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Thread: After the Combine: DB Risers and Fallers

  1. #11

    Re: After the Combine: DB Risers and Fallers

    Quote Originally Posted by NW Steeler
    If Mays was drafted, do you think that he and Troy would swap positions, like some here have suggested? Or is that just "board" talk? That would put Taylor closer to the LOS and let Troy freelance even more than he does. It seems to make sense. I am definitely warming to the idea of Mays, mostly based on his physical stature. You wont see him getting trucked by RB's ala Carter, Clark, etc......
    I think that there would be a great possibilty of Taylor playing strong and Troy being a playmaking defensive field general from the FS position. (Look at how effective Bob Sanders is from the position when he's healthy)

    Perhaps not immediately,... but possibly two seasons from now. Who knows,.. maybe even sooner if Troy and the coaching staff feel it will go along way towards giving him a longer career here in terms of preserving his health. (As rightfully stated by Oviedo)

    And your right,....Taylor would'nt be getting trucked by hardly any back in the league. (Though him vs Peterson head up,...would be a clash of the Titans. lol) What i think many people fail to realize is that coach Lebeau often uses safeties in psuedo LB roles anyway, (especially Troy),.......and Thomas, unlike Mays and even Berry is not that player. (Though he's got nice big 12 ball skills)
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  2. #12
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    Re: After the Combine: DB Risers and Fallers

    The "suspect" tag would come from the lack of int's in his career.

  3. #13

    Re: After the Combine: DB Risers and Fallers

    A few problems I have with Mays...one is he is a human highlight reel but lacks consistancy. He can look like a football phenom one play and look lost the next. I think stiff is a great word for Mays in coverage. He is not...nor do I believe he will ever be a coverage safety. I do believe he has the skills to be an elite...pro bowl caliber 3-4 OLBr. Can you imagine that kind of speed and size on the edge? A guy who has good coverage skills for a linebacker? There is no doubt he is a rare talent...but he needs to be placed correctly to thrive. Considering we have 3 natural OLBrs...we have no room for that. He isn't a FS...clearly. Our only move for Mays is if we wanted to prolong Troy's career and have them switch positions.

  4. #14
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    Re: After the Combine: DB Risers and Fallers

    Quote Originally Posted by feltdizz
    Quote Originally Posted by SteelCzar76
    Quote Originally Posted by NW Steeler
    Baed on solely the criticism that Mays has gotten, I would not give up picks for him. I just like the fact that Thomas was much more productive in college than Mays. Mays has 2 interceptions in the last 3 years. He is a physical specimen, a freak of sorts. He would be intimidating as hell in the secondary, but I really feel that we need a guy with some proven ball skills, a play maker like Thomas. That said, I would still be excited if we drafted Mays, but I think Thomas is the safer pick. If we don't re-sign Clark and don't sign a significant FS in free agency, then we almost have to draft one in the first round, don't we?
    Yeah i think it's fair to say that Safety is most certainly a position of need for us especially with the pending departure of Clark . (whom in reality is a huge liability in coverage when Troy is not on the field because of his considerable lack of speed,....and he's the second best safety that we have)

    I also understand the perception that Thomas is a "ballhawk" and Taylor is supposedly "suspect" in coverage,.....but i have been repping SC since my childhood along with the Steelers,(Through the both the good and LEAN times for both. lol) and the same "great athlete, but will suffer in coverage enforcer" tag was also unfairly placed on Troy coming out. It's a matter of what you are almost expected to do as a Safety at SC from Ronnie Lott on,......above all else,...be physical.


    And sometimes such focus on merely one part of a talented players game,...has a tendency to cause said player and or players to over emphasize that single attribute. (physicality)

    Long story short,...i have no doubt whatsoever that Taylor under Coach lebeau and Troy's tutelage could go on to be very similar to Carnell in coverage. Let alone be an immediate and considerable upgrade over Mundy, Carter and even Clark at either S position.
    I'm confused about the Mays "suspect" tag that the board keeps touting...

    Not sure if it's legit or like the Rooney quote about running "more effectively..."
    which was rehashed so much it turned into BA being fired and Bettis coming back for some smashmouth football.
    It is the same "suspect" label that Troy had coming out of USC, the same University. Maybe it is the role in the scheme these guys are being asked to play and not the player. Also, remember that last season USC lost most of their defense and Mays probably was asked to make up some for losing 3 LBs to the first couple rounds of the draft.

