Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 18

Thread: Arians Stays but Same Problem Remains: Steelers Canít Score

  1. #1
    Legend hawaiiansteel's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Hawaii 5-0
    Posts
    14,090

    Arians Stays but Same Problem Remains: Steelers Canít Score

    BA Stays but Same Problem Remains: Steelers Canít Score

    Posted on January 12, 2012


    To all of you who are glad that Bruce Arians is likely staying with the Steelers, I would humbly like to submit the following question: Why canít this offense score points?

    The Steelers are 19th in the league in total touchdowns with 36. Breaking that number down further we are 15th in the league with 13 rushing TDs and 13th with 21 receiving scores (then one each for special teams and defense Ė that defensive stat has the Steelers tied for second to last Ö but thatís another issue).

    First off, I need to begin by saying that I am not a BA basher. I donít blame him for all the woes of this team, nor do I put every loss at his feet. There are plenty of reasons why the Steelers, as a team, underperformed this season, from injuries, to clock management issues, and, at times, just plain poor execution on both sides of the ball. But hereís what I want to discuss: the offense and scoring in particular.

    Why do we consistently fail to put up points when our team has an elite QB, one of if not the best group of WRs in the league, an elite RB (and an excellent backup), and an average (when healthy) offensive line? Sanchez, Romo, Ryan, Fitzpatrick and Newton all have more passing touchdowns that Big Ben, but few (Editorís note: no one) would argue are better quarterbacks. This simply should not happen; none of these QBs have a better set of options for the pass.

    Now many would say that our problem is poor offensive line play. But a quick look at Football Outsiders tells a slightly different story when it comes to pass protection. According to their stats, Pittsburghís O-line ranked 20th in pass pro. But Carolina (21st), Green Bay (23rd), and Arizona (28th) scored at least as many passing touchdowns as the Steelers (the Packers scored 51!) with worse performances from their offensive lines.

    Another telling stat: Pittsburgh is 10th in the league in total passing yards this season, yet only 21st in scoring. The full list of teams with a better total scoring rank is a depressing read. These rankings tell a story every Steelers fan knows all too well, this team can move the ball between the 20s on almost any opponent but fails to finish drives. Whatís more, this team hasnít last broken the top ten in scoring since 2007 (9th), Ariansí first year as the offensive coordinator.

    My argument is that given this team, with a franchise quarterback, outstanding receiving options including a solid tight end, and a very respectable set of running backs has continued to underwhelm. I have no suggestions for Ariansí replacement, nor am I saying fire him immediately. I just think we should look around and see what else is available.

    http://www.steelerslounge.com/2012/01/a ... #more-6671

  2. #2
    Legend
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    12,821

    Re: Arians Stays but Same Problem Remains: Steelers Canít Sc

    I'm not sure that anyone, other than Ben, is glad that Arians is returning. I think instead of blind hate some just see that Arians is operating with a major handicap in the OL that he has that lacks the consistency for this offense to ever get into a rhythm.

    Arians has taken this offense as far as he can and he should have left after this season. But he hasn't so we hope for the best and prepare for the frustration. Colbert could be the savior of Arians' reputation and our sanity if he would just focus on getting together a good OL. Unfortunately we have so much money tied up in players on the defensive side of the ball that will be difficult to do with regards to the salary cap given we are already way over.
    Playing Fantasy Football does not qualify you to be the in the front office or on the coaching staff of the Pittsburgh Steelers. They are professionals and you are not!

    2014 Draft

    1. Eric Ebron, TE
    2. Calvin Pryor, S
    3 (Comp). Jaylen Watkins, CB
    4. Justin Ellis, DT/NT
    5a. Brandon Coleman, WR
    5b. Brent Urban, DE
    6. Prince Shembo, OLB
    7a. Aaron Colvin, CB
    7b. Storm Johnson, RB

  3. #3

    Re: Arians Stays but Same Problem Remains: Steelers Canít Sc

    Even though I don't hate Arians as much as some people seem to do. The scoring is clearly a problem. Even though they are keeping Arians they can still spend the offseason studying this and trying to figure out how to be more effective. I would endorse sending Arians to offensive coordinator seminars or conferences if such exist and to brainstorm this. Nobody is too old to learn and Arians could add to his knowledge also.

