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Thread: Should the Steelers build their future now, and bite the bullet in 2013?

  1. #11
    Legend papillon's Avatar
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    Lets look at this from a different perspective before we say that some vets are overpaid. Lets view this form the standpoint that the Steelers are not up against the cap. What team would you want to put on the field? The one with Polamalu, Harrison, Wallace and Mendenhall or the one with Golden (or rookie), Worilds, Brown and Dwyer? We all know the answer to that, so in that case, the vets aren't overpaid for their services they are clearly the best option and are still at or near the top in the NFL at their position.

    If Harrison and Polamalu weren't making splash plays in the last quarter of the season and ended the season healthy I would say, okay, fine, release them and move on, but the defense was playing really good football late in the year and both Harrison and Polamalu were making plays we expect from them and they went into the off season healthy, they are still top 5 at their position in the NFL, IMO.

    Unfortunately, the cap is an issue, but one thing is for sure the salary cap is going to increase next year, so, is there a way to retain the vets and insert SOME youth for 2013 and then complete the transition in 2014 and be competitive both years while making the generational switch? That, is the question the Steelers are probably trying to answer right now. The Steelers don't normally overhaul the team in one year, which is what would be happening if too many vets are cut or released.

    If I were to take a guess right now I would think the Steelers are trying to find a way to field a team that can compete every year without the veteran blood letting that we all seem to think is coming. Its almost a certainty that if a lot of the vets are cut and not resigned the team will be looking at a top 10 draft pick in 2014, just my opinion.

    Pappy


    1.15) Ryan Shazier - ILB/OLB
    2.46) Stephon Tuitt - DE
    3.97) Dri Archer - RB
    4.118 ) Martavis Bryant - WR
    5.157) Shaquille Richardson - CB
    6.173) Wesley Johnson - OT
    6.192) Jordan Zumwalt - ILB
    7.215) Daniel McCullers - DT
    7.230) Rob Blanchflower - TE

    "Before you can win a game, you have to not lose it." -- Chuck Noll

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by papillon View Post
    Lets look at this from a different perspective before we say that some vets are overpaid. Lets view this form the standpoint that the Steelers are not up against the cap. What team would you want to put on the field? The one with Polamalu, Harrison, Wallace and Mendenhall or the one with Golden (or rookie), Worilds, Brown and Dwyer? We all know the answer to that, so in that case, the vets aren't overpaid for their services they are clearly the best option and are still at or near the top in the NFL at their position.

    If Harrison and Polamalu weren't making splash plays in the last quarter of the season and ended the season healthy I would say, okay, fine, release them and move on, but the defense was playing really good football late in the year and both Harrison and Polamalu were making plays we expect from them and they went into the off season healthy, they are still top 5 at their position in the NFL, IMO.

    Unfortunately, the cap is an issue, but one thing is for sure the salary cap is going to increase next year, so, is there a way to retain the vets and insert SOME youth for 2013 and then complete the transition in 2014 and be competitive both years while making the generational switch? That, is the question the Steelers are probably trying to answer right now. The Steelers don't normally overhaul the team in one year, which is what would be happening if too many vets are cut or released.

    If I were to take a guess right now I would think the Steelers are trying to find a way to field a team that can compete every year without the veteran blood letting that we all seem to think is coming. Its almost a certainty that if a lot of the vets are cut and not resigned the team will be looking at a top 10 draft pick in 2014, just my opinion.

    Pappy
    You answer your own question because the Salary Cap makes all the difference in the world. It is what is driving this. The unfortunate part of this is that we have a one year problem because the new TV money in 2014 would allow us to keep some of these guys. Unfortunately we are out of sync by one year.
    Playing Fantasy Football does not qualify you to be the in the front office or on the coaching staff of the Pittsburgh Steelers. They are professionals and you are not!

  3. #13
    Legend papillon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oviedo View Post
    You answer your own question because the Salary Cap makes all the difference in the world. It is what is driving this. The unfortunate part of this is that we have a one year problem because the new TV money in 2014 would allow us to keep some of these guys. Unfortunately we are out of sync by one year.
    My only point is that we're talking about jettisoning players based on lack of performance and my point is, all things being equal, those 4 players performance is still at a level that would help win a lot of games if there was a way to retain them. I realize the reality is the cap is going to prevent the Steelers form doing just that with these players or at least the majority of them.

    Polamalu and Harrison do not deserve pay cuts for their performance in my estimation. they are still two of the very best defenders in the game.

    Pappy


    1.15) Ryan Shazier - ILB/OLB
    2.46) Stephon Tuitt - DE
    3.97) Dri Archer - RB
    4.118 ) Martavis Bryant - WR
    5.157) Shaquille Richardson - CB
    6.173) Wesley Johnson - OT
    6.192) Jordan Zumwalt - ILB
    7.215) Daniel McCullers - DT
    7.230) Rob Blanchflower - TE

    "Before you can win a game, you have to not lose it." -- Chuck Noll

  4. #14
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    My Opinion....

    You won't get an argument from me on Wallace. I would also like to see Mendy back on a 1 year in the zone blocking scheme. Polamalu if healthy may be in decline but he still is an asset...If healthy. Harrison isn't Harrison and never will be. He didn't do anything down the stretch that was Harrison'ish. The stat sheet doesn't reflect his play on the field. He has taken significant steps back and he will be another year older. Harrison is a "vet min" player at this point in his career. The only reason Steeler fans can't see it is they want to pay him for what he did in the past and not what he could do now.

    I would take Polamalu, (Worilds, Carter, Robinson, Rookie), Wallace, and Mendenhall over Polamalu, Harrison, Wallace and Mendenhall OR Golden (or rookie), Worilds, Brown and Dwyer in 2013. Many reasons why...To simplify...It is time.