    I don't buy "instincts" either. No one can define or give specific examples when pressed. All they do is fixate on the INT stats and conclude that someone who has them is a "playmaker."
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  5. #15
    Pro Bowler pfelix73's Avatar
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    Re: After the Combine: DB Risers and Fallers

    It's all in one's perspective- I think we need a CB, a 1st round caliber, Derrelle Revis, type, CB. Some say, well we invested 2 picks last year for CB's. Well, if they were all-pro type CB's they would've made an impact already. Those 2 guys we drafted last year will be fine as backups. I can say the same about the OL- Well, we drafted Urbik in the 3rd last year and Foster has been a nice surprise. With Colon getting the tender, why would you draft an OL in the 1st round? It's all in one's perspective.

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  6. #16
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    Re: After the Combine: DB Risers and Fallers

    Czar is probably right, Mays won't get past his former coach in Seattle at pick #15. So we won't have to worry about it.

  7. #17
    Hall of Famer Dee Dub's Avatar
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    Re: After the Combine: DB Risers and Fallers

    This is as dumb as it gets...

    Chad Jones, FS, LSU

    Jones decided to forego his senior season after a solid junior campaign where he had 74 tackles and three interceptions. At 6-foot-2, 231 pounds, Jones is considered to be one of the top safeties in this year’s class, but he failed to impress scouts on Tuesday. Jones ran an average 4.57 in the 40, but it was his bench press that raised eyebrows. At his size, Jones should have completed more than seven reps. Jones’ lack of strength will likely hurt him, but he should still receive late second, early third round consideration.

    That is exactly what Jones was all along.

    And then this guy moves up...

    Kevin Thomas, CB, USC

    Injuries plagued Thomas’ career at USC, but the 6-foot, 192-pound corner showcased his athleticism to NFL scouts on Tuesday. Thomas did well during drills, but must stay low in his backpedal. However, he ran a surprising 4.48 in the 40, posted 17 reps in the bench press and showed his explosion with a 10’6” broad jump.

    ...and yet he could hardly ever get on the field due to injury after injury.
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  8. #18
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    Re: After the Combine: DB Risers and Fallers

    Quote Originally Posted by Dee Dub
    This is as dumb as it gets...

    Chad Jones, FS, LSU

    Jones decided to forego his senior season after a solid junior campaign where he had 74 tackles and three interceptions. At 6-foot-2, 231 pounds, Jones is considered to be one of the top safeties in this year’s class, but he failed to impress scouts on Tuesday. Jones ran an average 4.57 in the 40, but it was his bench press that raised eyebrows. At his size, Jones should have completed more than seven reps. Jones’ lack of strength will likely hurt him, but he should still receive late second, early third round consideration.

    That is exactly what Jones was all along.

    And then this guy moves up...

    Kevin Thomas, CB, USC

    Injuries plagued Thomas’ career at USC, but the 6-foot, 192-pound corner showcased his athleticism to NFL scouts on Tuesday. Thomas did well during drills, but must stay low in his backpedal. However, he ran a surprising 4.48 in the 40, posted 17 reps in the bench press and showed his explosion with a 10’6” broad jump.

    ...and yet he could hardly ever get on the field due to injury after injury.
    There will always be scouts/teams that fall prey to the workout warrior- in spite of what the film says.

    Vernon Gholston, anyone???

  9. #19
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    Re: After the Combine: DB Risers and Fallers

    Quote Originally Posted by NW Steeler
    The "suspect" tag would come from the lack of int's in his career.
    Mays had an INT in the Senior Bowl I think...

    Earl Thomas had 8 INT's but when you look closer he had 1 INT against a ranked team it Texas Tech throws 50+ times a game.

    He did have 2 against Oklahoma the year before though...

    My point though is 8 INT's against teams when the average margin of victory was 23 points needs to be put in perspective.

  10. #20
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    Re: After the Combine: DB Risers and Fallers

    Quote Originally Posted by feltdizz
    Quote Originally Posted by NW Steeler
    The "suspect" tag would come from the lack of int's in his career.
    Mays had an INT in the Senior Bowl I think...

    Earl Thomas had 8 INT's but when you look closer he had 1 INT against a ranked team it Texas Tech throws 50+ times a game.

    He did have 2 against Oklahoma the year before though...

    My point though is 8 INT's against teams when the average margin of victory was 23 points needs to be put in perspective.
    See Joe haden. How many times in his career were the Gators' opponents put so far behind early in games that they were forced to throw the ball alot and everyone in the stadium knew they had too. Makes pass defense and padding your stats pretty easy.
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