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Thread: It starts with the 10yd cushion...

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by feltdizz View Post
    nah.. Skyhawk is right... our D is soft and inept EVERY time we need a key stop. It's been going on for years.

    3rd and throw out any number larger than 6 in must stop situation.. we fail every time.

    This D puts up solid "stats" but teams have figured us out. Take the most average QB in the league and we make them look GOOD.
    Show me a defense that makes key stops year in and year out. I believe people's expectations in regard to "key stops" may be a bit unrealistic.

    The defense made stops vs the Vikings. The problem is that they gave up to many uncharacteristic big plays. The Vikings offense converted 4/11 3rd downs. Cincy converted 7/17 3rd downs, Tenn converted 6/15 third downs, Bears converted 5/15 third downs. The Steelers defense was 4th in the league in 3rd down conversion percentage at 35.44% in 2012. Denver was number one in 2012 at 31.33%. The defense didn't fail every time. Perception isn't always reality.

    The number one goal of a defense is to limit point production. Turnovers, sack, and everything else can't be counted on to win games. If the defense can limit the opposition from scoring points then the team will always have a chance to win. The Steelers won games based on that philosophy for years.

    Games don't boil down to what teams have or haven't figured out. Games boil down to execution.

  2. #22
    Pro Bowler skyhawk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BURGH86STEEL View Post
    Show me a defense that makes key stops year in and year out. I believe people's expectations in regard to "key stops" may be a bit unrealistic.

    The defense made stops vs the Vikings. The problem is that they gave up to many uncharacteristic big plays. The Vikings offense converted 4/11 3rd downs. Cincy converted 7/17 3rd downs, Tenn converted 6/15 third downs, Bears converted 5/15 third downs. The Steelers defense was 4th in the league in 3rd down conversion percentage at 35.44% in 2012. Denver was number one in 2012 at 31.33%. The defense didn't fail every time. Perception isn't always reality.

    The number one goal of a defense is to limit point production. Turnovers, sack, and everything else can't be counted on to win games. If the defense can limit the opposition from scoring points then the team will always have a chance to win. The Steelers won games based on that philosophy for years.

    Games don't boil down to what teams have or haven't figured out. Games boil down to execution.
    Yes, they can. It's a team game. Just ask the Seahawks, time and time again, including this weekend. Ask the Steelers in 2008 and 2010 - time and time again the D does it's part. Not for the past three years they haven't.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by skyhawk View Post
    Yes, they can. It's a team game. Just ask the Seahawks, time and time again, including this weekend. Ask the Steelers in 2008 and 2010 - time and time again the D does it's part. Not for the past three years they haven't.
    Turnovers or sacks can't be counted on to win games because teams don't know when or if they will occur in a game.

    What gives a team a better chance to win is if the offense takes care of the football. The bigger issue is that this team hasn't taken care of the football last season or this season. The defense created turnovers last season. The offense gave the ball away near the end of games last season.

    The defense caused fumbles and had opportunities for INT's this season. For whatever reasons, the defense didn't finish on the opportunities they had. I don't know of any defense that could keep pace with the way the offense gave the ball away up to this point of the season (almost 3 turnovers per game). The offense didn't score many TD's off the turnovers the defense created last season. Do you believe the offense would had scored TD's off of turnovers this season? I don't.

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    Quote Originally Posted by pittpete View Post
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    Change his name to Dick lecushion.

  6. #26
    Pro Bowler skyhawk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BURGH86STEEL View Post
    Turnovers or sacks can't be counted on to win games because teams don't know when or if they will occur in a game.

    What gives a team a better chance to win is if the offense takes care of the football. The bigger issue is that this team hasn't taken care of the football last season or this season. The defense created turnovers last season. The offense gave the ball away near the end of games last season.

    The defense caused fumbles and had opportunities for INT's this season. For whatever reasons, the defense didn't finish on the opportunities they had. I don't know of any defense that could keep pace with the way the offense gave the ball away up to this point of the season (almost 3 turnovers per game). The offense didn't score many TD's off the turnovers the defense created last season. Do you believe the offense would had scored TD's off of turnovers this season? I don't.
    Yes, I do.

