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Thread: Do not be fooled! Jarvis Jones is elite.

  1. #21
    Hall of Famer Dee Dub's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JUST-PLAIN-NASTY View Post
    AND if trend continues he will be 25-26 before he starts. A 1st rounder for a kid who will play ST unless there is an injury...I'm not taking him at 17.

    I know you are high on him Dub but after his workout and what we heard about him...I went back to the tape. There is speed lag now that you look for it. He didn't work out well in LB drills. With his health concerns and how he struggles at the point of attack against the run...He doesn't scream "Steeler 1st rounder" to me. They were talking about Jones on NFL Network last night because Brandt dropped him out of the first too just like Moore after his poor workouts. Its funny that "some" people in here kick Moore in the gut down the road after what he did but Jones doesn't get the same treatment.

    There just really isn't a day 1 OLB we could get at #17. I know Jones played 3-4 OLB but he didn't play 3-4 Steelers OLB. He was in attack mode 90% of the time & when he did drop it was to a zone. After looking at them all hard, the one with the most UPSIDE that could fit what the Steelers like is Mingo. Mingo has to get stronger and he won't see the field his rookie year unless there is an injury. You look at Jordan, Ansah, & Werner. Can they play 3-4 OLB? I think they could but it won't be day 1 for the Steelers. The problem with them is they look so good with their hand in the dirt a 4-3 team will jump all over them because they are a day 1 plug & play at that spot. Their value is much higher on their board than the Steelers.

    I'm not saying this to get the Jones camp stirred up. It is MY opionion based on what the Steelers do. When I put my GM hat on and look internally I look at that position as a need but not as a 1st. If the questions were answered about Worilds it would be easier know what direction. If Woodley & Worilds give you double digit sacks in 2013 & you draft Jones...You really might have wasted a 1st round pick. They will select a OLB in rounds 2-4 IMO, so if Worilds doesn't produce or Woodley doesn't get back to form...You have something to work with. It is a certainty that they need 1 or 2 safeties for 2014. They also need a WR, TE, RB now. They may decide to address ILB like Spence isn't here. They made their investment to replace Harrison...Time to get a return on that investment. There is no RB worthy of a 1st round pick. I truely feel that a pick in the 1st at WR, S, TE, & ILB all help the Steelers sooner than later over OLB. Some as fast as Day 1 or mid season. If I'm wrong...I will say I am wrong. That just won't happen until the card is turned in.
    Sorry JPN, 24.5 tackles for loss, and 14.5 sacks in the SEC does not translate to "speed lag." Some players just play quicker than they run a straight line. Jarvis Jones may run a straight line like a turtle but he plays like a beast who is very quick.
    Steelers 2014 Draft

    1-Darqueze Dennard CB Michigan State
    2-Jordan Matthews WR Vanderbilt
    3-Jordan Tripp ILB/OLB Montana
    4-Christian Jones ILB Florida State
    5-Brent Urban DE Virginia
    5-Michael Schofield OG/OT Michigan
    6-Kadeem Edwards OG Tennessee State
    6-Ben Gardner DE Stanford
    7-Aaron Colvin CB Oklahoma

  2. #22
    Hall of Famer Dee Dub's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oviedo View Post
    If we get that performance and don't have LeBeau putting him on ice for two years I agree. Still not my first choice for #17 (prefer Eifert, Ansah, Patterson or Jordan) but a solid pick.
    Yeah that makes sense?? Use a 1st round pick on a position (TE), where the Steelers already have one of the leagues best, or a player (Dion Jordan), who runs fast and works out great yet his performance on the field was less than half of what Jones did who played in a much better conference.

    Twice as many tackles, more than twice as many tackles for loss, nearly three times as many sacks, more than twice as many FF's, twice as many INT's, and twice as many PD's.

    Makes no sense unless you are hung up on what a guys does in shorts.
    Steelers 2014 Draft

    1-Darqueze Dennard CB Michigan State
    2-Jordan Matthews WR Vanderbilt
    3-Jordan Tripp ILB/OLB Montana
    4-Christian Jones ILB Florida State
    5-Brent Urban DE Virginia
    5-Michael Schofield OG/OT Michigan
    6-Kadeem Edwards OG Tennessee State
    6-Ben Gardner DE Stanford
    7-Aaron Colvin CB Oklahoma

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigRob View Post
    Moore and Jones both have work ethic problems. Don't want either one of them at 17. More money isn't going to give them better work ethics. Money just makes you more of what you are.

    Call me crazy, but I'm taking Tank Carradine at 17. He is a top 10 pick any other year. He's going to sit for a year in Lebeau's system even if he was healthy.

    Take him at 17 and get a stud for years to come.

    http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/nfl...ank-carradine/
    I agree...I'm not taking Jones or Moore at @17. I'm not taking any OLB in this draft at @17.



  4. #24
    Hall of Famer Dee Dub's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigRob View Post
    Moore and Jones both have work ethic problems. Don't want either one of them at 17. More money isn't going to give them better work ethics. Money just makes you more of what you are.

    Call me crazy, but I'm taking Tank Carradine at 17. He is a top 10 pick any other year. He's going to sit for a year in Lebeau's system even if he was healthy.

    Take him at 17 and get a stud for years to come.

    http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/nfl...ank-carradine/
    When is this not an issue? When it doesnt translate to what a player does on the field. Who cares if a guy has a poor work ethic if he is dominating on the field?