  4. #4
    Legend papillon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Under your bed
    Posts
    6,624

    Re: Arians Stays but Same Problem Remains: Steelers Canít Sc

    Quote Originally Posted by hawaiiansteel
    BA Stays but Same Problem Remains: Steelers Canít Score

    Posted on January 12, 2012


    To all of you who are glad that Bruce Arians is likely staying with the Steelers, I would humbly like to submit the following question: Why canít this offense score points?

    The Steelers are 19th in the league in total touchdowns with 36. Breaking that number down further we are 15th in the league with 13 rushing TDs and 13th with 21 receiving scores (then one each for special teams and defense Ė that defensive stat has the Steelers tied for second to last Ö but thatís another issue).

    First off, I need to begin by saying that I am not a BA basher. I donít blame him for all the woes of this team, nor do I put every loss at his feet. There are plenty of reasons why the Steelers, as a team, underperformed this season, from injuries, to clock management issues, and, at times, just plain poor execution on both sides of the ball. But hereís what I want to discuss: the offense and scoring in particular.

    Why do we consistently fail to put up points when our team has an elite QB, one of if not the best group of WRs in the league, an elite RB (and an excellent backup), and an average (when healthy) offensive line? Sanchez, Romo, Ryan, Fitzpatrick and Newton all have more passing touchdowns that Big Ben, but few (Editorís note: no one) would argue are better quarterbacks. This simply should not happen; none of these QBs have a better set of options for the pass.

    Now many would say that our problem is poor offensive line play. But a quick look at Football Outsiders tells a slightly different story when it comes to pass protection. According to their stats, Pittsburghís O-line ranked 20th in pass pro. But Carolina (21st), Green Bay (23rd), and Arizona (28th) scored at least as many passing touchdowns as the Steelers (the Packers scored 51!) with worse performances from their offensive lines.

    Another telling stat: Pittsburgh is 10th in the league in total passing yards this season, yet only 21st in scoring. The full list of teams with a better total scoring rank is a depressing read. These rankings tell a story every Steelers fan knows all too well, this team can move the ball between the 20s on almost any opponent but fails to finish drives. Whatís more, this team hasnít last broken the top ten in scoring since 2007 (9th), Ariansí first year as the offensive coordinator.

    My argument is that given this team, with a franchise quarterback, outstanding receiving options including a solid tight end, and a very respectable set of running backs has continued to underwhelm. I have no suggestions for Ariansí replacement, nor am I saying fire him immediately. I just think we should look around and see what else is available.

    http://www.steelerslounge.com/2012/01/a ... #more-6671
    The highlighted part of this post is the fallacy that everyone makes when asking why Arians' offense can't score points. Ben is the only elite player on offense, the WRs are young and inexperienced and getting better, but they are not this unstoppable force. The running backs right now are average (potential doesn't translate to performance) and the TEs are slightly above average because of Heath (and, in today's NFL his blocking ability has little affect on a game). The o-line is at best average, I would say below average, the reasons not withstanding (injury, talent and no continuity).

    Personally, I think Ben gets as much out of this group as possible. He also gets the least out of them as possible at times due to his erratic play. Look back at 2011 without the Steeler colored shades, Wallace fell off the planet after game 8, Mendenhall never was dominant, Heath had catches in the 1st quarter and then disappeared, the o-line isn't built to be good at run blocking or pass blocking, so, the Steelers get average o-line play and hope Ben can make something happen. Ben himself, would put the Steelers in a hole and then proceed to climb out (for the most part) and when he couldn't they lost.

    The offense needs help on the interior line (specifically guards) and more consistent play from Ben and the WRs. The running backs need to step up to being above average NFL caliber backs. I'm not certain the players currently on the roster are the answer to the scoring problems of the Steelers.

    Sanders and Brown may end up being the #1 and #2 receivers with Wallace being #3 and hopefully, Cotchery would like to give it another go as the #4. The offenses in the NFL with a tight end that is exclusively a pass receiver are being very successful, the Steelers need to probably try and develop or draft a weapon of this nature. Heath is a throw back and I love the way he plays and conducts himself, but I'm not certain he's the answer in today's NFL at tight end.

    Ben is never going to be consistent because of the way he plays, so, the Steelers have to take the good with the bad and the good outweighs the bad by a long shot.

    Steeler fans take a hard look at the talent and I believe you'll come to the same conclusion, that Arians while part of the problem, isn't the main problem or the only problem. He can stay or go as far as I'm concerned, but the players need to improve or the Steelers need to find more talented players before the offense will be as successful as many think it should.

    Pappy


    1.15) Ra'Shede Hageman - DE
    2.47) Jason Verrett - CB
    3.97) CJ Fiedorowicz - TE
    4.114) Brandon Coleman - WR
    5.145) Lamin Barrow - ILB
    5.173) Terrance Mitchell - CB
    6.176)
    7.207) Jay Bromley - DT
    7.215)

    "Before you can win a game, you have to not lose it." -- Chuck Noll

  5. #5

    Re: Arians Stays but Same Problem Remains: Steelers Canít Sc

    It's hard to disagree with your assssment, except in the following area:

    TE

    Obviously, Heath's ability to block does, in fact, affect the game...after all, the Steelers did win 12 of them...

    I'd have to go back and watch some games, but it would not surprise me to see that Heath was sent out on patterns in the 1st quarter until defenders figured out how to exploit the inconsistent o-line...then, he was held in to help block...

    Nor would it surprise me if Ben, seemingly always looking for the big play, lost patience throughout the game and just quit looking for him as an option, holding the ball and waiting for the bomb to develop...how many times was Heath running free and Ben didn't see him? Maybe he didn't see him because he wasn't looking...

  6. #6
    Pro Bowler Steelhere10's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    man from Sudan
    Posts
    1,602

    Re: Arians Stays but Same Problem Remains: Steelers Canít Sc

    The scoring offense is more of a Ben problem instead of BA. IF our QB ever change his game and stop looking for the long ball every play OR become more accurate when the long ball is therethere, then the scoring would go up. BA is not great either but not more of the problem then Ben.

  7. #7
    Hall of Famer DukieBoy's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    2,981

    Re: Arians Stays but Same Problem Remains: Steelers Canít Sc

    Saw this elsewhere ...

    Under Arians the Steelers Average: 23 PPG, 46 Sacks Per Season, 53.4 in the Red Zone , and 3.3 Red Zone trips. All of these numbers are rank 12th or worse in each category

    1. Steelers must score more Points: 20. 5 NFL RNK: 21

    2. Steelers must reduce the number of Sacks Allowed: 42 Sacks NFL RNK: 23

    3. Red Zone Efficiency: 51% NFL RNK: 18

    4. Red Zone Attempts: 3.2 NFL RNK: 16
    PLEASE DON'T FEED THE TROLLS






  8. #8
    Pro Bowler
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Woooooo!
    Posts
    1,236

    Re: Arians Stays but Same Problem Remains: Steelers Canít Sc

    I was going to rant again about BA - but why type the same thing over and over. much easier to cut and paste from the beginning of the season.

    from Aug:

    we have a lot of weapons on offense. 'ol BA is gonna really take a shellacking if they fail to put up beaucoup points. I would say they are going to be needed because while our defense is still very good - there are opportunities to exploit it. the DB's are still suspect (and yes, i realize our starters were injured) and while there is some good young talent - we still have some veterans playing that have clearly lost a step. don't get me wrong, i love potsie - but I think he's going to be a big target this year. if the defense can hold opponents to 21 points or less and the o-line stays healthy and gets some good continuity - this could be a very successful season.

    from sept:

    I've been a long-time BA critic but I was pretty fair with him last year and I thought that was a nice job. I think this year we are really stacked on offense. If the steelers aren't in the top 10 for points (and no major injuries to blame) - anyone think smizik will hold BA accountable?

    from Oct:

    BA isn't a moron and he has some logical excuses in that article. my issue is while I freely acknowledge I'm an amateur and would never try to pretend I understand the offense more than the pros - it's a results business. at the end of the day I believe we have talent and have had considerable talent on offense in the past. yet for some reason, in the BA era we have not been an elite offense. we have not been explosive. we have been the kind of offense that in an era that really favors scoring, we struggle to put points on the board.

    it's easy to point to a specific play and say why it didn't work. I'm looking at BA's entire body of work as OC. yes, we won a SB and appeared in another - but I still think his offense has underachieved.

    my point is that since I'm not a professional coach it's likely that I can't make a professional evaluation of arians. nevertheless, I think he is an average coordinator at best. I base that on my amateur observations of his units over the past several years AND the fact that (in my opinion) if he were considered elite by his peers - there would be interest in him either as a head coach or some other upgrade, such as the assistant HC gig Russ Grimm got at arizona. and please don't think i'm comparing him to russ, I'm just using that as an example.

    here's another example. the patriots have had a terrific offense for oh, about the last decade. is it all tom brady? he IS fantastic but besides him, they seem to plug players in and out every year and still put up huge numbers. so is it the players or the coach? certainly a combination and if you acknowledge that Ben is an elite QB (which I think he is) then the combination is lacking somewhere else. you are correct above. this thread is about Bruce Arians. I think he's had enough years to show what his offenses are capable of. They are good but not great. I'd like a shot at great - particularly if our great defense is potentially sliding back towards just being good.

    or:

    what I want in an offense.

    1. to be consistently ranked in the top 10
    2. to be able to both run and throw prolifically
    3. to have an offense that is innovative and copied by the rest of the league
    4. to have an OC that is identified as 'the next head coach in the league'

    look, I know those are easy things to want and of course very difficult to achieve - yet as I keep saying, in these days of the NFL's love of offense it appears to me year in and year out with BA we look at pre-season and marvel over all the weapons and then we find ourselves disappointed during the regular season. I would rather performances like yesterday be the the standard - not the exception. I would rather an offense that AVERAGES 30 points a game. I AM an amateur when it comes to dissecting qualifications and performance. Yet I say year in and year out - the professionals in the league have spoken. BA is coveted by no other team. why is that?

    Why do we lose our minds when the defense isn't ranked in the top 5 - yet are thrilled when we crack the top 15 on the offense?

    we have a franchise QB. We have solid backs. we have speed and youth at WR. and we have BA.

    the math seems pretty simple to me.

  9. #9
    Hall of Famer Dee Dub's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    4,534

    Re: Arians Stays but Same Problem Remains: Steelers Canít Sc

    Why isnt it that we as Steeler fans can't always see with our eyes? Why is it we almost always see with our hearts? Let's look at some facts with our hearts aside...

    Ben was seriously hurt over the last several games. His mobility (which is one of his major strengths), was seriously hampered.

    The Steelers offensive line once again looked like a revolving door for a large part of the season. Think about it how bad it was...the Steelers had to go get a LT out of retirement after the season had already started.

    The Steelers do not have a receiver who posses the ability to beat a press off the line of scrimmage with any consistency. I'll concede that Cotchery does but he was limited to playing time this year.

    The Steelers number 1 RB almost always needs conditions to me perfect in order for him to be successful. Very rarely will you see Mendenhall make things on his own.

    The Steelers dont have a legit redzone WR.

    The Steelers #1 or #2 WR (depending on who you ask), going into this year had Father Time hit him upside his aging body.

    Personally, I think the Steelers got quite a bit out of this offense when you objectively look at all things considered.


    Steelers 2014 Draft

    1--Justin Gilbert CB Oklahoma State
    2--Jordan Matthews WR Vanderbilt
    3-- -- Traded --
    3B--C.J. Fiedorwicz TE Iowa
    4--Jordan Tripp ILB Montana
    5--Brent Urban DE Virginia
    6--Michael Schofield OT Michigan
    7--Kadeem Edwards OG Tennessee State









  10. #10
    Legend
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    12,339

    Re: Arians Stays but Same Problem Remains: Steelers Canít Sc

    I agree with Dub and Pap.

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •