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Thread: Steelers LB James Harrison blames Jovan Belcher, not guns

  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by Slapstick View Post
    The Cato Institute is a conservative think tank with a pro-gun agenda (among other agendas)...

    I'm not impressed...I would prefer to peruse the study of a non-political entity...

    Actually, the Cato Institute is a non-partisan, libertarian think tank (they were heavily critical of Bush for his pro-war stance, among other things). But since you don't really have a good answer to the argument they present, you try to villify them...a tactic that doesn't impress me...
    Last edited by BradshawsHairdresser; 12-06-2012 at 02:28 PM.

  2. #42
    Pro Bowler D Rock's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Pittsburgh View Post
    How many crappy drivers and road rage incidents will it take to finally outlaw cars. You even hear of people drinking and doing drugs and then driving and causing accidents that kill innocent people.

    If they would just outlaw cars things would be so much safer and we would have far less deaths.

    I see where you're going with that, but it's pretty hard to ignore the differences in the two objects.

    Guns were created to kill people, cars were created to move people places.

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slapstick View Post
    I agree.

    The problem is, if someone really doesn't want to murder someone and they lose composure for even a second, the ease with which
    it is done becomes extremely relevant...

    With a firearm, it becomes very easy to solve a temporary problem very permanently and very horribly...
    We don't have a gun problem as much as a human problem. In Switzerland every home has a MACHINE gun and yet they have a very low gun murder rate.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_pol...in_Switzerland

    Yea, it's not quite apples to apples, but it is relative.

  4. #44
    In the 1990's Gary Kleck wrote a book that showed that private firearms stop 2.5 million crimes per year in this country.
    Kleck is a PhD professor in the School of Criminology and Criminal Justice at Florida State University in Tallahassee; he is a member of the ACLU, Amnesty International, and Common Cause, among other politically liberal organizations...he's also a lifelong registered Democrat. He's never been a member of or contributor to the NRA, Handgun Control Inc., or any advocacy group on either side of the gun issue.

  5. #45
    Hall of Famer Mister Pittsburgh's Avatar
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    Take the gang bangers shootings and deaths, which are essentially a micro military group and don't own their guns legally out of the numbers and you will see the gun death statistics are far less crazy. I live on the north side of Pittsburgh and it seems some 16 year old black kid shoots another 16 year old black kid on a nightly basis. That isn't a gun issue.
    Last edited by Mister Pittsburgh; 12-06-2012 at 02:47 PM.

  6. #46
    Quote Originally Posted by lloydroid View Post
    We don't have a gun problem as much as a human problem. In Switzerland every home has a MACHINE gun and yet they have a very low gun murder rate.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_pol...in_Switzerland

    Yea, it's not quite apples to apples, but it is relative.
    lloydroid,
    I agree with you, but I tried to make the same point earlier in the thread, and Slap argued that the lower murder rate in Switzerland is because they have better socio-economic conditions.

  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by BradshawsHairdresser View Post
    lloydroid,
    I agree with you, but I tried to make the same point earlier in the thread, and Slap argued that the lower murder rate in Switzerland is because they have better socio-economic conditions.
    Yes they have Machine guns but they are also REQUIRED to take part in military training constantly throughout their lives. They have no standing army, their citizens are their army in an emergency. It also helps that everyone who has a weapon has proper training, constant check ups from doctors, a country with a population of only 8 million people, and one of the highest GDP per capita in the world.

  8. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by BradshawsHairdresser View Post
    Actually, the Cato Institute is a non-partisan, libertarian think tank (they were heavily critical of Bush for his pro-war stance, among other things). But since you don't really have a good answer to the argument they present, you try to villify them...a tactic that doesn't impress me...
    Not at all.

    I never said anything about Democrat or Republican, nor did I try to villify them.

    I merely stated that the Cato Institute is a conservative think tank, which they are. Lots of consrvatives were heavily critical of Bush for his pro-war stance. Conservative is not a political party, nor is it a dirty word. The same goes with the word liberal or libertarian (in terms of ideology, not political party).

    If you want me to counter the Cato Institute with some kind of report from a liberal think tank that says guns are bad, I could do that. But, the argument would be just as slanted.

    I prefer to counter with hard facts that can't be debated, as I did in my previous post regarding quantity of firearms per person in the US and the number of gun related homicides in the US when compared with other countries.

    Those, sir, are my tactics. Whether you are impressed by them or not is of no consequence.

  9. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by focosteeler View Post
    Yes they have Machine guns but they are also REQUIRED to take part in military training constantly throughout their lives. They have no standing army, their citizens are their army in an emergency. It also helps that everyone who has a weapon has proper training, constant check ups from doctors, a country with a population of only 8 million people, and one of the highest GDP per capita in the world.
    All of these things are true, in addition to the information that I presented....

  10. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by D Rock View Post
    I see where you're going with that, but it's pretty hard to ignore the differences in the two objects.

    Guns were created to kill people, cars were created to move people places.
    Nuclear power was created to kill people too.

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