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Thread: Ed: Steelers Swung, Missed on OLBs in First Round

  1. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by NW Steeler View Post
    I think most of us would agree that not bringing back Starks is insane.
    Seemingly all of us but the FO.

  2. #12
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    I don't think Starks will be back because I believe he will get a nice offer somewhere else that the Steelers won't match. This is a huge offseason for Gilbert and Adams and I would expect to see both improved come July. We have to remember these kids are still pretty young and developing. Tomlin always says the biggest offseason for players is the one between year 1 and 2. For Gilbert it's pretty much offseason two because of the lockout. I expect our starting OL to be.

    LT: Adams/Gilbert
    LG: Colon
    C: Pouncey
    RG: DeCastro
    RT: Adams/Gilbert
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  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oviedo View Post
    Maybe they haven't been successful because the required 2 year conversion process is too high risk? Not surprising that Cole was a success. Wasn't he a 4-3 OLB drafted to play 4-3 OLB. What a radical idea that was!

    According to one NFL scout this week, in any given draft there are perhaps only 1 or 2 "can't miss" 3-4 OLBs. It's already been announced that a number of teams are switching to the 3-4 next season. The scout said that there simply isn't enough 3-4 OLB talent emerging from the college ranks. Thus teams using a 3-4 are forced to take DEs and move them. He went on to say that this process of moving from DE to OLB "automatically makes the pick a risk" and can longer be considered a 'can't miss'. The best chance a team has to minimize the risk in switching is a period of learning. He went on to say that picking a conversion project only makes sense for later rounds, not the first or second.
    Given where the Steelers have had to draft, it should not be surprising they have 'missed' on some of these picks.

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by NorthCoast View Post
    According to one NFL scout this week, in any given draft there are perhaps only 1 or 2 "can't miss" 3-4 OLBs. It's already been announced that a number of teams are switching to the 3-4 next season. The scout said that there simply isn't enough 3-4 OLB talent emerging from the college ranks. Thus teams using a 3-4 are forced to take DEs and move them. He went on to say that this process of moving from DE to OLB "automatically makes the pick a risk" and can longer be considered a 'can't miss'. The best chance a team has to minimize the risk in switching is a period of learning. He went on to say that picking a conversion project only makes sense for later rounds, not the first or second.
    Given where the Steelers have had to draft, it should not be surprising they have 'missed' on some of these picks.
    You capture the essence of why I have been arguing that we need to consider movingback to the 4-3. The talent pool we almost exclusively fished in ten years ago is too crowded with too many teams looking for the same types of players. There is no longer a margin of error with these "conversion projects." because we can't get as many as we use too. We can be far more successful getting players to come in and play the positions they have always played and more importnatly that they have been scouted playing than hoping a reeducation and retraining program has worked in a couple of years.
    Playing Fantasy Football does not qualify you to be the in the front office or on the coaching staff of the Pittsburgh Steelers. They are professionals and you are not!

  5. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Oviedo View Post
    You capture the essence of why I have been arguing that we need to consider movingback to the 4-3. The talent pool we almost exclusively fished in ten years ago is too crowded with too many teams looking for the same types of players. There is no longer a margin of error with these "conversion projects." because we can't get as many as we use too. We can be far more successful getting players to come in and play the positions they have always played and more importnatly that they have been scouted playing than hoping a reeducation and retraining program has worked in a couple of years.
    The funny thing is, there are people who watch the NFL who seem to think that there are more 3-4 type players available in the draft than there are 4-3 type players...mostly due to the proliferation of spead and read-option offenses in the college ranks...

    The fact is that the best defenses in the NFL use the scheme that best fit the players...while the 49ers and the Ravens use 3-4 variations, the Seahawks and the Bears used 4-3 variations...

    While you may disagree with LeBeau's philosophy, I trust that he will use the scheme that best fits the player on his roster, whether that is the 3-4 or the 4-3...

