I don't get it, like we have a choice?

[Jooser]

Well, all I can say is that whoever is the OC won't matter too damn much if the OL continues it's poor performance. Ben won't make til season's end at the rate he's taking hits. Some of this pressure was getting to him in a second or two and he had no chance to do anything. We finally played a quality team and our posers on the OL were exposed. I am scratching my head here for answers and maybe more will be clear tomorrow. It was a sucky performance, but all is not lost...yet. I know I'll take alot of heat for this as I did earlier today when I mentioned it, but I believe Ben was not only beaten up physically, but mentally as well. I think that putting BL in a little earlier may have paid off a little. When he came in, he moved the ball because he wasn't dazed and confused. That's not to say I advocate BL over Ben, I'm not going there, I'm just saying that Ben looked like he needed a break. It was a brutal game and Byron's fresh arm and bruise-less body may have made a small difference.

[SanAntonioSteelerFan]

SA, I have never been an Arians fan, and I've taken heat for it... Obviously we can not do anything about it during the season. It is an issue that needs to be addressed during the off-season by the powers-that-be... I was hoping it would have been done last year, but so be it.

...Yes, I think he cannot adjust when needed. Yes, I think he cannot take us where we want to be... But he is the OC this season, and nothing will change that. You cannot "fire" him during the season... So we must work with what we have, and try to turn it to an advantage in some way... So... What do you do? That's the golden question... I would not hazard to guess at this point, because it will just get tougher with our schedule... We have the playmakers on this squad to get it done, we just need to find out how...

All we need is for you to get Ariens email address ...
So many things went so wrong at one time with our Offense, I actually have no idea what the top one or two things were.
- Were we just manhandled/beaten 1 on 1 in the trenches?
- Were the players confused by inspired defensive play calling?
- Could different plays have made a difference - screens, quick slants, etc.?

My feeling is that it didn't matter what plays would have been called - with Ben being sacked almost before the snap was comfortably in his hand, what can he do? This is by no means a defense of Ariens, but those guys were in our faces so much ...

I hope that after film study, the coaches can identify some things that are fixable. And if there is an assistant who can step up and take at least Zierlein's place, may as well try that. Who is that guy Harold Goodwin on the coaching staff - "Quality Control - Offense"?

I look back at how Tom Brady and the Cheatriots*** dismantled our zone blitz schemes a few years back by running a spread with very quick passes to the outside, or quick slants, or TE short passes just behind the box. The Cheats*** strategy dictated the game.

The Eagles consistly had 8 in the box and blitzed 6 or 7. Our O-liine did not know who was coming, or where the zone blitz would overload and they were confused ... and they had to give Ben 4 or 5 seconds for Arians' pass offense to have a chance to work. Brady's throws were out in 1 to 2 seconds, and it broke our zone blitz 8-in-the-box scheme very effedtively.

The routes om Arians' scheme take several seconds to develop. The Eagles zone blitz scheme was very effective against this, obviously. We had no answer, and they dictated the game.

All we need is for you to get Arien's email address ...

[DukieBoy]

Well, this is a league full of imitators, and we can expect we will see a simliar defensive scheme as the Eagles used from the Felons next week and the Jagovs after that, and we'll be 2-3 going into the bye week if we don't figure out how to defeat it.

[RuthlessBurgher]

I think after the season, they should interview Jim Bates' son Jeremy for the O.C. position. He is was the WR/QB coach for the Broncos last year when Brandon Marshall broke out. His is now the QB coach and primarily playcaller this year, when Jay Cutler has been breaking out. He worked on the same staff as Tomlin in Tampa. He is only 32 years old.

From denverbroncos.com:

Jeremy Bates enters his third season on the Denver Broncos’ coaching staff in 2008 and serves as the club’s quarterbacks coach. Bates, who was Denver’s wide receivers/quarterbacks coach last season, owns six years of coaching experience in the NFL and worked with the New York Jets (2005) and Tampa Bay Buccaneers (2002-04) before joining the Broncos in 2006.

