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Thread: Give a choice, I'd take Russell Wilson over Ben right now.

  1. #71
    Quote Originally Posted by papillon View Post
    And, every year at this time there can only be 4 QBs playing, so some good quarterbacks aren't going to be in the playoffs that doesn't make them bad quarterbacks. Your view of the flavor of the day quarterback is naive and that of a fledgling fan of any sport. When something new arises it can look like a world beater because it hadn't been run with any permanence. Cam Newton was all the rage last year, this year, not so much, he'll have to change the way he plays to get back to the success he had his rookie campaign. The Wildcat was all the rage a few years back, DCs got the film out, studied and put a halt to that "flavor of the year", this year the athletic quarterback with passing skills enters the league and the college read option comes in vogue. The tape is out there now on the read option, if you believe that NFL DEs (43 defense) and OLBs (34 defense) are going to be fooled by the read option permanently you haven't been watching the NFL closely enough.

    Ben had an outstanding year save for two lousy stinkin rotten plays and you act as if he's forgotten how to play football. I can't change your perception of Ben nor do I want to, you'll continue to espouse how Luck, RGII, Newton (probably), Wilson and Kaepernick are better than Ben and they may be some day, but none of them are right now.

    Brees is home, Rogers played poorly, Manning (Peyton) made one stinkin rotten play in a game in which they were favored by close to double digits, Manning (Eli) couldn't get his team in the playoffs, Rivers is at home, Romo is at home after the Steelers gift wrapped their season for them he still managed to miss the playoffs, the list goes on and on.

    Persoanlly, I can't wait to see how good defenses play against Wilson, Kaepernick, Luck and RGIII next year. They won't have the luxury of being the new kid on the block, there will be expectations, lets see if they can live up to them.

    I'm certain Ben will have his 3800 - 4200 yards, 26 - 28 TDs, 6 - 8 INTs, because he's proven it over many years. I"m not certain that any of these guys will reach the heights they did this year. I hope they do, it will be good for the NFL, but I won't be surprised if they don't.

    And, by the way, the only narrow minded thinking in this thread up to this point has been you, failing to even perceive any positive in Ben's play (current or past) while extolling the virtues of the "Wunderkinds" of this season. You're as myopic in an anti-Ben way as Crash is myopic in a Pro-Ben way; we'll see how it shakes out next year.

    Pappy
    Great perspective.

    As for your point about the QBs left at this time of year, just a few short years ago one of those QBs was Mark Sanchez. Not sure if Lloyroid woud have fawned over him, but wouldn't be surprised if he did.

  2. #72
    I love these "flavor of the month" selections. Every year there are multiple young QBs who are going to eclipse Ben. Who could forget these classics?

    Mike Vick upon his return with the Eagles
    Matthew Stafford and his 5,000 yards
    Philip Rivers - drafted the same year as Ben and sooooo much better while he dumps it off to Tomlinson then watched him run 60 yards through the D
    Alex Smith just last season, not even a starter anymore
    The up and coming Sam Bradford
    Cam Newton and the Superman pose
    Teeeeeeeebooooooow
    Andy Dalton just last year
    Tony Romo.....everyone's favorite
    Matt Schaub

    And I'm sure there are more that I can't think of.......

    Now we have RGIII, Russell Wilson etc. While I do like watching these guys play, I just know that three years from now I will be reading a thread in which someone says something like.....Man, remember RGIII? How could would that dude have been if he could have stayed healthy?

    And we will still be looking at QBs who are better than Ben based on the previous week.

  3. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by BradshawsHairdresser View Post
    The only thing I think Ben may have lost is some of his "clutchness." That doesn't mean he can't still be great. I don't know if Tom Brady is especially "clutch"--he very rarely is involved in a close game where it's on his shoulders to pull it out at the end. Maybe the Steelers need to figure out a way to pile up big leads, so that they don't always have to depend on Ben to be "clutch."

    This right here... why is it so hard to build a lead and keep it? One thing I will add though is Ben can't be let off the hook for some of these close games. He tends to get sloppy just like the rest of the team when we have a chance to put a team away. Whether it's missing a guy in the flat... taking a killer sack or throwing an INT. Just seems like this team finds creative ways every week to keep every game close... and it's EVERY facet of the team.

  4. #74
    Quote Originally Posted by lloydroid View Post
    Did you see this guy battle back vs. Atl? Dear WORD, this kid is good. He is a better QB, right NOW, then is Bonehead Ben. He can buy time in the pocket, and out side of it, BETTER than BB, plus makes better decisions on where to go with the ball. I give Pete Carrol kudos for having the stones, and the wisdom, to go with this rookie instead of their high priced QB free agent vet. Seattle still lost, but this guy brought them back on a furious pace. Ben gets so much credit for keeping a play alive, but takes a pounding in doing so and makes some real bonehead decisions with careless decisions. This guy is already superior in buying time, creating plays and the accuracy on his throws. I know most of us like to consider BB an elite QB, but this new crop of QBs is quickly leaving BB in the rear view mirror as a possible top 5 QB. As a matter of fact, if given the choice, I would choose all of these QBs BEFORE BB if I had an NFL team.

    Brady
    Rogers
    Matt Ryan
    Peyton Manning - although age is a concern
    Colin Rand Kaepernick
    Russell Wilson
    Luck
    RG3 - although knee injury a concern
    Brees

    And I would add in Cam Newton if he bounces back from a sophomore slump, which I think he will.

