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Thread: Sporting News Ranks QBs

  1. #41
    Hall of Famer ikestops85's Avatar
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    Re: Sporting News Ranks QBs

    Quote Originally Posted by Jom112
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Smartmonies
    [The Season was over. They sat out half their teamlast 3 games. The lost 3 out
    4 to close the season. Find me a few teams that made the playoffs starting 0-4.
    YOur season is cooked at that point. its common sense.
    The point that you're missing is that at 0-4 your season is not over. There is still something to play for and you shouldn't give up. The Saints didn't and they came close to catching Tampa in the second half of the season. The statement that Brees had nothing to play was just made to support your argument not because it's a valid statement.

    Also the Chargers did it back in the 90's. It's not a common occurrence but it can be done and has been done, which is why you don't give up. I figured a Steelers fan would understand that (*cough* 2005 *cough*)...
    I also figured a Steelers fan would understand that (*cough* 1976 *cough*). It seems a Steeler team started out 1-4 and ended up doing pretty well for the year.
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  2. #42

    Re: Sporting News Ranks QBs

    Quote Originally Posted by steelblood
    Quote Originally Posted by stlrz d
    Quote Originally Posted by steelblood
    Carson Palmer is pretty good. He doesn't have anywhere near Ben's mobility, but he is a very accurate passer and throws a beautiful deep ball. I'm not sure why everyone is always so shocked and offended to see him rated above Ben. If Ben outshines Palmer again this year, writers will begin to come around.
    Because Palmer has exactly zero post season wins.
    But, to be fair, this is because Palmer plays on a team with a horrendous defense more than anything else. They are both good. Why get your lather up over these writers and their rankings?
    Palmer ranked 18th in the NFL last year in 3rd down passing.

    At week 9, he was 2nd to last on third down and 4th QTR passing.

    While Ben averaged 11 YPA at 67% completion percentage on 3rd 8-10. Palmer
    could only average 6 YPA at like 59%. The difference is absolutely huge. And this difference has nothing to do with the Steelers having Casey hampton and the Bengals not having him/ There were 5 games the bengals lost that could have easily been won if it were for better 3rd down and 4th QTR passing. And its not like Palmer lacks weapons.

    The truth is that in 2005 the Bengals too k the NFL by storm. They caught everyone by surprise and no one new how to deal with their offense. This is not the first time nor will it be the last time a new high powered offense exposes the league for a season. You don't need to look to far back and see a Browns team that caught everyone off guard with their high wire act. (well I kind of wasn't caught offguard. http://discuss.pittsburghlive.com/viewt ... 64#1639964

    But you see my point. The Saints were another team that offensively came out of nowhere with a high flying offense. They were studied in the off season and then things the following season "just didn't seem to go right."

    bottom line is that the Bengals offense took the league by storm 2 years ago, and
    have not been able to muster any sort of repeat performance. Not even close!
    it would not be fair to criticize Palmer for not having a SB ring. His team has not been good enough. But his offense has been plenty talented over the past 4 years. If you go back to the end of 2006, he needed to win 1 out of the last 3 games tomakethe playoffs.
    After losing the first two, he simply needed to beat the Steelers at home to make it in.
    The steelers were just coming off a beating by the Baltimore ravens. They had no playoff hopes what so ever. Palmer had the perfect opportunity to BURY the steelers right then and there and get his team to the playoffs. Yet it didn't happen. Palmer should have lit the steelers up early and often and the game should not have been close. yet his offense, at home , couldn't muster more than 3 points for the first 3 QTR's of the game. We going to blame the Bengals defense for this game as well? Those losses at the end of that 2006 season , were telling. You just can't let those opportunities slip away. And he followed that up with perhaps his worst season ever as a starter.