Bates was a key part of the Broncos’ offensive staff in 2007 as their wide receivers/quarterbacks coach, helping the offense rank fourth in the league in yards per play (5.7). A pair of second-year players flourished while working with Bates as Brandon Marshall totaled the third-most receptions (102 for 1,325 yds.) by a second-year player in NFL history and Jay Cutler posted the third-best completion percentage (63.6) for a season in Denver annals.

In his first year with the Broncos during the 2006 season, Bates was an offensive assistant and worked with Offensive Coordinator Rick Dennison in coaching the offensive line. The Broncos were one of only three teams in the NFL to have two running backs post at least 670 rushing yards with Tatum Bell (1,025 yds.) and undrafted rookie Mike Bell (677 yds.) both enjoying productive seasons.

As quarterbacks coach for the Jets in 2005, Bates instructed a unit that was forced to use five different passers because of injuries. Despite the adversity, New York’s quarterbacks helped the club improve toward the end of the year with firstyear starter Brooks Bollinger posting an 87.7 passer rating and leading the team to a 2-2 record in its final four games.

Bates, 32, was promoted to assistant quarterbacks coach for the Buccaneers in 2004 and worked closely with Head Coach Jon Gruden and Quarterbacks Coach John Shoop in the instruction and preparation of the team’s passers. In that capacity, Bates helped Brian Griese lead the NFL in completion percentage (69.3) in 2004 and set Buccaneers single-season records in that category along with passer rating (97.5) and yards per passing attempt (7.83).

Bates began his coaching career with Tampa Bay as an offensive quality control coach from 2002-03. Tampa Bay’s offense in 2003 was arguably the most productive in franchise history as Bates assisted a unit that set single-season records in total offense (340.8 ypg.) and passing offense (237.8 ypg.). In addition, the club ranked among the league’s top 10 in both categories in the same year for just the second time in Buccaneers annals.

In his first season in the NFL’s coaching ranks, Bates worked with a Buccaneers offense in 2002 that was pivotal in the franchise winning its first-ever World Championship with a victory over the Oakland Raiders in Super Bowl XXXVII. Tampa Bay’s offense was particularly dominant in the postseason, averaging 35.3 points and 334.0 yards per game in three playoff contests that year.

Bates, who attended Sevier County High School in Sevierville, Tenn., began his collegiate playing career as a quarterback at the University of Tennessee in 1995. He transferred to Rice University, where he was a two-year letterman in football from 1996-99 and was a second baseman on the school’s baseball team.

Bates’ father, Jim, is in his first season as the Broncos’ assistant head coach/defense. His brother, James, was a linebacker and defensive captain on the University of Florida’s 1996 national championship team and does television play-by-play for the Mountain West Sports Network.

Jeremy Bates was born Aug. 27, 1976, in Manhattan, Kan.

[Oviedo]

Lots of talk about firing Ariens and Zierlein - what do we do then? Can you just go out and "get" coaches? Or are you guys saying their assignments should be picked up by coaches already on staff?

Don't you know. There is an online roster of qualified NFL coaches with money back guarantees that they will be successfull. Most post at the Trib site routinely, but you can contact a few of them here.

[ikestops85]

SA, I have never been an Arians fan, and I've taken heat for it... Obviously we can not do anything about it during the season. It is an issue that needs to be addressed during the off-season by the powers-that-be... I was hoping it would have been done last year, but so be it.

...Yes, I think he cannot adjust when needed. Yes, I think he cannot take us where we want to be... But he is the OC this season, and nothing will change that. You cannot "fire" him during the season... So we must work with what we have, and try to turn it to an advantage in some way... So... What do you do? That's the golden question... I would not hazard to guess at this point, because it will just get tougher with our schedule... We have the playmakers on this squad to get it done, we just need to find out how...

