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Thread: The Delusional Optimists Post Game Break Down

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by papillon View Post
    I'm going with frustration and an off night combination. He had to be wondering what was going on after the first three plays of the game. A third and 8 draw play after two failed running attempts, ole Todd caught them off guard with that call.

    Pappy
    I think there might be something to that. If he is busy wondering "what the hell play did he call this time", his head is not into executing the called play. Based on how he has done, it could very well be that Ben does not fully sanction the preferred playlist, therefore he doesn't have that emotional component when he executes.
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  2. #22
    Hall of Famer Dee Dub's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by feltdizz View Post
    .....
    Wallace... sure we miss him, the guy was a beast at stretching the field. However, do you remember how Mike looked in our offense last year? It wasn't that special. We have bigger problems and it has nothing to do with talent. I thought Wheaton had decent speed. Is it really that hard to put him on the field for some go routes? Is it really that hard to put Moyer on the field on a few more plays if we are going to run fades?
    64 receptions and 8 TD's in a dink and dunk offense is a lot better than what they will get out of Brown or Sanders.
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  3. #23
    Hall of Famer Dee Dub's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oviedo View Post
    Signing Wallace would had been a waste because the OL doesn't provide enough time fo him to get open deep. Letting Wallace go was the right decision given that our cap is so totally screwed up it will take 2-3 years to fix it.
    They had enough time to throw it deep to Brown and Sanders a few times last night. But those two can't get separation.

    I think many Steelers fans forget how many slants and bubble screens Wallace caught and turned into big plays.
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  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by GradyFusionCrash View Post
    They made Wallace a fair offer. He basically hit the market over $2 million dollars.

    I don't get what they see in Manny. Never have.
    Gotta agree with that one

  5. #25
    Pro Bowler D Rock's Avatar
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    I think Wallace was great at what he did. He was a great WR in the Arians offense. Unfortunately, the Steelers have committed to this Todd Haley style offense, and that means that any player with explosion in their game is now useless.

    Wallace was not worth anything near what he got. Especially not to the Steelers running this offense.




    I have also never seen Ben that 'off' that I can remember. His throws weren't even remotely catchable last night. Ben is also great, but we need to accept the fact that he isn't very good at playing within any true 'system' and that he is a huge liability to get hurt. If there is a chance to take a top QB in an upcoming draft (1st round QB that is), I sure as heck hope they do it and trade Ben while he still has some value. I absolutely do NOT want to see the Steelers re-sign Ben for the type of absurd money that QBs are getting these days. Too many other holes - it will sink the team for the next 4 to 6 years if they give Ben big money.

  6. #26
    Pro Bowler D Rock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GradyFusionCrash View Post
    Then bench him now. Keep him healthy and send him on his way. NO point in playing him.

    Ben plays well in systems. But what they did, because Dick LeBeau is infallable, is take the minute amount of improvising Ben did and took it away from him.

    Sheer brilliance!
    I would love to see improvisational Ben Roethlisberger back and on top of his game. It aint gonna happen this year though- the team has made their conservative offense bed and now must lay in it. That leaves Ben at 32 years old, and making 17+ million against the cap for the next two years. And then probably 20+ million per after that. Not worth it, not for an older QB who plays and has played the way Ben has.

    the Roethlisberger era was a great one in Pittsburgh, but I fear it has come to an end. Might as well get what we can out of it and start fresh if the opportunity presents itself.

  7. #27
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    Chadman wades in..

    The Good:

    1. The OL. Yes, the OL. Go back & watch them. They were against the 2nd best D in the NFL & gave Ben all sorts of time in the backfield to throw the ball. Both Gilbert & Adams contained the outside rush & Valasco looks above average. Would like to see him play LG next season. That said, the run blocking is in need of work. But Chadman does not blame all the running woes on the OL, it's a shared responsibility- the RB's need to know what holes to hit too.

    2. The Defense. Despite the Offenses struggles in 2 weeks, the D has put this team in winnable positions for the most part of the 2 games. There's a nice mix of young guys getting gametime.

    3. Jarvis Jones. Being slightly more individualist, Chadman wants to point out that Jones looks like he belongs. He's a swim move & a club move away from multiple sack seasons. If he can disengage from the LT just a little quicker, QB's will learn to fear him soon.

    4. Cam Heyward. He's coming along this season, closing the pocket when playing. He needs more gametime.

    5. Ike Taylor. Just Ike. His play on AJ Green was excellent.

    6. Vince Williams. Got caught out a couple of times (shared blame- we'll get to that in a bit), but played aggressively & showed some desire. He could make that spot his.