    That puts BB out of the top 10 in my mind - just out of it, but out of it nonetheless.

    Sorry but Russell Wilson is the real deal. And so is Kaepernick, with his wicked athletic ability paired with a cannon of an arm. These guys are the new big time QBs in the NFL; BB no longer is the current big time QB. Those days are already gone. Oh, and Brady is as deadly as ever. Amazing how he and the Pats contend every year - just amazing.

    I agree! I'd take any of these QBs and add Cam Newton too, before BB. If we had any of these Qbs leading us right now, I'd bet you we would be in the AFCCG and not Baltimore.....

  5. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by feltdizz View Post
    I wouldn't bet against Russell Wilson... he is the truth. He has everything Ben has except the big body and off field drama. LOL...

    Not sure what it is about that kid but you know he is never out of a game.
    And the "big body" applies in height only. RW is big, he's just not tall. He is built very solid and can move much better than Bonehead Ben, plus he seems to take this much more seriously. Ben plays like he is in a flag football intramural, frat game with a keg on the sidelines. He resembles David Spades take in "Tommy Boy." "Hey, i'm big Tom's son, he'll fix everything, so I'm allowed to be a moron," except in BB's case, his dad doesn't need to fix it from him being a moron, he just slathers through life, groping women, recklessly riding motorcycles, blow off pay his bills at bars, carelessly throwing passes, without bothering to focus, right into defenders chests, to end the season, not caring that he has just broken the hearts of millions of fans and an entire city. But it doesn't matter, because the regular rules don't apply to Bonehead Ben. He can grope women whenever he feels like it, have sex in public bathrooms, and it's all fine just because Bonehead Ben is allowed to do whatever he wants and he never has to be accountable.

  6. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by feltdizz View Post
    This right here... why is it so hard to build a lead and keep it? One thing I will add though is Ben can't be let off the hook for some of these close games. He tends to get sloppy just like the rest of the team when we have a chance to put a team away. Whether it's missing a guy in the flat... taking a killer sack or throwing an INT. Just seems like this team finds creative ways every week to keep every game close... and it's EVERY facet of the team.
    But Ben is the catalyst and the root of the haphazard, sloppy ways. That is the epitome of BB: lazy, unfocused, undisciplined, shoot-at-the-hip. He thinks it's all good, because, "hey, that's just me I guess." Then after he losses the season for us, _THEN_ he gets all remorseful and apologizes to each player in the locker room, reportedly, which surely was a PR stunt, thinking he could just bamboozle the public like he always has. This is a man who skipped out on paying massive bar bills, just because he thinks he is too special to have to pay for his massive amount of beers and food. "Hey, I'm Big Ben, you are just lucky I am even here, so I don't have to pay for anything."

  7. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by steeler_fan_in_t.o. View Post
    I love these "flavor of the month" selections. Every year there are multiple young QBs who are going to eclipse Ben. Who could forget these classics?

    Mike Vick upon his return with the Eagles
    Matthew Stafford and his 5,000 yards
    Philip Rivers - drafted the same year as Ben and sooooo much better while he dumps it off to Tomlinson then watched him run 60 yards through the D
    Alex Smith just last season, not even a starter anymore
    The up and coming Sam Bradford
    Cam Newton and the Superman pose
    Teeeeeeeebooooooow
    Andy Dalton just last year
    Tony Romo.....everyone's favorite
    Matt Schaub

    And I'm sure there are more that I can't think of.......

    Now we have RGIII, Russell Wilson etc. While I do like watching these guys play, I just know that three years from now I will be reading a thread in which someone says something like.....Man, remember RGIII? How could would that dude have been if he could have stayed healthy?

    And we will still be looking at QBs who are better than Ben based on the previous week.
    Problem is, none of those guys were ever on my list. So, the assertion doesn't apply.

  8. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by phillyesq View Post
    Great perspective.

    As for your point about the QBs left at this time of year, just a few short years ago one of those QBs was Mark Sanchez. Not sure if Lloyroid woud have fawned over him, but wouldn't be surprised if he did.
    Do not deal in straw man arguments. I have known the Dirty Sanchez has stunk all along. Only address my actual assertions, not things that you have just made up. Dealing with straw man arguments is disingenuous.

  9. #79
    Quote Originally Posted by lloydroid View Post
    Do not deal in straw man arguments. I have known the Dirty Sanchez has stunk all along. Only address my actual assertions, not things that you have just made up. Dealing with straw man arguments is disingenuous.
    It's not a straw man argument...you were referring to the "new crop of QBs"...how new? You need to clarify before accusing others of a straw man argument...

  10. #80
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    I would like to know how all the QB''s mentioned would play without their starting RT, RG almost the entire year, then lose their LG and the center has to play LG and the backup to center.
    The falloff from starters is big now a days, teams put so much cash into the starters, and the depth suffers and so does the play on the field until the backup gets enough playing time.

    Btw, Kapernik the 49er QB has 3 PRO BOWL linemen on his line, I would think that makes a big difference in how he is able to play.

    What I want to see is 5 healthy starters on our O-line and see how Ben Plays then, plus a healthy Ben would help too. Before I can pass judgement either way I need to see Ben have an equal playing field as the other QB's have ( linemen).

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