    We haven't seen an overhaul of the roster because starters have been in place since Cowher left. Tomlin inherited them but time has passed. There were still 11 starters from Cowhers last year still in place.... 16 in 2011. The changing of the guard has to take place. Having that stability over the years doesn't mean it doesn't happen...It just means it hasn't happened yet.

    The way the NFL is right now and what we saw out of the Steelers in 2012....Shedding the vets isn't a difference of SB contender and a Top 10 pick. It is more like a 9-7 & 7-9. If 9-7 & 3rd in the North gets you in the playoffs...Than you could say a playoff team versus a non playoff team. A 1 & done or a 1-1 playoff team. If you remove health & coaching from the equation...The things that could improve the 9-7 in 2013 is the young guys in place stepping in at a high level and/or a major contribution from the draft class. The things that could improve the Steelers beyond 2013 is the same. Keeping all the 30+ declining vets with big salaries could hinder this in 2013 & beyond. They will need to pick & choose wisely who they retain.


    I would restructure/extend BB, Woodley, Timmons, & Miller.
    I would go to Polamalu & Taylor about taking a pay cut. If they decline, I wouldn't restructure or cut them. They will be gone after 2013.
    I would tell Colon he has to take a pay cut or be released.
    Release Harrison.
    Tender RFA.
    Do not sign any URFA over 30 before draft.
    Lock up Lewis.
    If Wallace is still on market make him an offer.
    If Mendy is unsigned, make him a 1 year offer.

    Chopping Block to get the Lewis, Wallace, & Mendy deals done (8.4 mil):
    1. Ryan Clark
    2. Brett Keisel
    3. Jerricho Cothchery
    4. Shuan Suisham

    Draft

    Fill in where needed with our URFA that remain.



  5. #15
    Hall of Famer Mister Pittsburgh's Avatar
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    Be a good year to go young and start fresh as Baltimore is going to have to do much the same.

    Personally I would gut the defense, switch to the 4-3 Tampa 2, and go young.
    @_Hellgrammite

  6. #16
    I agree with the thoughts about a larger turnover. But, as long as Ben is healthy we will be competitive...we will have a shot at a SB. Were the Ravens that much better than a healthy Steeler team this year? I think not.

  7. #17
    Legend papillon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shawn View Post
    I agree with the thoughts about a larger turnover. But, as long as Ben is healthy we will be competitive...we will have a shot at a SB. Were the Ravens that much better than a healthy Steeler team this year? I think not.
    The offense has proven that they can't and don't outscore anyone. Without a defense that is giving up fewer than 24 points a game Ben and the offense won't be able to overcome the defense in my opinion. The offense under Ben has never been consistently good enough (save for three playoff games in 2005) to outscore and opponent, more than likely they will have stretches without making a first down or miss opportunities to score than they are to consistently make plays and move the football.

    Ben is a great quarterback, but he isn't the machine that Brees, Rogers, Manning (Peyton) and Brady are when it comes to offense. He makes great plays, but doesn't necessarily make a lot of good plays consecutively and that's what the other guys do. They make a lot of average to good plays consecutively to keep drives alive and scoring chances at a maximum; Ben will make plays, but gets impatient at times and has a greater chance of having a misfire or a sack or some other event that causes drives to stall.

    Ben needs a defense a little more than the others, IMO.

    Pappy


    1.15) Ryan Shazier - ILB/OLB
    2.46) Stephon Tuitt - DE
    3.97) Dri Archer - RB
    4.118 ) Martavis Bryant - WR
    5.157) Shaquille Richardson - CB
    6.173) Wesley Johnson - OT
    6.192) Jordan Zumwalt - ILB
    7.215) Daniel McCullers - DT
    7.230) Rob Blanchflower - TE

    "Before you can win a game, you have to not lose it." -- Chuck Noll

  8. #18
    Legend RuthlessBurgher's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by papillon View Post
    The Steelers don't normally overhaul the team in one year, which is what would be happening if too many vets are cut or released.
    Well, the overhaul started a year ago when we said goodbye to the likes of Hines Ward, James Farrior, Aaron Smith, and Chris Hoke.

  9. #19
    Pro Bowler supersteeler's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by papillon View Post
    The offense has proven that they can't and don't outscore anyone. Without a defense that is giving up fewer than 24 points a game Ben and the offense won't be able to overcome the defense in my opinion. The offense under Ben has never been consistently good enough (save for three playoff games in 2005) to outscore and opponent, more than likely they will have stretches without making a first down or miss opportunities to score than they are to consistently make plays and move the football.

    Ben is a great quarterback, but he isn't the machine that Brees, Rogers, Manning (Peyton) and Brady are when it comes to offense. He makes great plays, but doesn't necessarily make a lot of good plays consecutively and that's what the other guys do. They make a lot of average to good plays consecutively to keep drives alive and scoring chances at a maximum; Ben will make plays, but gets impatient at times and has a greater chance of having a misfire or a sack or some other event that causes drives to stall.

    Ben needs a defense a little more than the others, IMO.


    Pappy

    Spot on Pappy. This offense never wowed anyone for years, we need to finally fix the real problem, the offense. Our defense bailed them out as long as I can remember, it's time the offense return the favor.

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Pittsburgh View Post
    Be a good year to go young and start fresh as Baltimore is going to have to do much the same.

    Personally I would gut the defense, switch to the 4-3 Tampa 2, and go young.
    Yes to this. It would ease the transition of the young players because they would play familiar positions. Won't hapen though as long as "Gramps" is in charge because "not invented here."
    Playing Fantasy Football does not qualify you to be the in the front office or on the coaching staff of the Pittsburgh Steelers. They are professionals and you are not!

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