Page 3 of 4 FirstFirst 1234 LastLast
Results 21 to 30 of 33

Thread: Noll players that Bill received.

  1. #21
    Pro Bowler Steelhere10's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    man from Sudan
    Posts
    1,653
    Quote Originally Posted by flippy View Post
    Not sure this makes your case.

    Cowher left a much better team. Ben, Heath, Hines, Santonio, Faneca, Smith, Starks, Casey, Aaron, Brett, Hokie, Porter, Harrison, Farrior, Foote, Troy, Clark, Ike, FWP

    In fact, Tomlin quickly won a SuperBowl with the key holdovers and put together one of the best defensive performances in NFL history with these leftovers.

    Steelers history in its entirety reminds us that QB + Defense = Championships. Noll had it in the 70s. Cowher had it at the end of his career. Tomlin had it at the beginning of his tenure. But Noll did not hand off this formula to Cowher.
    Smith , Porter and Aaron combined probably played 10 games total. Is this the same Foote that the Lions didn't want. Or the same Starks that haven't been resigned twice that plays a prestine position but yet no other team sign. Ok

  2. #22
    Pro Bowler Steelhere10's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    man from Sudan
    Posts
    1,653
    Or Faneca who was pissed that his buddy didn't get the job then jetted after one season.

  3. #23
    Administrator steelz09's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Charleston, SC
    Posts
    3,365
    How many SB's did Cowher win with Noll's players? 0

    How many SB's did Tomlin win with Cowher's players? 1

    ^^^ I don't think this is because Cowher is the inferior coach. I think it's that Cowher left a better team than Noll. Cowher built an excellent team over the years. His biggest flaw? The QB position. If Cowher invested in a QB, he has multiple championships. Cowher left Tomlin with a Hall of Famer Defensive Coordinator, a top tier defense, a Hall of Fame potential WR and likely a Hall of Fame QB.

    Until Tomlin proves otherwise, I will question his ability to develop talent. I don't know how much is Tomlin's fault and how much is Colbert's fault. I think there is plenty of blame to go around between the 2.

    I know the 2, in combination have been less than stellar. I know that our talent level has been decreasing, not increasing. I know that we were atop the Ravens in the division and now we are 3rd in the division. I know that I previously could look at the Steelers and say, this team is top 5 or top 10 in talent. This year, I'd question if we are even in the top 15. I cannot remember the last time we went into the draft will this many ? marks at various positions.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Slapstick View Post
    He could, but that hasn't been determined...

    As for Harrison, if it had been up to Cowher, he would never have played...
    In any event, I'm just saying that while Cowher inherited some good and great players from Noll, Tomlin also inherited some good and great players from Cowher.

  5. #25
    Pro Bowler Steelhere10's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    man from Sudan
    Posts
    1,653
    Quote Originally Posted by steelz09 View Post
    How many SB's did Cowher win with Noll's players? 0

    How many SB's did Tomlin win with Cowher's players? 1

    Until Tomlin proves otherwise, I will question his ability to develop talent. I don't know how much is Tomlin's fault and how much is Colbert's fault. I think there is plenty of blame to go around between the 2.

    I know the 2, in combination have been less than stellar. I know that our talent level has been decreasing, not increasing. I know that we were atop the Ravens in the division and now we are 3rd in the division. I know that I previously could look at the Steelers and say, this team is top 5 or top 10 in talent. This year, I'd question if we are even in the top 15. I cannot remember the last time we went into the draft will this many ? marks at various positions.
    Because it took him 15 years to win one. easy answer.

  6. #26
    Administrator steelz09's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Charleston, SC
    Posts
    3,365
    Quote Originally Posted by Steelhere10 View Post
    Because it took him 15 years to win one. easy answer.
    I edited my post to provide a bit of clarifications but your reply was to quick... maybe because it was a short one.

  7. #27
    Legend
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Inside Your Head
    Posts
    10,368
    Quote Originally Posted by Steelhere10 View Post
    Smith , Porter and Aaron combined probably played 10 games total. Is this the same Foote that the Lions didn't want. Or the same Starks that haven't been resigned twice that plays a prestine position but yet no other team sign. Ok
    That clearly made your case.

    How bout we look at it this way. The team at the end of the Cowher era and beginning of Tomlin era won 2 SuperBowls. The team Noll had and passed to Cowher hadn't won a SuperBowl in a decade and still didn't a decade later.

    This whole argument boils down to Ben and Defense.

    And if you insist Cowher got the better team than Noll, the fact that the Steelers won 2 recent SuperBowls means you must also be arguing that Ben, Troy, Harrison are significantly better players than any one from the 90s teams because they were able to carry the team to 2 SuperBowls despite the subpar talent. ie. they're way more talented football players than guys in the HOF that couldn't carry their loaded team to a championship.

    And even moreso, Troy and James were so talented, they were able to catapult this team into one of the best statistically in the history of the game in an offensive era in the NFL. ie. guys like Woodson and Lake couldn't compare to these 2 talent wise because Woodson and Lake were surrounded by superior talent in a defensive era yet couldn't help make their defense the best ever.

    Maybe you are right? I dunno. But if you're right on this one, then your rightness probably supports Ben, Troy, and James being the best Steelers of all time by a long shot.

    And if you think we had little talented handed over from Cowher then, you must think we have almost no talent now. So it could be very interesting to see if this team can compete? I think it just needs a healthy Troy and Ben. Heck maybe even just one of them.

  8. #28
    Pro Bowler Steelhere10's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    man from Sudan
    Posts
    1,653
    Both teams were handed over great talent, and that's reason that I created this thread because people allways argue that Tomlin took over Bill players. but imo Coweher took over better talent by far, and I wanted to put this argument to rest that's all.

  9. #29
    Legend
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    13,173
    Quote Originally Posted by phillyesq View Post
    I don't understand why you have to be a "Tomlin hater" to question the first round picks in his era.

    So Noll left Cowher a bunch of very good players. Cowher then left Tomlin a group that was a year removed from a SB. He also left a franchise QB who was not being paid like a franchise QB at the time.

    The Steelers happened to struggle last year, the same year as Farrior, Smith and Ward left the roster. Tomlin, for the second time in his career, found a team in a downward spiral and responded with empty cliches. Will the Steelers bounce back again next year, or keep unleashing hell?
    I'm sure that Tomlin could "ham it up" on the sideline so he gets the cameras on him at least a dozen time a game.

    I never had a problem with the "unleash hell" comment. Tomlin was trying to set a tone. It was the players on the field that failed. What did you want Tomlin to say "we'll try harder?"
    Playing Fantasy Football does not qualify you to be the in the front office or on the coaching staff of the Pittsburgh Steelers. They are professionals and you are not!

  10. #30
    Legend
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    13,173
    Quote Originally Posted by Steelhere10 View Post
    Both teams were handed over great talent, and that's reason that I created this thread because people allways argue that Tomlin took over Bill players. but imo Coweher took over better talent by far, and I wanted to put this argument to rest that's all.
    You are right in your conjecture. What many miss is that Tomlin inherited an Off Line that was on a downward spiral and a couple of misses effected the teams for several years.
    Playing Fantasy Football does not qualify you to be the in the front office or on the coaching staff of the Pittsburgh Steelers. They are professionals and you are not!

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •