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Thread: Why Does Ben Need to be a Great Person?

  1. #21

    Re: Why Does Ben Need to be a Great Person?

    Quote Originally Posted by MaxAMillion
    To each his own...if Donte Stallworth played for the Steelers, I would have a problem with it. I have a problem with supporting people who hurt other people. If Ben was convicted of rape, or if he somehow admitted to sexual assault, I would have a big problem with it.

    I don't have a problem with behavior that doesn't hurt anyone else. For example, I don't really care of Santonio Holmes smokes weed. I smoked weed when I was younger and I certainly won't be a hypocrite about it. Now if you get high and start to drive then we have another problem. Holmes was accused of physical assault of a woman. I have a much bigger problem with that than weed.

    I sure hope Rooney II used the allegation by the woman as reason to make that awful trade with Holmes. I have a hard time believing he would weaken the team and trade Holmes to a playoff competitor because Holmes was going to miss games for smoking weed.
    You are supporting the team...not the person. If you don't want to wear his jersey that is well within your right. But, the Steelers are stocked with quality character.

  2. #22

    Re: Why Does Ben Need to be a Great Person?

    Quote Originally Posted by Shawn
    Quote Originally Posted by SteelAbility
    Quote Originally Posted by HeHateMe
    Sorry Rape is WORSE than killing dogs. What is the penalty for Rape in the Bible? It is DEATH. Of course cruelty to animals or anything is wrong, not condoning that at all. Of course Ben is innocent in the judicial system but.... everyone is prison is not guilty and everyone free is not innocent. We have ALL gotten away with crimes that we were never charged for but that doesn't mean we didn't do anything. But IF holding onto the "he wasn't charged" card makes you feel better then so be it. But If the Ben situation was the Carson Palmer situation I have a feeling that you all would not feel the same about the situations and to me that is sheer hypocrisy. Remember this cry? "RAY LEWIS IS A MURDERER!" That cry came from Steeler fans. Where were the Steelers fans who say "Why does Lewis have to be a great person? As long as he is good on the field?" And Please save the "Ben is a Steeler we back our own". Thats fine but do you back them to the point of lying for them, turning a blind eye and being dishonest? Perhaps.
    According to the Bible, what "you and I" consider to be the smallest sin is worthy of death. Secondly, the Bible prescribes death for a man who rapes a woman who is either married or pledged to be married. If he rapes an unmarried woman then he has to marry her if he's caught.

    Now, that being said, you have a bit of a conundrum on your hands. The Steeler organization is backing Ben right now. So, if you are going to root for the Steelers, follow them and go through with the standard support you have for the Steelers, then you are supporting the organization that backs Ben, a man whom you consider to be a vile rapist. So, whether consciously or sub-consciously, if you support the Steelers, then you are supporting Ben. So, get off this stupid-@$$ high-horse you are on and come back down to Earth. If you are going to preach against Ben, then you also have to preach against the Steelers and boycott them since they back Ben. YOU CAN'T HAVE IT BOTH WAYS HERE. Anything else is just spinning words and hypocrisy, something you seem to be very quick to others of and with seemingly lots of glee.

    Why even address the ignorance?

    There used to be a guy on the Pirates board who ran with the same schtick ove ran dover. At first, we thought he was open fo rlegitimate discussion, but we soon found out that no matter what we said, or how we moved th epoint along, he kept going back tot he same thing over and over and over and over again. This appears to be the same.

  3. #23
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    Re: Why Does Ben Need to be a Great Person?

    Quote Originally Posted by proudpittsburgher
    Quote Originally Posted by Shawn
    Quote Originally Posted by SteelAbility
    Quote Originally Posted by HeHateMe
    Sorry Rape is WORSE than killing dogs. What is the penalty for Rape in the Bible? It is DEATH. Of course cruelty to animals or anything is wrong, not condoning that at all. Of course Ben is innocent in the judicial system but.... everyone is prison is not guilty and everyone free is not innocent. We have ALL gotten away with crimes that we were never charged for but that doesn't mean we didn't do anything. But IF holding onto the "he wasn't charged" card makes you feel better then so be it. But If the Ben situation was the Carson Palmer situation I have a feeling that you all would not feel the same about the situations and to me that is sheer hypocrisy. Remember this cry? "RAY LEWIS IS A MURDERER!" That cry came from Steeler fans. Where were the Steelers fans who say "Why does Lewis have to be a great person? As long as he is good on the field?" And Please save the "Ben is a Steeler we back our own". Thats fine but do you back them to the point of lying for them, turning a blind eye and being dishonest? Perhaps.
    According to the Bible, what "you and I" consider to be the smallest sin is worthy of death. Secondly, the Bible prescribes death for a man who rapes a woman who is either married or pledged to be married. If he rapes an unmarried woman then he has to marry her if he's caught.

    Now, that being said, you have a bit of a conundrum on your hands. The Steeler organization is backing Ben right now. So, if you are going to root for the Steelers, follow them and go through with the standard support you have for the Steelers, then you are supporting the organization that backs Ben, a man whom you consider to be a vile rapist. So, whether consciously or sub-consciously, if you support the Steelers, then you are supporting Ben. So, get off this stupid-@$$ high-horse you are on and come back down to Earth. If you are going to preach against Ben, then you also have to preach against the Steelers and boycott them since they back Ben. YOU CAN'T HAVE IT BOTH WAYS HERE. Anything else is just spinning words and hypocrisy, something you seem to be very quick to others of and with seemingly lots of glee.

    Why even address the ignorance?

    There used to be a guy on the Pirates board who ran with the same schtick ove ran dover. At first, we thought he was open fo rlegitimate discussion, but we soon found out that no matter what we said, or how we moved th epoint along, he kept going back tot he same thing over and over and over and over again. This appears to be the same.
    In fairness, it is the Pirates and they keep losing over and over and over again.

    Every day I look at my Roberto Clemente memorabilia in my man room and wonder if he's real or I just dreamed him up one day as a kid. If Roberto was in Pittsburgh today, we would just trade him for a couple of crummy minor league pitching prospects and a left handed hitter with no power.

  4. #24
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    Re: Why Does Ben Need to be a Great Person?

    If Ben were a Raider or a Bunghole, I think you'd be viewing his troubles with a different eye. He's a Steeler, so many in the Nation are looking for nuance where there probably is none.

    On the plus side, a few lines in Ed Bouchette's recent chat and a few other articles scattered throughout the Pittsburgh media suggested to me that a) Ben is "getting it"; and b) he may be in a Program now - 12-Step or another variety - which would be great news for all of us.

    I'm not in any program myself, so I'm not 100% certain... just a hunch. There's sort of "code" that Program people use, which I've picked up from friends and acquaintances and I thought I detected some of that.

  5. #25

    Re: Why Does Ben Need to be a Great Person?

    Flippy -

    I hear what you're saying - and I think this is a great question -

    But my question in return is - Where do you draw the line?

    Can Ben get away with murder and it's okay?
    Theft?
    Rape?

    If he cuts the fingers off of blind children at night but wins games on Sundays are you okay with that?

    Again where do you draw the line.

    Currently we have two women who have claimed sexual assault - but haven't had the legal system completely behind them - so currently the only thing I see on record is that Ben has had sex with women he shouldn't have been with....I'm in no position to really hold that against him. And I doubt many of you are either, especially SteelerofDeville you just know that guy was a playa at some point - :P

    However - Here's a person who represents the city of Pittsburgh, in fact many would argue Ben Roethlisberger IS the face of Pittsburgh right now - a city you said has great people and in your opinion is the greatest place on earth - as a representative of that city I expect him to live up to those standards.

    From the looks of it Ben Roethlisberger's ego is out of control - and I would love for him to get that in check, however huge ego isn't exactly a new thing in pro sports - so hopefully he'll mature in that regard.

    I guess where you and I "might" be different is that when Michael Irvin was getting caught for Cocaine issues, BUT winning Super Bowls - I wouldn't have wanted him, and it sounds like you don't care.

    But to me when I invest my time, money and support into a business like the Steelers I expect them to win off the field as well.

    IMO - Ben Roethlisberger doesn't HAVE to be great - but with his ability, resources and profile trying to be anything less than great is just lazy or misguided on his part.

    L.B.

  6. #26
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    Re: Why Does Ben Need to be a Great Person?

    To get in a "better light"

    he needs to get a girlfriend. knock her up , then leave her for another woman and when he marries her...have his bodyguards shoot their guns at the paperazzi trying to get pictures of them

  7. #27
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    Re: Why Does Ben Need to be a Great Person?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lonbull
    Flippy -

    I hear what you're saying - and I think this is a great question -

    But my question in return is - Where do you draw the line?

    Can Ben get away with murder and it's okay?
    Theft?
    Rape?

    If he cuts the fingers off of blind children at night but wins games on Sundays are you okay with that?

    Again where do you draw the line.

    Currently we have two women who have claimed sexual assault - but haven't had the legal system completely behind them - so currently the only thing I see on record is that Ben has had sex with women he shouldn't have been with....I'm in no position to really hold that against him. And I doubt many of you are either, especially SteelerofDeville you just know that guy was a playa at some point - :P

    However - Here's a person who represents the city of Pittsburgh, in fact many would argue Ben Roethlisberger IS the face of Pittsburgh right now - a city you said has great people and in your opinion is the greatest place on earth - as a representative of that city I expect him to live up to those standards.

    From the looks of it Ben Roethlisberger's ego is out of control - and I would love for him to get that in check, however huge ego isn't exactly a new thing in pro sports - so hopefully he'll mature in that regard.

    I guess where you and I "might" be different is that when Michael Irvin was getting caught for Cocaine issues, BUT winning Super Bowls - I wouldn't have wanted him, and it sounds like you don't care.

    But to me when I invest my time, money and support into a business like the Steelers I expect them to win off the field as well.

    IMO - Ben Roethlisberger doesn't HAVE to be great - but with his ability, resources and profile trying to be anything less than great is just lazy or misguided on his part.

    L.B.
    I think the line should be where it starts to impact his game.

    I'm a fan of the team, the city, the colors, the games. And I wish the best for these guys off the field considering they bring us enjoyment.

    But at the end of the day, their personal life is their personal life. And I'm never gonna know these guys personally.

    And it kinda sucks for the modern athlete or person in the public eye that we hold them to impossible standards really. We want them to be perfect. And we know everything about them.

    I guess I'm not really condoning anything he does or doesn't do off the field. I just long for the older days when football was simply football and the off field stuff wasn't a part of it.

    And why do we decide to look so closely at some people's personal lives and not others? Seems like all football players should be treated the same to some degree.

    We're all messed up in some way.

  8. #28
    Prok
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    Re: Why Does Ben Need to be a Great Person?

    One thing i've never bought into but still am fascinated with is the "Steeler way" or "Steeler character" myth.

    I put us all in the category of USA residents. Therefore in my world, we are all Americans.

    But it fascinates me as to how many Steelers fans are so stubborn and unforgiving in ways

    To me, what Ben got in such trouble for in the almighty court of public opinion, is just partying in a college bar. Yeah he needed to grow out of that stage as did a BUNCH of us American males at his age. But it's nothing to condemn him for IMO. We would KNOW if he raped the girl. And he did NOT. Hell, the DA even said they couldn't even prove probable cause for an arrest.

    I just don't undestand the ppl that are condemning him.

  9. #29
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    Re: Why Does Ben Need to be a Great Person?

    Quote Originally Posted by Prok
    One thing i've never bought into but still am fascinated with is the "Steeler way" or "Steeler character" myth.

    I put us all in the category of USA residents. Therefore in my world, we are all Americans.

    But it fascinates me as to how many Steelers fans are so stubborn and unforgiving in ways

    To me, what Ben got in such trouble for in the almighty court of public opinion, is just partying in a college bar. Yeah he needed to grow out of that stage as did a BUNCH of us American males at his age. But it's nothing to condemn him for IMO. We would KNOW if he raped the girl. And he did NOT. Hell, the DA even said they couldn't even prove probable cause for an arrest.

    I just don't undestand the ppl that are condemning him.
    I chastised him for poor decision making and not being responsible for himself or taking the responsibility given to him by the Steelers serious enough. That being said, once everyone started piling on like he was a serial murderer I became staunch Ben supporter when it comes to this matter.

    He still holds the ball too long...

    Pappy


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  10. #30
    Prok
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    Re: Why Does Ben Need to be a Great Person?

    Quote Originally Posted by papillon
    Quote Originally Posted by Prok
    One thing i've never bought into but still am fascinated with is the "Steeler way" or "Steeler character" myth.

    I put us all in the category of USA residents. Therefore in my world, we are all Americans.

    But it fascinates me as to how many Steelers fans are so stubborn and unforgiving in ways

    To me, what Ben got in such trouble for in the almighty court of public opinion, is just partying in a college bar. Yeah he needed to grow out of that stage as did a BUNCH of us American males at his age. But it's nothing to condemn him for IMO. We would KNOW if he raped the girl. And he did NOT. Hell, the DA even said they couldn't even prove probable cause for an arrest.

    I just don't undestand the ppl that are condemning him.
    I chastised him for poor decision making and not being responsible for himself or taking the responsibility given to him by the Steelers serious enough. That being said, once everyone started piling on like he was a serial murderer I became staunch Ben supporter when it comes to this matter.

    He still holds the ball too long...

    Pappy
    lol And he takes too many sacks too !!

    My initial response when this all broke was dammit he's in the news for this a SECOND time ?? I was and am still upset over that. That is his own damn fault. But we need to let him learn from mistakes as well. It was 14 yrs ago but i was once a 28 yr od hanging out at college bars too. I think alot of us can relate.

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