  3. #43

    Re: Sporting News Ranks QBs

    [quote=Jom112]
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Smartmonies
    Quote Originally Posted by Jom112
    Quote Originally Posted by "Mr Smartmonies":25ld56jy
    Also Tampa finished 9-7. I remember the Lions getting off to a fast start as well last season only to stumble as usual. An 0-4 start is something that can be overcome in the NFC...
    The Season was over. They sat out half their teamlast 3 games. The lost 3 out
    4 to close the season. Find me a few teams that made the playoffs starting 0-4.
    YOur season is cooked at that point. its common sense.
    The point that you're missing is that at 0-4 your season is not over. There is still something to play for and you shouldn't give up. The Saints didn't and they came close to catching Tampa in the second half of the season. ...[/quote:25ld56jy]

    Brees Averaged a meager 5.8 Yards per Attempt and threw 3 interceptions in his last two games. If the saints had any kind of chance to catch the bucs, he wasn't helping the Cause.

  4. #44
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    Re: Sporting News Ranks QBs

    [quote=Mr Smartmonies][quote=Jom112]
    Quote Originally Posted by "Mr Smartmonies":28ohsmzd
    Quote Originally Posted by Jom112
    Quote Originally Posted by "Mr Smartmonies":28ohsmzd
    Also Tampa finished 9-7. I remember the Lions getting off to a fast start as well last season only to stumble as usual. An 0-4 start is something that can be overcome in the NFC...
    The Season was over. They sat out half their teamlast 3 games. The lost 3 out
    4 to close the season. Find me a few teams that made the playoffs starting 0-4.
    YOur season is cooked at that point. its common sense.
    The point that you're missing is that at 0-4 your season is not over. There is still something to play for and you shouldn't give up. The Saints didn't and they came close to catching Tampa in the second half of the season. ...[/quote:28ohsmzd]

    Brees Averaged a meager 5.8 Yards per Attempt and threw 3 interceptions in his last two games. If the saints had any kind of chance to catch the bucs, he wasn't helping the Cause. [/quote:28ohsmzd]

    Hence, why I said Ben is definitely a better QB than Brees. That still doesn't validate your statement that Brees had nothing to play for after week 4.

    Your a smart guy MSM, but you need to learn how to give in sometimes when you make an inaccurate statement. Instead of digging in and just throwing around stats...

  5. #45

    Re: Sporting News Ranks QBs

    Jon, I am going to repost my original thoughts below. The post was about the Saints struggles a year ago. The first 4 games set the tone for the entire season .They dug a grave that , to my knowledge, few teams if any have ever dug themselves out of.
    But thepoint of these thoughts were not intended to get us caught up in discussing
    th amount of effort that Drew Brees should put forth from game 5 on. The thoughts were to shed light on the Many struggles of the New orleans saints in 2007. I will edit my last statement so that you don't hung up on little stuff.

    Week 1 Saints Lose to Colts
    Our inability to convert third downs and keep the ball hurt us," said sean Payton. (Brees also had 2 interceptions)

    Manning = 9.6 Yards per attempt
    Brees = 4.7 Yards Per Attempt

    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    week 2 Saints LOSe to Bucs

    The Saints had some success moving the ball on the ground early."I think we have the ability to be a very good offense. One of the best, if not the best, in the league. Unfortunately we're not playing like it right now," said Drew Brees.

    Box score

    Saints 0 , 0 , 7, 7, (Zero 1st half points by the offense)

    Brees 1 interception

    Jeff Garcia = 15.2 Yards per attempt
    Drew Brees = 5.3 Yards per attempt
    --------------------------------------------------------

    Week 3 Saints Lose to Titans

    Drew Brees who had another miserable game, he had five turnovers. Brees now has just 1 TD pass versus 7 Interceptions on the season.

    Vince Young = 7.2 Yards per Attempt
    Drew Brees = 4.7 Yards per Attempt

    ---------------------------------------------------------------
    WEEK 4 BYE
    ----------------------------------------------------------------

    Week 5 Saints lose to Panthers

    If we continue to make the dumb mistakes, then it's hard for the result to change," said Saints coach Sean Payton. In a tightly contested affair, the Saints only could muster 6 first half points. They also failed to score in the 4th Quarter.