    However, one can't argue the fact that the O turns it over too much. It's a perfect storm of a not so good team. Turning the ball over and inability to create turnovers. Hence their -12 (or so)TO differential last year, like the worst in 30 years.

    Neither unit is playing good football. And no accountability in sight - especially on the defensive side.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by BURGH86STEEL View Post
    Show me a defense that makes key stops year in and year out. I believe people's expectations in regard to "key stops" may be a bit unrealistic.

    The defense made stops vs the Vikings. The problem is that they gave up to many uncharacteristic big plays. The Vikings offense converted 4/11 3rd downs. Cincy converted 7/17 3rd downs, Tenn converted 6/15 third downs, Bears converted 5/15 third downs. The Steelers defense was 4th in the league in 3rd down conversion percentage at 35.44% in 2012. Denver was number one in 2012 at 31.33%. The defense didn't fail every time. Perception isn't always reality.

    The number one goal of a defense is to limit point production. Turnovers, sack, and everything else can't be counted on to win games. If the defense can limit the opposition from scoring points then the team will always have a chance to win. The Steelers won games based on that philosophy for years.

    Games don't boil down to what teams have or haven't figured out. Games boil down to execution.
    That doesn't make sense... a 10 yard cushion on 3rd and 3 rarely stops a pass play for a 1st down. There is no "execution" to stop a first down with that defense.

    I keep hearing "execution" but if you are executing a bad game plan it doesn't matter. Not double teaming Allen when it's clear he is abusing Adams... that's not poor execution.. that's a lack of FIGURING OUT that Adams can't handle Allen and you have to make adjustments.

    ..and why can't Turnovers, sacks and everything else be counted on to win games? It's the reason we are losing games!!! The teams we play and EVERY other team in the league is counting on their D to gets sacks and TO's but we shouldn't count on it because it would hurt DL's feelings? I'm sorry but I really have a hard time with this philosophy.

    The O definitely has it's problems but this D is keeping pace as well... it would be nice to get 1 freaking TO by our D. Not sure why that is asking for too much in today's NFL but this is what happens when your best DB can't catch and your Safety is being used as a 5th LB.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by feltdizz View Post
    ..and why can't Turnovers, sacks and everything else be counted on to win games? It's the reason we are losing games!!! The teams we play and EVERY other team in the league is counting on their D to gets sacks and TO's but we shouldn't count on it because it would hurt DL's feelings? I'm sorry but I really have a hard time with this philosophy.
    Because when you don't get them, like the Steelers haven't, you lose...

    You can scheme to create turnovers, but it's not as reliable as playing sound defense...stripping at the ball instead of tackling the player works wonderfully if successful, but ends up giving up extra yards when not successful...

    Relying on turnovers is a gamble...when you win, you look like a genius...when you don't, you look like a fool...

    The idea that LeBeau is not coaching these guy to make plays on the ball is simply ridiculous...he's not coaching them to miss tackles either, but look what happened...

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slapstick View Post
    Because when you don't get them, like the Steelers haven't, you lose...

    You can scheme to create turnovers, but it's not as reliable as playing sound defense...stripping at the ball instead of tackling the player works wonderfully if successful, but ends up giving up extra yards when not successful...

    Relying on turnovers is a gamble...when you win, you look like a genius...when you don't, you look like a fool...

    The idea that LeBeau is not coaching these guy to make plays on the ball is simply ridiculous...he's not coaching them to miss tackles either, but look what happened...
    The D's job is to go get the ball.. always has been and always will be.

    Sound D creates opportunities to create TO's... and since we aren't doing it we aren't getting TO's.

    Fumble on 1 isn't sound D... but better blitz packages, swarming the guy with the ball and stripping it, hard legal hits that dislodge the ball.. all those things help create TO's.

    We aren't attacking, we are reacting and this is why the D isn't getting TO's.

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