    Think about this, Jones was told by USC they did not want to take the risk on him. What does he do? He goes out and dominates at Georgia. Sounds like a very motivated player to me. That and what he did on the field trumps the "claims" of having a poor work ethic.

    I have a feeling if Jones drops in the draft some team is going to get a very angry/motivated player who will want to prove himself again.
    Steelers 2014 Draft

    1-Darqueze Dennard CB Michigan State
    2-Jordan Matthews WR Vanderbilt
    3-Jordan Tripp ILB/OLB Montana
    4-Christian Jones ILB Florida State
    5-Brent Urban DE Virginia
    5-Michael Schofield OG/OT Michigan
    6-Kadeem Edwards OG Tennessee State
    6-Ben Gardner DE Stanford
    7-Aaron Colvin CB Oklahoma

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by papillon View Post
    Has anyone mentioned that Tyler Eiffert is available in the draft this year? I hear he's a pretty good tight end.

    Pappy
    never heard of him...

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dee Dub View Post
    Sorry JPN, 24.5 tackles for loss, and 14.5 sacks in the SEC does not translate to "speed lag." Some players just play quicker than they run a straight line. Jarvis Jones may run a straight line like a turtle but he plays like a beast who is very quick.
    Watch again...You will see it. I watched so much that I came to another conclusion....Jones isn't even the best player on that defense.

    Stats don't dictate the athlete...You will see below. You were one who pushed Moore down on his workouts. Jones lays an egg and you sing a different song. Jones doesn't move laterally good either. He put up lineman cone times and look bad in LB drills.

    Jones 85 TT 24.5 TFL & 14.5 Sacks. You want to throw stats? Moore 85TT 21 TFL & 12.5 Sacks ALSO in SEC. Guess what? Jones was a 23 year old. Too bad he couldn't stay another year...He could try for 20 sacks. Moore was only 20 with those stats. When Jones was a 20 year old freshman at USC he got 13 TT & 1.5 TFL in 8 games.

    Since you like the stats, the last four years in NCAA sacks leaders were Mercilius (Drafted 26) 55 TT/22.5 TFL/16 SK, Bowers (Drafted 51) 66 TT/25 TFL/15 SK, Miller (Drafted 2)48 TT/21.5 TFL/16.5 SK, & Hughes (Drafted 31) 52 TT/ 19.5 TFL/ 15 SK. Rookie year in NFL? Mercilius 16G/4S - 6 sacks. Bowers 16G/6S - 1.5 sacks. Miller 15G/15S - 11.5 sacks. Hughes 12G/0S - 0 sacks.


    Only Miller made an impact his rookie year.


    There are players who put up as you say "Beast" numbers long before Jones and didn't do anything in the NFL their rookie year. There is no reason to believe he has any better chance than the rest in that line.



  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dee Dub View Post
    Yeah that makes sense?? Use a 1st round pick on a position (TE), where the Steelers already have one of the leagues best, or a player (Dion Jordan), who runs fast and works out great yet his performance on the field was less than half of what Jones did who played in a much better conference.

    Twice as many tackles, more than twice as many tackles for loss, nearly three times as many sacks, more than twice as many FF's, twice as many INT's, and twice as many PD's.

    Makes no sense unless you are hung up on what a guys does in shorts.
    You mean our 30 year old TE coming off a major kneee injury who may not be able to play at the beginning of 2013. Yeah, why draft a TE who could play significant minutes starting early his rookie year.

    Let's get LeBeau another toy he can put on the shelf for a couple of years before he opens the box and plays with it. Makes so much sense (sarcasm in extreme amounts).
    Playing Fantasy Football does not qualify you to be the in the front office or on the coaching staff of the Pittsburgh Steelers. They are professionals and you are not!

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by JUST-PLAIN-NASTY View Post
    I'm not taking any OLB in this draft at @17.
    Yes. Why draft someone who won't play.
    Playing Fantasy Football does not qualify you to be the in the front office or on the coaching staff of the Pittsburgh Steelers. They are professionals and you are not!

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dee Dub View Post
    Yeah that makes sense?? Use a 1st round pick on a position (TE), where the Steelers already have one of the leagues best, or a player (Dion Jordan), who runs fast and works out great yet his performance on the field was less than half of what Jones did who played in a much better conference.

    Twice as many tackles, more than twice as many tackles for loss, nearly three times as many sacks, more than twice as many FF's, twice as many INT's, and twice as many PD's.

    Makes no sense unless you are hung up on what a guys does in shorts.
    I wouldn't take Eifert or Jones at #17. I would trade back....And if Eifert & Jones were both there...I would take Eifert before Jones. This team needs to replace offensive production and ROOKIEs can contribute. The Steelers won't have Miller out of the gates and don't have a threat at TE to match him. Miller will be 31 coming off knee injury...Makes perfect sense.
    Last edited by JUST-PLAIN-NASTY; 04-04-2013 at 03:01 PM.



  10. #30
    Legend RuthlessBurgher's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oviedo View Post
    Yes. Why draft someone who won't play.
    Why draft any defensive players at all if they never play?

    Just draft a QB, a WR, a RB, a FB, a TE, an OT, and OG, and an OC with our 8 picks.

    Sarcasm in extreme amounts.

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