So many things went so wrong at one time with our Offense, I actually have no idea what the top one or two things were.
- Were we just manhandled/beaten 1 on 1 in the trenches?
- Were the players confused by inspired defensive play calling?
- Could different plays have made a difference - screens, quick slants, etc.?

My feeling is that it didn't matter what plays would have been called - with Ben being sacked almost before the snap was comfortably in his hand, what can he do? This is by no means a defense of Ariens, but those guys were in our faces so much ...

I hope that after film study, the coaches can identify some things that are fixable. And if there is an assistant who can step up and take at least Zierlein's place, may as well try that. Who is that guy Harold Goodwin on the coaching staff - "Quality Control - Offense"?

I look back at how Tom Brady and the Cheatriots*** dismantled our zone blitz schemes a few years back by running a spread with very quick passes to the outside, or quick slants, or TE short passes just behind the box. The Cheats*** strategy dictated the game.

The Eagles consistly had 8 in the box and blitzed 6 or 7. Our O-liine did not know who was coming, or where the zone blitz would overload and they were confused ... and they had to give Ben 4 or 5 seconds for Arians' pass offense to have a chance to work. Brady's throws were out in 1 to 2 seconds, and it broke our zone blitz 8-in-the-box scheme very effedtively.

The routes om Arians' scheme take several seconds to develop. The Eagles zone blitz scheme was very effective against this, obviously. We had no answer, and they dictated the game.

I don't think the spread would have worked well. There is a big difference between the defense the steelers employ and what the iggles used. We generally play a zone with the corners playing soft. That is why the *'s could use those quick throws to the outside and pick up 6-8 yards consistently. The iggles were man up on us and pressing on the inside and outside. It seemed that Ben had trouble figuring out who they were sending so he couldn't hit a hot receiver as fast as needed to. Not that many QBs could have since most plays resulted in at least 1 rusher coming in free and clear.

What is so disappointing is that this isn't a new scheme employed by Philly. They've been running this type of D since Johnson was there so I don't understand why we were so unprepared. That falls squarely on BA in my book. While he seems to design some innovative plays he doesn't seem to know when to call them.

[AngryAsian]

Lots of talk about firing Ariens and Zierlein - what do we do then? Can you just go out and "get" coaches? Or are you guys saying their assignments should be picked up by coaches already on staff?

Don't you know. There is an online roster of qualified NFL coaches with money back guarantees that they will be successfull. Most post at the Trib site routinely, but you can contact a few of them here.

Venting their frustrations on this board with the horrid play calling yesterday is just coping mechanisms in flux after a pathetic team performance. No one is saying that the season is over, but I gather most are fed up with consistently rotten offensive showing when we've played top tiered teams since Arians has been the play caller. O, when you look at the talent on this offense how can we turn in a performance like yesterday. Instead of dictating the tempo, we were waiting for what the defense was willing to give us. That in itself is a game plan for a loss. We should be setting the pace no the other way around.

Ruthless brought up the Broncos... Look at how many points their offense has generated in just 3 games. Do they have a ProBowl 1200+ running back to feature? Do they have a ProBowl QB with an SB under his belt and a ridiculous winning percentage since joining the league? With the exception of Brandon Marshall, is their receiving corps that much more talented and deep as ours? Their OL is significantly lighter, and yet their are no all pros on that line.... how are they able to win the battles in the trenches?

Coaching and play calling are the differences..... and I guess most are frustrated because we haven't ever been this deep or talented since the golden years of the 70s... at least on the offensive side of the ball. Just the QB position alone merits haste with regards to winning. The offseason needs to have changes in the OC and OLC positions if this team is going to seriously compete. I can't see us marching to the apex of the NFL mountain with the likes of Bruce Arians and Larry Zeirlein.

[Steeler Mafia]

Are there any offensive coaches capable or ready to take over as OC?

I am sure if we comb the high schools and pee wee leagues, we can find a better OC that Bruce (Captain Nutbutter) Arians.

Hell, I would take the Madden 08 champion over this moron.