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Thread: Hindsight is always 20/20, but...

  1. #11
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    Re: Hindsight is always 20/20, but...

    Quote Originally Posted by SidSmythe
    Mangold was my man.
    Staley would have been good trade down material.

    w/ Mangold and Staley, Faneca wouldn't haven't have been as important. No way do we franchise him.
    Then do ya think the Steelers would have gone after a G instead of Sweed in the second last year? Not that that wouldn't have been a bad idea anyway. That probably would have happened if they already had Mangold and Staley in place.

    Quote Originally Posted by NKySteeler
    ....Everyone can gripe and complain as to the current situation of our O-line, and I'll be first in line... But nothing is gonna change... Let me re-interate for you all.... NOTHING IS GONNA CHANGE anytime soon... Do you think we'll pick up a few FAs' ?..... Yea, right, put down the pipe if you think so.... It will take several years before we can rebuild the O-line back to the status level that we are accustomed to.... Until then, we are relegated to simply complaining about it.
    If the Steelers would have conducted the drafts that brought Holmes and Timmons with the idea that the OL had a priority, then it would have taken three years worth of 1st and 2nd Round draft picks(half of those picks) just to adequately revamp the line w/o FA. Bearing in mind, of course, that the Mangold acquisition nullifies the need for Mahan and Hartwig.

    I'm with you when you say nothing will change anytime soon. Basically, if you take buckeyehoppy's draft logic, it would have taken three years anyway w/o FA. But "several years" isn't a luxury a team has if they want to be in the playoff mix from year to year. If the Steelers want to do it w/ no FA acquisitions, then it will probably take a minimum of three first day OL picks the next 3 years, pretty much ignoring every other need to reconstruct the line.

    That's a heavy price to pay. And I'm not so sure that Colbert is anywhere near capable enough in talent evaluation to score an OL trifecta like that.

    You're right. There are no easy answers. But the OL as it is presently constituted is unacceptable and needs to be dismantled. The only wildcard in that equation is when Ariens and Zierlein get the ax, do the replacements change enough of the playbook to streamline the operation to get the most out of the talent on hand? If that's the case, then the surgery gets a little less radical and the options improve for the rest of the team.
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  2. #12
    Big Kahuna Burgher
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    Re: Hindsight is always 20/20, but...

    Quote Originally Posted by buckeyehoppy
    ...if the Steelers take Mangold instead of Holmes.

    ...if the Steelers take Staley instead of Timmons.

    ...if the Steelers franchise Faneca instead of Max Sucks. Then...

    The left side of your OL would have been set this season. And C and LT would have been set as well beyond this year. Then, even if they had to trade up to get Duke Robinson, they could have done so w/o too much pain.
    Staley? The left side would be set with him? Last I checked, he has given up more sacks at LT
    than anyone else in the NFL over the past 2 seasons at LT.

  3. #13
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    Re: Hindsight is always 20/20, but...

    Quote Originally Posted by Big Kahuna Burgher
    Quote Originally Posted by buckeyehoppy
    ...if the Steelers take Mangold instead of Holmes.

    ...if the Steelers take Staley instead of Timmons.

    ...if the Steelers franchise Faneca instead of Max Sucks. Then...

    The left side of your OL would have been set this season. And C and LT would have been set as well beyond this year. Then, even if they had to trade up to get Duke Robinson, they could have done so w/o too much pain.
    Staley? The left side would be set with him? Last I checked, he has given up more sacks at LT
    than anyone else in the NFL over the past 2 seasons at LT.
    OTOH, does he play the last 33 games at LT for the Steelers? Marvel was healthy most of last season and did play the first month of this year. At very least, he probably would have started at RT with the option of him spelling Marvel at LT. His role probably would have been quite different here than in SF. He would have had the luxury to apprentice at LT while playing RT. In SF, he started at LT right out of the box.
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  4. #14
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    Re: Hindsight is always 20/20, but...

    While I think the OL had a role in that sack
    What the hell do you mean OL has some blame.
    Kemo was in FN loddy doody fart on the brain land.
    Rewatch it, he was setting up for a screen.
    Kemo has totally blown it more than a few times this year.
    On the Parker TD run the announcers were blithering idiots in saying what a block Kemo threw.
    Rewatch it, he stumbled and barely hit the defender.
    Our OL problems are with Kemo and Colon.

  5. #15
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    Re: Hindsight is always 20/20, but...

    Look at it this way -- Marvell is probably gone.

    We MUST do one of the following:
    - resign Starks to a longer term deal
    - sign another quality, FA to play LT.
    - in the unlikely event Marvel is not gone, resign to a 1 year min deal


    We can't go into next year with Colon at RT and Hills at LT? Or chance a rookie?

    They will (probably) let Kemo go and go w/ Simmons/Stapleton at G.

    And draft another G.

    We aren't going to sign anyone from the outside for big$$ until/unless we resign James Harrison and other key FA that we want to keep. Just they way we work.
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  6. #16
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    Re: Hindsight is always 20/20, but...

    Hindsight is always 20/20, but...I'm sure Colbert's offensive line plan seemed like a good idea at the time.

    Place the blame where it belongs...Colbert drafted - or not drafted - the players, Colbert hired both the OC & O-Line coaches, & Colbert signed - or not - the veteran players to contracts that put the team into this predicament. Face it Colbert FFFFF'd this one up with shoddy drafting, poor contract negotiation, & forgetting how this team succeeds. He hired coaching personnel that was coaching a style not suited to the type of player he'd been acquiring & neglected bringing in real talent in the hopes of finding "bargains". The only reprieve he may get (other than Max playing WAY above his head at LT) is that hopefully Simmons will retire & that way his contract won't hurt as much against the cap as it would if he were cut & that money could be targeted for use with a premium FA talent...

    Nahhh, that would make too much sense.
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  7. #17
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    Re: Hindsight is always 20/20, but...

    [quote=stlrz d]
    Quote Originally Posted by NKySteeler
    Quote Originally Posted by "stlrz d":a8wmso1f
    He didn't like the zone blocking scheme either.
    I didn't realize he confided in you as to his dislike for the blocking scheme....

    ....Everyone can gripe and complain as to the current situation of our O-line, and I'll be first in line... But nothing is gonna change... Let me re-interate for you all.... NOTHING IS GONNA CHANGE anytime soon... Do you think we'll pick up a few FAs' ?..... Yea, right, put down the pipe if you think so.... It will take several years before we can rebuild the O-line back to the status level that we are accustomed to.... Until then, we are relegated to simply complaining about it.
    After he went to the Jets someone here posted a story in which some of the Steelers O linemen stated he didn't like the ZBS, and that actually he was kind of a disruption.

    I've never met the dude. :P[/quote:a8wmso1f]

    This is correct...I think it was written in a P-G article. It almost hinted of AF sabotaging the planned change in blocking schemes and the other players said as much. When I read this I lost some of the respect I had for him as a Steeler. Take the high road and just leave.

  8. #18

    Re: Hindsight is always 20/20, but...

    Quote Originally Posted by NorthCoast
    This is correct...I think it was written in a P-G article. It almost hinted of AF sabotaging the planned change in blocking schemes and the other players said as much. When I read this I lost some of the respect I had for him as a Steeler. Take the high road and just leave.
    If he sabotaged the planned changes in blocking schemes, he must have done a really good job. Despite getting rid of Faneca and Mahan the O-line is still struggling with blocking.
    Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity

  9. #19
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    Re: Hindsight is always 20/20, but...

    Quote Originally Posted by Steel Life
    Hindsight is always 20/20, but...I'm sure Colbert's offensive line plan seemed like a good idea at the time.

    Place the blame where it belongs...Colbert drafted - or not drafted - the players, Colbert hired both the OC & O-Line coaches, & Colbert signed - or not - the veteran players to contracts that put the team into this predicament. Face it Colbert FFFFF'd this one up with shoddy drafting, poor contract negotiation, & forgetting how this team succeeds. He hired coaching personnel that was coaching a style not suited to the type of player he'd been acquiring & neglected bringing in real talent in the hopes of finding "bargains". The only reprieve he may get (other than Max playing WAY above his head at LT) is that hopefully Simmons will retire & that way his contract won't hurt as much against the cap as it would if he were cut & that money could be targeted for use with a premium FA talent...

    Nahhh, that would make too much sense.
    While Colbert was in charge of draft decisions and free agent acquisitions (with input from the scouts and coaches as well, of course), a GM is not responsible for assembling a coaching staff. The head coach decides what assistant coaches are hired and fired.

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