Shipley!

[NorthCoast]

Truth be told, Shipley was not the guy we targeted for center, Wood was No. 1. Shipley now has his chance to make the team and if heart and desire count for anything, he will make the best of his chance. The intangibles with some of these guys are what is intriguing and it will make for some interesting camp battles. When is the last time we had two drafted CBs battling in camp?

I'll take "Deshea Townsend and Jason Simmons" for $1000, Alex. They were taken in rounds 4 & 5 instead of 3 & 5...but close enough.

Nice bit of research Ruth.

[steeler_fan_in_t.o.]

I didn't realize that he was a D lineman who switched to full timme C in just his Junior year and won the Rimington the following year. Talk about your quick learning curve.

[JUST-PLAIN-NASTY]

If there is any spot on the OL where you could use short arms to your advantage it is at C. When a DL gets a jump and gets into your body before the C punches after the snap...A C with short arms can use his upper body strength to gain seperation and get a "stale mate" in the bull rush. Evidence to this fact is in the bench. Short arm players tend to do more reps in the bench than longer arm players. When a C with long arms gets caught with a DL in his chest before he can punch after the snap...He tends to get pushed back and bent backward. Just see Hartwig on the safety @ the SB. From experience, a technician can overcome this handicap if he stays on the interior. It requires development of an "armbar" technique used to knock down the DL arms when he tries to get into your body before you get in your punch. If you have quick hands and good feet you could minimize this handicap in the interior. On the edge in space it becomes a little more of a problem because the defender can use the outside edge to his advantage. You would need elite feet on the outside to survive with short arms and that doesn't happen very often. This is one aspect Colon struggles with in his game. Colon can't aford a false set on the perimeter. When he gets behind and a defender gets his hands into him before he does the rusher uses the edge and Colon's push to get around him.

As far as AQ, I could see him being successful at this level. I'm a PSU fan so I have seen him play alot. He rarely gave up ground in a bull rush and is very good in space on the LB level. I would say he compares to Mack in this aspect. A pain in you butt. Like a bug that won't go away. As far as tenacity, I would say he compares more to Unger. Not as nasty or physically imposing as Wood or Mack but just a guy that understands technique, leverage, and angles. AQ & Legursky both have the abilty to start at some point for the Steelers. Both of them will have to be "technicians" in this league and constantly working on each play. They have some limitations physically but can make up for it in their technique. They are both best described as "lunch pail guys" and they will have to work hard to stay at a high level because they don't have the physical size to bail them out when they loose their indvidual battle.

[BradshawsHairdresser]

If there is any spot on the OL where you could use short arms to your advantage it is at C. When a DL gets a jump and gets into your body before the C punches after the snap...A C with short arms can use his upper body strength to gain seperation and get a "stale mate" in the bull rush. Evidence to this fact is in the bench. Short arm players tend to do more reps in the bench than longer arm players. When a C with long arms gets caught with a DL in his chest before he can punch after the snap...He tends to get pushed back and bent backward. Just see Hartwig on the safety @ the SB. From experience, a technician can overcome this handicap if he stays on the interior. It requires development of an "armbar" technique used to knock down the DL arms when he tries to get into your body before you get in your punch. If you have quick hands and good feet you could minimize this handicap in the interior. On the edge in space it becomes a little more of a problem because the defender can use the outside edge to his advantage. You would need elite feet on the outside to survive with short arms and that doesn't happen very often. This is one aspect Colon struggles with in his game. Colon can't aford a false set on the perimeter. When he gets behind and a defender gets his hands into him before he does the rusher uses the edge and Colon's push to get around him.

As far as AQ, I could see him being successful at this level. I'm a PSU fan so I have seen him play alot. He rarely gave up ground in a bull rush and is very good in space on the LB level. I would say he compares to Mack in this aspect. A pain in you butt. Like a bug that won't go away. As far as tenacity, I would say he compares more to Unger. Not as nasty or physically imposing as Wood or Mack but just a guy that understands technique, leverage, and angles. AQ & Legursky both have the abilty to start at some point for the Steelers. Both of them will have to be "technicians" in this league and constantly working on each play. They have some limitations physically but can make up for it in their technique. They are both best described as "lunch pail guys" and they will have to work hard to stay at a high level because they don't have the physical size to bail them out when they loose their indvidual battle.