    David Carr = 7.8 Yards per Attempt
    Drew Brees = 5.4 Yards per attempt (2 more interceptions)
    ---------------------------------------------------------------

    Saints Begin season 0-4, a typical graveyard start for playoff hopeful teams.

  6. #46

    Re: Sporting News Ranks QBs

    No stats from me, but I got a kick out of the guy who said the Steelers would take Eli Manning straight up for Ben in a heartbeat.

  7. #47
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    Re: Sporting News Ranks QBs

    Quote Originally Posted by proudpittsburgher
    No stats from me, but I got a kick out of the guy who said the Steelers would take Eli Manning straight up for Ben in a heartbeat.
    I'm always amazed by how little credit Ben gets for what he's done. On a Ravens board I frequent someone started a most over rated of all time and there wasn't any mention of Ben...eventually someone asked why and others chimed in that no one really thinks much of him, he's not good enough to be over rated, blah blah blah.

    It's ok Ratstains fans...just keep disregarding him.

  8. #48
    Hall of Famer ikestops85's Avatar
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    Re: Sporting News Ranks QBs

    Quote Originally Posted by stlrz d
    Quote Originally Posted by proudpittsburgher
    No stats from me, but I got a kick out of the guy who said the Steelers would take Eli Manning straight up for Ben in a heartbeat.
    I'm always amazed by how little credit Ben gets for what he's done. On a Ravens board I frequent someone started a most over rated of all time and there wasn't any mention of Ben...eventually someone asked why and others chimed in that no one really thinks much of him, he's not good enough to be over rated, blah blah blah.

    It's ok Ratstains fans...just keep disregarding him.
    They had the same thread over on a bengals board. Many there listed him as being the most over-rated. I just laugh.
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  9. #49

    Re: Sporting News Ranks QBs

    Quote Originally Posted by stlrz d
    Quote Originally Posted by proudpittsburgher
    No stats from me, but I got a kick out of the guy who said the Steelers would take Eli Manning straight up for Ben in a heartbeat.
    I'm always amazed by how little credit Ben gets for what he's done. :
    That's why I try my best to spread the word. The truth. Think about it. Peter King had
    Ben listed 17th last year while he had Kitna and Cutler at 9 & 10. what does that tell you? It tells me that a Hall of Fame Voter has effectively given Roethlisberger little or no credit at all for that Championship march in 2005, as well as the 1st two years over all.
    I have been proven statistically that Ben was the catalyst. He was the difference maker.
    But a hall of fame voter didn't even think he belonged in Kitna country. Ultimately, my life won't change one bit. But you could be looking at another great Pittsburgh Steeler that one day could be on the outside looking in at canton OHio. The book on Roethlisberger has been wrote by th media. He had nothing to do with the Steelers run first two years.

  10. #50
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    Re: Sporting News Ranks QBs

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Smartmonies

    That's why I try my best to spread the word. The truth. Think about it. Peter King had
    Ben listed 17th last year while he had Kitna and Cutler at 9 & 10. what does that tell you? It tells me that a Hall of Fame Voter has effectively given Roethlisberger little or no credit at all for that Championship march in 2005, as well as the 1st two years over all.
    I have been proven statistically that Ben was the catalyst. He was the difference maker.
    But a hall of fame voter didn't even think he belonged in Kitna country. Ultimately, my life won't change one bit. But you could be looking at another great Pittsburgh Steeler that one day could be on the outside looking in at canton OHio. The book on Roethlisberger has been wrote by th media. He had nothing to do with the Steelers run first two years.
    I would take whatever Peter King says with a grain of salt. The only bigger tool than him is Jason Whitlock.

    King has a hard on for Brady and the whole AFC East. I remember how he put Kerry Rhodes the safety for the Jets above Polamalu and Ed Reed. So it's not just a biased against Ben, he just has a biased period...

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