    Running a 4-3 wouldn't have made James Harrison, Troy Polamalu or LaMarr Woodley any healthier this past season...schemes can help prevent scoring and keep yardage totals low, but playmakers need to be healthy to make splash plays, regardless of scheme...

  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oviedo View Post
    You capture the essence of why I have been arguing that we need to consider movingback to the 4-3. The talent pool we almost exclusively fished in ten years ago is too crowded with too many teams looking for the same types of players. There is no longer a margin of error with these "conversion projects." because we can't get as many as we use too. We can be far more successful getting players to come in and play the positions they have always played and more importnatly that they have been scouted playing than hoping a reeducation and retraining program has worked in a couple of years.
    Probably half the teams in the league run the 4-3 and half run the 3-4. It might be more difficult to find pass rushers for the 4-3 then it is to find pass rushers that fit the 3-4 defense. Regardless of the scheme, they will faces the same issues getting premium pass rushers for whatever defense they decide to employ. Teams that run the 3-4 have more flexibility defending the pass and getting to the QB over teams that run the 4-3. Unless the Steelers can get their hands on a couple of dominant edge pass rushers I don't see them converting to the 4-3 defense.

  7. #17
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    Just a possibility we all are jumping to conclusions on Starks, that if he leaves we're in trouble. We don't know how Gilbert will play or Adams when they compete for that LT spot.
    Did any of us see those two play there yet for several games? Yeah, they may not be that good early on but with playing time I would like to think they will get better and who knows, we may end up not regretting Starks leaving.
    It would be nice to keep Max but they are going to another direction with the young guys thats why they were drafted, Starks knows his days are numbered he even said it.



    The key for that line is staying healthy, then you get some continuity and most likely better O-line play. We have Beachum in the mix too and they still might sign Legs. Legursky can backup both Beachum if he gets the LG spot and Pouncey so he has some value and I thought he plays center decent.

    These young guys are trying to get a foothold here and build their position to where they can excel I think they will be hungry for that opportunity and the focus strong.
    Last edited by supersteeler; 01-26-2013 at 07:59 PM.

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by supersteeler View Post
    Just a possibility we all are jumping to conclusions on Starks, that if he leaves we're in trouble. We don't know how Gilbert will play or Adams when they compete for that LT spot.
    Did any of us see those two play there yet for several games? Yeah, they may not be that good early on but with playing time I would like to think they will get better and who knows, we may end up not regretting Starks leaving.
    It would be nice to keep Max but they are going to another direction with the young guys thats why they were drafted, Starks knows his days are numbered he even said it.



    The key for that line is staying healthy, then you get some continuity and most likely better O-line play. We have Beachum in the mix too and they still might sign Legs. Legursky can backup both Beachum if he gets the LG spot and Pouncey so he has some value and I thought he plays center decent.

    These young guys are trying to get a foothold here and build their position to where they can excel I think they will be hungry for that opportunity and the focus strong.
    ....thread hijacker....

  9. #19
    Pro Bowler supersteeler's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NorthCoast View Post
    ....thread hijacker....
    Really?
    Quote Originally Posted by NW Steeler View Post
    I think most of us would agree that not bringing back Starks is insane.
    I was responding to your statement about starks, so where do you get thread hijacker?

  10. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by BURGH86STEEL View Post
    Probably half the teams in the league run the 4-3 and half run the 3-4. It might be more difficult to find pass rushers for the 4-3 then it is to find pass rushers that fit the 3-4 defense. Regardless of the scheme, they will faces the same issues getting premium pass rushers for whatever defense they decide to employ. Teams that run the 3-4 have more flexibility defending the pass and getting to the QB over teams that run the 4-3. Unless the Steelers can get their hands on a couple of dominant edge pass rushers I don't see them converting to the 4-3 defense.
    Salaries bear out that 4-3 DEs are more rare than 3-4 OLBs. I believe that the franchise tag for DEs is higher than any position other than QB; it is certainly higher than the tag for linebackers.

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