, help me out here. I thought the basic problem was that there was too much government dependency. Is it only bad when *other* people get government "help"?
    My response was poorly stated...I should have said, "Too bad your government seems to be working against you."

    My job has been cut from full-time to part-time, and the biggest reason is Obamacare. My employer couldn't afford to pay for the insurance mandated by the ACA. Lots of others have, or will have, similar stories.
    Last edited by BradshawsHairdresser; 10-11-2013 at 10:22 AM.

  4. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Big J View Post
    Okay it's the law. Well guess what there are a ton of other laws on the books as well that don't get enforced such as immigration. The Libs won't enforce those because they need the minority votes. I love this country. I served 12 years of my life in the military 8 of which were spent in the teams. I now still work for my country by enforcing it's laws but only the ones that they chose for me to. So yes I have better idea of how our government works that most.
    No.. you are wrong, so wrong on this. Thank you for your service but you are all over the place and using the term "Lib" is a glaring sign that you have been listening to those hacks on TV and on the radio.


    None of are laws are enforced 100% of the time and thank goodness for that.... imagine if every cop stopped cars going 1 mile over the speed limit or handcuffed every jaywalker or citizen who spit on the sidewalk? That isn't realistic at all.

  5. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ernie View Post
    I'll take big business over big government any day dizz...
    The ratio of CEO to worker pay has increased 1000% percent since 1950. I know some like to say "work harder if you want to make what a CEO makes but CEO's aren't working 1,000 times harder than the average employee.

    This is the main reason our country is failing but people defend big business because they have been duped into thinking one day they will have a chance to reach that level.

    These same big businesses ship jobs overseas... use every tax loop they can find.. and use corporate welfare anytime things go sour. It's capitalism when there's a profit and socialism when they have a loss.

    ..and don't get me started on deregulation, get govt out of the way some say.. well, name one industry in America that did the right thing when they went unchecked? Cereal companies, telephone companies, energy companies, cable, banks.. every one of them shafted us when they went unchecked.

  6. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by Big J View Post
    Okay it's the law. Well guess what there are a ton of other laws on the books as well that don't get enforced such as immigration. The Libs won't enforce those because they need the minority votes. I love this country. I served 12 years of my life in the military 8 of which were spent in the teams. I now still work for my country by enforcing it's laws but only the ones that they chose for me to. So yes I have better idea of how our government works that most.
    Fair enough.

    But, your job is being held hostage because a relative few dislike this law. A law that passed every Constitutional test. Those people do not care about you or your service. They don't care about your ability to feed your family. This shutdown was planned months in advance. You being furloughed was calculated in the board room of a conservative think tank. Your paycheck and the paychecks of hundreds of thousands of other people were deemed acceptable losses.

    That is beyond messed up.

  7. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slapstick View Post
    Fair enough.

    But, your job is being held hostage because a relative few dislike this law. A law that passed every Constitutional test. Those people do not care about you or your service. They don't care about your ability to feed your family. This shutdown was planned months in advance. You being furloughed was calculated in the board room of a conservative think tank. Your paycheck and the paychecks of hundreds of thousands of other people were deemed acceptable losses.

    That is beyond messed up.
    "I'm very excited we are shutting down" -Michelle Bachmann

  8. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by feltdizz View Post
    The ratio of CEO to worker pay has increased 1000% percent since 1950. I know some like to say "work harder if you want to make what a CEO makes but CEO's aren't working 1,000 times harder than the average employee.

    This is the main reason our country is failing but people defend big business because they have been duped into thinking one day they will have a chance to reach that level.

    These same big businesses ship jobs overseas... use every tax loop they can find.. and use corporate welfare anytime things go sour. It's capitalism when there's a profit and socialism when they have a loss.

    ..and don't get me started on deregulation, get govt out of the way some say.. well, name one industry in America that did the right thing when they went unchecked? Cereal companies, telephone companies, energy companies, cable, banks.. every one of them shafted us when they went unchecked.
    Not disagreeing with you on most of your points... however, when a govt goes "Unchecked" as you put it... and makes decisions based on Ideology and "Buying the vote"... you have an unsustainable, socialist system that is on the verge of collapse... with the debt clock ticking at over 17 trillion bucks..

  9. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slapstick View Post
    The problem is that people think they know what the founding principles of the country are...and it turns out, they are wrong...

    Actually, what is happening is, unfortunately, human nature...

    There was a study recently performed regarding the root cause of the intense political polarization that we have to deal with in this country...

    I'll do my best to find a link, but, to paraphrase, it studied the psychological and sociological effects of an intense crisis on a country.

    To boil it down, two things happen after a crisis:

    1) In the short term, everyone comes together and supports each other.

    2) In the long term, after the initial feelings wear off, sides tend not only to drift back to their respective ideologies, but to drift even further on whatever side they fell...the right leans further right and the left leans further left...

    Once that happens, people who have views that exist closer to the center find it impossible to function...

    For example, Steve LaTourette was a nine-term congressional representative and a Republican. He was well-liked in his district and could have been re-elected for many more terms...his personal approval rating within his district was almost always favorable, even when Congressional approval was low...

    He retired. LaTourette existed to the right of the center...but not far enough to suit many of his Congressional colleagues. He was a guy who would, when necessary, reach "across the aisle" in order to accomplish things for the good of the country. Being part of the most ineffective Congress in history wore on him. Seeing a Congress unable to overcome rampant polarization in order to accomplish anything meaningful was too much.

    Obama's views exist closer to the center than many Republicans care to admit. He has been called "The Most Liberal President"...and while that is a nice Fox News soundbite, it isn't true. He was elected not because he was the most liberal. He appealed to the middle of both sides. He hasn't changed. Unfortunately, everything around him has.
    Slap...this seems like an educated response... I'd have to ask though where (under this president) #1 occurred? We saw it as campaign rhetoric prior to Obama's first term. Haven't seen it since though.

  10. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by feltdizz View Post
    The Tea Party isn't responsible for the country being the way it is but they are responsible for this shut down.

    ..and what shape is the country in? Honestly.. things could be better but they could be much worse. If we scaled back our military budget we would be fine. Sure there is waste in places and we could always scale other programs back but they are minimal when you look at our military budget. I have a hard time understanding how Healthcare is the beast in the room. What type of nation are we if treating our own is viewed as a negative?

    17 trillion in debt big guy (and closer to 100 trillion if you count unfunded liabilities)..and you are going to say that the govt waste is minimal (other than military spending)?

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