    7. Felix Jones. He's the speed RB this team needs. If we could get him the ball in space...



    The Bad:

    1. The WR's. Chadman knows that some posters on here don't like Chadman's take on Wallace vs Brown. This isn't Wallace vs Brown. This is the lack of a go-to WR. Ben needs an AJ Green. Before the game started we heard the often trotted out comment that AJ Green, even when covered, is open. We've heard that for Randy Moss, Jerry Rice, Brandon Marshall, Colston, Terrell Owens, etc, etc. You don't hear it for ANY of the current Steelers, and that's because when they are covered, well...they are covered. Brown, Sanders, Cotchery... none of these guys are 'throw it to them regardless of the coverage' guys. They are not Hines Ward. They are not Plaxico Burress. What we get, as a result, is Ben running around, buying time, trying to help these guys break open. And as we know, that means Ben gets sacked. The Steelers lose ground. They go backwards. First order of business next season- get a go-to WR. Heath's return might help.

    2. The RB's (not named Felix Jones). They hit the hole slowly, they are indecisive & can't find the running lanes. Other than that...they have poor conditioning & handling. LeVeon Bell has a lot of weight on his shoulders.

    3. Steve McLendon. Chadman doesn't see it. He can't figure out the love for this guy. He's supposed to be a great line penetrator, but so far Cam Heyward has looked far more dangerous. He gets moved, pushed, redirected away from the RB's. Every hole that Bernard or Green-Ellis hit yesterday was where McLendon was moved out of. He can't hold the gap. He's not a 3-4 NT. His inability to hold the line means that Timmons & now Vince Williams are getting caught in the trash around the blocking. Fangupo or Woods would be better options right now.

    4. Ramon Foster- this is nit picking, but he's a terrible pulling OG. He runs to where he's supposed to be & plays tippy tappy with whoever is around the hole. Go blow someone up Foster. Next season, Velasco should be signed to play LG. Foster would be a good back-up option.

    5. Jerricho Cotchery. Yeah, we've brought up the WR's already, but Cotch needs his own line. Dropped passes & short arms all day. This team needs it leaders to STAND UP. Cotchery apparently is valuable for his 'verteran leadership', yet of all the culprits, he was the worst. There were 3-4 plays left on the field that Cotch could have made. That's 3-4 more 1st downs. More field position. More time with the ball.


    The Undecided:

    Coaching & Scouting. Who is to blame for this? All of them? Or do you just target one or two culprits? The team, the squad, needs a more defined direction to move in. They don't have the players to match the system they want to play, or they don't have the system to match the players they have- you choose your own version of it. Either the team needs to change the system, or the team needs to change the players. More direction required.
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  8. #28
    Some terrific insights Chadman. I will say though I seen McClendon get terrific penetration against Tenn. I wholeheartedly agree with the Heyward assessment. He is going to be a force.

  9. #29
    Legend papillon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by D Rock View Post
    I would love to see improvisational Ben Roethlisberger back and on top of his game. It aint gonna happen this year though- the team has made their conservative offense bed and now must lay in it. That leaves Ben at 32 years old, and making 17+ million against the cap for the next two years. And then probably 20+ million per after that. Not worth it, not for an older QB who plays and has played the way Ben has.

    the Roethlisberger era was a great one in Pittsburgh, but I fear it has come to an end. Might as well get what we can out of it and start fresh if the opportunity presents itself.
    Personally, at this point in his career Ben should change plays if he doesn't like what was sent in by Haley. Ben has more cache on this team than Haley and if the Steeler management takes issue with that, then, unfortunately, I have to agree with Crash and let Ben finish his career elsewhere.

    A perfect example was the 3rd and 8 draw in the first series, Ben should heard that play and thought to himself, who's on the field and what play can I call to gain 8 F**king yards, screw Haley.

    I have never scrutinized play calling for the Steelers, ever, regardless of who was OC until now, Haley is as egotistical as he is inept and the sooner he is removed the better this team will be. He probably believes he is beyond reproach because of his father.

    Pappy


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  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by papillon View Post
    Haley is as egotistical as he is inept and the sooner he is removed the better this team will be. He probably believes he is beyond reproach because of his father.
    The sad part about it is we're on the tail end of a window with Ben at QB and BLOWING IT!! When you have a super bowl quality QB, you take advantage while you have it - we all know how long it took to get another one. 4-5 years tops with this guy... I'd like to see 2 more trips to the SB with him...

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