I enjoyed this analysis. I hope you will continue to provide this kind of insight into our OL play throughout the coming season.

[JUST-PLAIN-NASTY]

If there is any spot on the OL where you could use short arms to your advantage it is at C. When a DL gets a jump and gets into your body before the C punches after the snap...A C with short arms can use his upper body strength to gain seperation and get a "stale mate" in the bull rush. Evidence to this fact is in the bench. Short arm players tend to do more reps in the bench than longer arm players. When a C with long arms gets caught with a DL in his chest before he can punch after the snap...He tends to get pushed back and bent backward. Just see Hartwig on the safety @ the SB. From experience, a technician can overcome this handicap if he stays on the interior. It requires development of an "armbar" technique used to knock down the DL arms when he tries to get into your body before you get in your punch. If you have quick hands and good feet you could minimize this handicap in the interior. On the edge in space it becomes a little more of a problem because the defender can use the outside edge to his advantage. You would need elite feet on the outside to survive with short arms and that doesn't happen very often. This is one aspect Colon struggles with in his game. Colon can't aford a false set on the perimeter. When he gets behind and a defender gets his hands into him before he does the rusher uses the edge and Colon's push to get around him.

As far as AQ, I could see him being successful at this level. I'm a PSU fan so I have seen him play alot. He rarely gave up ground in a bull rush and is very good in space on the LB level. I would say he compares to Mack in this aspect. A pain in you butt. Like a bug that won't go away. As far as tenacity, I would say he compares more to Unger. Not as nasty or physically imposing as Wood or Mack but just a guy that understands technique, leverage, and angles. AQ & Legursky both have the abilty to start at some point for the Steelers. Both of them will have to be "technicians" in this league and constantly working on each play. They have some limitations physically but can make up for it in their technique. They are both best described as "lunch pail guys" and they will have to work hard to stay at a high level because they don't have the physical size to bail them out when they loose their indvidual battle.

I enjoyed this analysis. I hope you will continue to provide this kind of insight into our OL play throughout the coming season.

I will do what I can to provide any "dirt from the trenches".

[True Fan]

If there is any spot on the OL where you could use short arms to your advantage it is at C. When a DL gets a jump and gets into your body before the C punches after the snap...A C with short arms can use his upper body strength to gain seperation and get a "stale mate" in the bull rush. Evidence to this fact is in the bench. Short arm players tend to do more reps in the bench than longer arm players. When a C with long arms gets caught with a DL in his chest before he can punch after the snap...He tends to get pushed back and bent backward. Just see Hartwig on the safety @ the SB. From experience, a technician can overcome this handicap if he stays on the interior. It requires development of an "armbar" technique used to knock down the DL arms when he tries to get into your body before you get in your punch. If you have quick hands and good feet you could minimize this handicap in the interior. On the edge in space it becomes a little more of a problem because the defender can use the outside edge to his advantage. You would need elite feet on the outside to survive with short arms and that doesn't happen very often. This is one aspect Colon struggles with in his game. Colon can't aford a false set on the perimeter. When he gets behind and a defender gets his hands into him before he does the rusher uses the edge and Colon's push to get around him.

As far as AQ, I could see him being successful at this level. I'm a PSU fan so I have seen him play alot. He rarely gave up ground in a bull rush and is very good in space on the LB level. I would say he compares to Mack in this aspect. A pain in you butt. Like a bug that won't go away. As far as tenacity, I would say he compares more to Unger. Not as nasty or physically imposing as Wood or Mack but just a guy that understands technique, leverage, and angles. AQ & Legursky both have the abilty to start at some point for the Steelers. Both of them will have to be "technicians" in this league and constantly working on each play. They have some limitations physically but can make up for it in their technique. They are both best described as "lunch pail guys" and they will have to work hard to stay at a high level because they don't have the physical size to bail them out when they loose their indvidual battle.

thanks for the read. what worries me tho is that not only did 31 other teams pass over shipley altogether, the steelers themselves waited to the last possible moment to take him.

[JUST-PLAIN-NASTY]

[quote=True Fan]

If there is any spot on the OL where you could use short arms to your advantage it is at C. When a DL gets a jump and gets into your body before the C punches after the snap...A C with short arms can use his upper body strength to gain seperation and get a "stale mate" in the bull rush. Evidence to this fact is in the bench. Short arm players tend to do more reps in the bench than longer arm players. When a C with long arms gets caught with a DL in his chest before he can punch after the snap...He tends to get pushed back and bent backward. Just see Hartwig on the safety @ the SB. From experience, a technician can overcome this handicap if he stays on the interior. It requires development of an "armbar" technique used to knock down the DL arms when he tries to get into your body before you get in your punch. If you have quick hands and good feet you could minimize this handicap in the interior. On the edge in space it becomes a little more of a problem because the defender can use the outside edge to his advantage. You would need elite feet on the outside to survive with short arms and that doesn't happen very often. This is one aspect Colon struggles with in his game. Colon can't aford a false set on the perimeter. When he gets behind and a defender gets his hands into him before he does the rusher uses the edge and Colon's push to get around him.

As far as AQ, I could see him being successful at this level. I'm a PSU fan so I have seen him play alot. He rarely gave up ground in a bull rush and is very good in space on the LB level. I would say he compares to Mack in this aspect. A pain in you butt. Like a bug that won't go away. As far as tenacity, I would say he compares more to Unger. Not as nasty or physically imposing as Wood or Mack but just a guy that understands technique, leverage, and angles. AQ & Legursky both have the abilty to start at some point for the Steelers. Both of them will have to be "technicians" in this league and constantly working on each play. They have some limitations physically but can make up for it in their technique. They are both best described as "lunch pail guys" and they will have to work hard to stay at a high level because they don't have the physical size to bail them out when they loose their indvidual battle.

thanks for the read. what worries me tho is that not only did 31 other teams pass over shipley altogether, the steelers themselves waited to the last possible moment to take him.[/quote:16oaqswi]
Like another poster said many teams filled their C need earlier. That was one reason. The other reason is Shipley is most likely a one position OL. I'm sure he could play G in an emergency but from a draft standpoint he is looked at as a C. When you dress 45 and you have one on the 53 who plays 1 position he can get passed over. It happened to Legursky last year and he ended up undrafted. If you remember, Hank Fraley started here as an UDFA. It is one of those positions that if you are not at the top you could slide out of the draft based upon team needs that year. FB, C, TE, & S always have late round value because teams grade these positions lower and it isn't uncommon to get a top 5 player at that position in the later rounds. Just look at some drafts for example. You could get a 1st round where it goes to the 5th & 6th OT before the best interior lineman comes off the board. There are some drafts where the best C doesn't come off the board until round 2 or 3. I could see why Shipley went where he did. I just hope that in 3 years we all can't believe he went where he did. He is a no risk pick and might even be able to sit on the PS for a year. If he could LS he might find a spot this year. He is just a "wait & see" prospect for us to talk about for the next 2 years. If the experts were right, no bid deal. If the experts were wrong, we got a great deal!

[ikestops85]

thanks for the read. what worries me tho is that not only did 31 other teams pass over shipley altogether, the steelers themselves waited to the last possible moment to take him.

The same could be said about Tom Brady. I think the problem is the scouts put so much emphasis on measureables but they haven't been able to measure 'heart' or 'football intelligence'. Some players just figure out how to get it done no matter what level (HS, College, or Pro) they play at. I personally feel Ben is that type of player. He doesn't have the strongest arm, he's not the most accurate, he's not the most athletically gifted, and he's not the smartest. He is, however, one of the best in the league at his position. Shipley seems to be in that mold but only time will tell.